Posted on 10/22/2021 9:33:09 PM PDT by nickcarraway
Images of a distraught Alec Baldwin — who tragically killed a cinematographer with a movie prop gun — evoked memories of an actor who remained haunted for the rest of his life after fatally shooting Brandon Lee with a firearm he believed was loaded with blanks.
The 28-year-old son of martial arts icon and legendary screen star Bruce Lee was killed in a freak accident on the set of “The Crow” on March 30, 1993, when fellow actor Michael Massee was supposed to shoot him at close range with a harmless pistol.
But when Massee fired the .44 Magnum revolver, the gunpowder in the blank cartridge ignited a bullet fragment that became embedded in the barrel — propelling it into Lee’s body about 15 feet away at the Carolco Studios in Wilmington, North Carolina, the Sun reported.
(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...
My Dad and would fire a shotgun (into ground) as a New Years celebration. One year he was given reloads to try out. Exactly that happened. One failed to fire properly and the next blew the barrel up. It looked like a cartoon depiction, all flared out. I later found the end of the barrel, years later, when clearing brush quite a distance away. After that he only shot brass reloads he made himself. I’d never seen my dad so shook.
(SMH)
Wrong! No amount of "pressure," alone, will ignite gunpowder.
However, flaming gases will.
Regards,
I took over, and eventually shot a steel punch across the room. I learned "diesel" from that!
The story I heard about the Crow death was that in an earlier situation they bought ammo, removed the powder but not the primer, replaced the bullet and when fired the primer was just strong enough to push the round into the barrel where it remained until the blank firing sent it on its way.
the real question is not why there were real bullets in it, but why in HELL is it a real gun to begin with?
Two types of cartridges were used on the movie set for “The Crow”.
1. Blanks — powder, but no bullet
2. REduced carts — yes, there is a bullet, but the cart has only a partial load of powder. Just enough powder to “supposedly” push the bullet out of the barrel. Enough to get the special effect needed by the camera, but not enough to risk a ricochet.
The scheme on the “Crow” set was for a reduced round to be used in a wild gun fight to blow apart a vase across the room. The gun fight proceeded — lots of rounds (blanks) used by every damned fool thug in the room.
Apparently, no one noticed that the vase was untouched. I supposed everyone assumed that the shot went wild.
Next round in line (gun is revolver) was a blank — with a full load of powder.
However, the bullet did not get pushed out of the barrel as expected — it was lodged — sparing the vase. So, when the blank was fired (with gun pointed at actor) the bullet went into his chest.
Oops.
The mistake was not pausing the shoot between the first and 2nd round and assuring that the bullet was not lodged in the barrel. Low odds that this could happen, but large consequences on the bad assumption.
This might be the same sort of thing that happened on the “rust” set with Baldwin. But, if it did, the people in charge apparently didn’t learn anything from previous killing. Must have adopted the typical liberal viewpoint: “at this point, what does it matter?” AKA: history doesn’t matter.
**I believe he was decapidated.**
He and two children. I saw the unedited film years ago.
Maybe some lawyer told him not to apologize.
“Maybe some lawyer told him not to apologize.”
That’s very possible; I hadn’t thought of that.
That wouldn’t have happened if Tom selleck was on the set.
Many ‘prop guns’ cannot be made to chamber or fire real ammunition. These are what they should be using, rather than just blanks. This isn’t much of a problem if you have a common firearm, as there is most likely a ‘prop gun’ made for the type. It gets more difficult if you’re using period, or one-off firearms.
One beef I have with hollyweird and related media, is that if someone is seen carrying a firearm, it =will= be used during the course of the program.
Just once, I’d like to see an average joe in a flick that packs CC, and then never actually uses it. I carry every day. I’ve never fired my carry weapon except at a range or other safe, legal, place to do so.
I am the norm, yet you’d never know that from watching TV and movies.
“A colleague gave up on removing two stuck bullets from a barrel.
I took over, and eventually shot a steel punch across the room. I learned ‘diesel’ from that!” [Does so, post 24]
What type of firearm and what cartridge/bullet types?
I never learned the hot-air ignition threshold to bring on spontaneous combustion (”dieseling”) for nitro propellant (”smokeless powder”) nor for black powder. But the temperature for liquid petroleum fuels like gasoline and diesel fuel may be reachable during compression in home firearm repair - if the parts fit tightly enough, as they must in an internal combustion engine. Best to keep lubricants and solvents out of the mix. Though if temperatures rise above the point of incandescence, propellants themselves will ignite anyway.
Shooting out a stuck projectile is never a good idea. It pits a projectile mass weighing twice as much as that for a standard round against the propelling charge for a single bullet. Pressures can rise sharply; sometimes the barrel can burst, or the locking parts or breechblock can shatter. The cartridge case is commonly the weakest link and may rupture first, spraying incandescent gases and metal particles in unpredictable directions. One wants to be far away when that happens.
Inserting a heavy metal object in the bore (such as a punch) (either behind, or ahead of, the stuck bullet/bullets) and then trying to shoot out the obstruction is never a good idea, as it can only cause higher pressures - and thus greater risk.
In gun repair, our technique to remove stuck bullets was to employ a polished steel rod almost as large in diameter as the gun’s bore to knock out the bullets. The close fit prevented the rod from flexing when struck, and thus minimized damage to rifling.
Such rods were costly, but nowhere near the cost of damaging the rifling by hammering on an ill-fitting rod of the wrong material, or causing a ring by shooting. To say nothing of the safety risks.
Not all these shooting-out catastrophes will happen every time, but if one does it occurs with no warning. Humans cannot dodge the flying bits. Best to be prudent and cautious, given the consequences.
“...when the blank was fired (with gun pointed at actor) the bullet went into his chest.
Oops.
The mistake was not pausing the shoot between the first and 2nd round and assuring that the bullet was not lodged in the barrel...” [bobbo666, post 27]
You are correct in saying the outcome was unlikely.
All propelling powders are not created equal: neither nitro (smokeless) powder, nor black powder. Granule size and shape are varied to control burn rate and duration. Coatings are applied to slow combustion. Shapes such as flakes, disks, balls, spaghetti noodles, tubes, and cubes all exhibit different burning rates. They exist to meet the needs of deer hunters, shotgunners (upland and waterfowling), target pistol shooters, the military, and many more.
The differences are the foundation of a cardinal rule of reloading: never substitute a different powder for one used in the loading data. No increase in velocity nor accuracy is worth the risk.
Blanks are loaded with powders sans deterrent coatings, in shapes crafted to burn very quickly, to generate the “BANG” at low pressures. These speedy propellants have blown up a gun when tried, and will likely do so again if loaded behind a real bullet.
No blank - not even one charged with “normal” powder formulated to fire in live rounds - should ever be fired behind a bullet stuck part way down the bore. Doing so will often blow up the gun. It happens with black powder too.
Many theories have been put forward as to why it happens, but no one has isolated and confirmed a cause. One iron-clad rule of muzzle-loading is this: if a ball sticks part way home (not seated against the charge) during loading, do not attempt to shoot it out. Wet the charge and have it drilled out. The safety risks are too great otherwise.
--A FReeper, from years ago...
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