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To: DiogenesLamp

Exactly.

I can understand his feeling of shock at hearing a lot of this information. I, who graduated as a history major and who reads books and watches documentaries about history all the time, was similarly shocked when I learned about:

- the fact that the federal government got most of its money through tariffs which were paid overwhelmingly by the Southern states.

- the scale of federal expenditures for corporate subsidies and infrastructure projects which were spent overwhelmingly in the Northern states.

- the longstanding and bitter complaints by Southerners about this exploitation at the hands of the federal government for the benefit of the Northern states

- the fact that the North was perfectly willing to protect slavery - effectively forever - by express constitutional amendment if only the original 7 seceding states would return....which they refused.

- that slavery was ended just about nowhere else in the Western world (ie Europe and all their colonial possessions around the world) via a big bloody war. It was ended at about the same time, for the same reason (industrialization) and the usual method of ending slavery was via compensated emancipation.

The fact that I had gotten all the way through college as a history major and had never been taught this really opened my eyes to just how propagandized we are in America.

It was like watching the corporate media start attaching their tongues to Obama’s shorts in 2007 without even any pretense of balance, fairness, objectivity, etc and watching them just push the narrative of the day for the Democrat party on every single issue since then.

Once you see it, you can never unsee it.

Does it really shock anybody to hear that the history faculty....ie part of Academia....is just as massively biased and just as prone to pushing narratives, outright lying, and hiding the truth as the corporate media?

Once you know you’re being lied to and start looking for the truth yourself, you start finding it. The key is waking up to the fact that you’re being lied to in the first place. Many still haven’t woken up to that.


39 posted on 06/06/2023 3:57:15 AM PDT by FLT-bird
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To: FLT-bird; dayglored; DiogenesLamp; Republican Wildcat; Steely Tom; Nifster; x
FLT-bird: "the fact that the federal government got most of its money through tariffs which were paid overwhelmingly by the Southern states."

That is a flat-out lie, yes, believed and expressed by some Southerners before 1861, but it's laughably untrue.
In fact, Southerners paid virtually no tariffs.
Arguments which claim they did are convoluted and full of logical errors.

FLT-bird: "the scale of federal expenditures for corporate subsidies and infrastructure projects which were spent overwhelmingly in the Northern states."

Another flat-out lie, also often repeated by Southerners before 1861.
It is only remotely true if by "Northern states" you mean every state North of South Carolina.
In actual fact, Federal spending corresponded pretty well to populations and numbers of representatives from each region.

FLT-bird: "the longstanding and bitter complaints by Southerners about this exploitation at the hands of the federal government for the benefit of the Northern states"

Those are just more lies.
In fact, Southerners were never out of power before secession in 1861.
After the 1800 election, Southern Democratics controlled both houses of Congress and the Presidency almost continuously until 1861.
Even in those brief periods when Whigs won control, it was still Southern Whigs who called the shots -- Whig Presidents Harrison, Tyler and Taylor were all slaveholders.
The most influential Whig in Congress, Henry Clay, was a Southern slaveholder.

Some Southerners did complain bitterly about the 1828 "Tariff of Abominations", but it only passed due to the strong support of other Southerners like Andrew Jackson, Henry Clay and even, originally, the Vice President, SC's John C. Calhoun.
Indeed, a majority of New Englanders also voted against the 1828 Tariff, meaning, it was not an issue of "North vs. South".

So, in reality, Southerners were never out of power in Washington before secession in 1861.
What Southerners didn't like, they could prevent.

FLT-bird: "the fact that the North was perfectly willing to protect slavery - effectively forever - by express constitutional amendment if only the original 7 seceding states would return....which they refused."

No Republican in 1860 was willing to increase the US Constitution's implied protections for slavery.
Most Republicans even opposed the mildest Corwin Amendment.
But, as Lincoln said, Corwin did not increase protections for slavery, it only expressed directly what he understood the Constitution to already mean.
Nor was Corwin intended to win back Confederate slave states, but only to reassure Union Border Slave States that Washington would not pass laws against their slavery.

FLT-bird: "that slavery was ended just about nowhere else in the Western world (ie Europe and all their colonial possessions around the world) via a big bloody war.
It was ended at about the same time, for the same reason (industrialization) and the usual method of ending slavery was via compensated emancipation."

Even though our pro-Confederates delight in minimizing slavery's moral issues, the fact remains that all of our Founding Fathers, even the Southerners, recognized slavery as a moral wrong which should be gradually abolished.

Indeed, Thomas Jefferson not only supported abolition in the Northwest Territories and in international imports of slaves, he also proposed nationally compensated emancipation.
That proposal went nowhere because it was opposed by Southerners.

FLT-bird: "The fact that I had gotten all the way through college as a history major and had never been taught this really opened my eyes to just how propagandized we are in America."

Since all of that is just pro-Confederate propaganda lies, it's not surprising you didn't learn it in school.

FLT-bird: "It was like watching the corporate media start attaching their tongues to Obama’s shorts in 2007 without even any pretense of balance, fairness, objectivity, etc and watching them just push the narrative of the day for the Democrat party on every single issue since then."

Southern Democrats lied just as much in, say, 1860 as Democrats do today.
Democrats have always been the party of lies and liars.

FLT-bird: "Does it really shock anybody to hear that the history faculty....ie part of Academia....is just as massively biased and just as prone to pushing narratives, outright lying, and hiding the truth as the corporate media?"

Because they are Democrats, and Democrats are all about trying to sell you their Big Lies.
That was just as true in 1860 as it is today.

FLT-bird: "Once you know you’re being lied to and start looking for the truth yourself, you start finding it. The key is waking up to the fact that you’re being lied to in the first place. Many still haven’t woken up to that."

Once you've been brainwashed (or brainwashed yourself) with Democrat lies, it can be nearly impossible to break their hold on your mind, as posters like FLT-bird and DiogenesLamp amply demonstrate.

68 posted on 06/06/2023 8:55:37 AM PDT by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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To: FLT-bird
Once you see it, you can never unsee it.

This I have also learned. Additionally, I keep seeing new connections and insights into what was going on. I keep seeing parallels to the present day.

Modern illegal immigration is for the EXACT same reason as giving freed slaves the right to vote. It is to keep the liberal party in power. It is not about the welfare of the illegals or the former slaves, it is only about keeping the political power they have. It is that political power that is the source of their wealth, often from corruption as Joe Biden provides by way of example with his 5 million dollar bribe from Ukraine. (Today on Newsmax, Representative Comer said "Ukraine" was the source of the bribe.)

Does it really shock anybody to hear that the history faculty....ie part of Academia....is just as massively biased and just as prone to pushing narratives, outright lying, and hiding the truth as the corporate media?

It used to shock me. Now it shocks me when the tell the truth.

Once you know you’re being lied to and start looking for the truth yourself, you start finding it. The key is waking up to the fact that you’re being lied to in the first place.

Amen.

87 posted on 06/06/2023 9:46:29 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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