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To: Gnome1949

The CIA created an animation trying to explain the explosion and aftermath which animation showed the airliner CLIMB after the nose came off. What was the CIA doing in this investigation? The animation so defied the laws of physics as to be laughable to any scientist or engineer.

~~~

Why would a climb defy the ‘laws of physics’?

First off, if you severe the front of the aircraft, you are likely taking away all control of the flight surfaces of the aircraft, including those from autopilot? No? I don’t have an schematics handy. You tell me.

Secondly, even if all flight surfaces remained steady at the moment of separation, they would very likely not have nearly the level of aerodynamic augmentation characteristics that all the unpredictability that the irregular breakage point profile would present, let alone the fact that you now either have an open faced cylinder funneling wind at 400 knots, or a closed one cupping the air. So let’s just say that the forward fuselage broke and went down and back, and even if it pulled the rest of the craft downward, there could easily have been a large flap of metal bent downward acting just like leading slats would on a wing.

Third, all other things being equal, if you lose mass from the front of the aircraft, the balance is to the rear, which would cause you to rotate upward


146 posted on 07/14/2021 10:57:17 AM PDT by z3n
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To: z3n
Third, all other things being equal, if you lose mass from the front of the aircraft, the balance is to the rear, which would cause you to rotate upward

Hell, even flying level, losing a significant amount of weight would allow for rapid altitude gain. Back in 1957, a B-36 carrying a Mark 17 nuke dropped it a few miles southeast of Albuquerque. It was on approach to Kirtland AFB (an airport/field now shared jointly with the Albuquerque Sunport). It was flying at 1,600 feet and immediately gained 1,000 feet in altitude after the accidental release of the 42,000 lb bomb. The bomb actually broke through the closed bomb bay doors. The explosives blew things apart and killed a few cattle, left debris. But it didn't go boom cuz there was no firing mechanism for the nuclear part of the bomb.

https://luckypuppy.net/b-36-drops-nuke-on-albuquerque/

188 posted on 07/14/2021 12:55:05 PM PDT by IYAS9YAS (There are two kinds of people: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.)
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To: z3n

Excellent point. Well stated, sir.


211 posted on 07/14/2021 3:10:44 PM PDT by Hulka
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To: z3n; Gnome1949; Kaslin
The CIA created an animation trying to explain the explosion and aftermath which animation showed the airliner CLIMB after the nose came off. What was the CIA doing in this investigation? The animation so defied the laws of physics as to be laughable to any scientist or engineer.

~~

Why would a climb defy the ‘laws of physics’? First off, if you sever the front of the aircraft, you are likely taking away all control of the flight surfaces of the aircraft, including those from autopilot? No? I don’t have an schematics handy. You tell me. Secondly, even if all flight surfaces remained steady at the moment of separation, they would very likely not have nearly the level of aerodynamic augmentation characteristics that all the unpredictability that the irregular breakage point profile would present, let alone the fact that you now either have an open faced cylinder funneling wind at 400 knots, or a closed one cupping the air. So let’s just say that the forward fuselage broke and went down and back, and even if it pulled the rest of the craft downward, there could easily have been a large flap of metal bent downward acting just like leading slats would on a wing.

Zn3, your points are very well taken.

Boeing testified that the engines on a 747 are fly-by-wire and require a constant control signal from the cockpit. Without that signal the engines will automatically revert to idle. Break the wire from the cockpit and all of the engines immediately would go to idle. Idling engines are insufficient to overcome drag, much less accelerate for climb. There are two ways for a plane to climb: add more speed by increasing engine power thus increasing lift on the wing, or sacrificing forward momentum (speed) for altitude while changing the angle of motion through the air in an climb, or a combination of both.

In the case of TWA-800, at the time of the incident, we know from the record the aircraft was climbing at a rate of ~1000 feet per minute, passing through 13,800 feet of altitude. Something caused the catastrophic loss of the nose of the aircraft, some 77,000 pounds, or almost 15% of the total weight of the aircraft. It broke off and up and over, opening up the fuselage, destroying the aerodynamic integrity of the aircraft and vastly increasing drag. Simultaneously, according to its manufacturer, all forces opposing that drag went to zero as all four engines reverted to idle at loss of cockpit control signal. The tail of the 747 pitch down almost immediately and the airframe which had been trimmed for a 1000 foot per minute climb was suddenly completely out of trim/balance, with 77,000 lbs now missing from one side of the balance point and the center of gravity and therefore lift moved too far back. No energy is being added to this equation as the only source, the engines, are at idle. The angle of attack for air moving over the wing rapidly changes as the forces being applied act exactly wrongly for flight; gravity pulls the unbalanced tail down and drag on the now non-aerodynamic, open fuselage pulling it upward and slows it down... think of the difference of holding your hand out the window of a speeding car, first with your fingers parallel with the road, then palm into the rushing wind and recall the difference in the force on your arm. Now think of that in a 400 MPH wind and your hand is 21 feet in diameter! The wing will stall! It can’t climb!

Both the CIA and the NTSB claimed the eyewitnesses did not see a missile trailing smoke climbing up to strike TWA-800, but instead saw a crippled Boeing 747 "Zoom climbing" trailing fire and smoke after the center wing tank exploded and the aircraft had lost its nose. The CIA claimed the plane climbed 3,200 feet, from 13,800 feet to 17,000 feet, and then fell to the ocean while the NTSB claim the plane only zoom claimed a more modest 1,600 to 15,400 feet altitude. To accomplish this feat, it was necessary to add TIME, time to climb to both the CIA’s and NTSB’s faux altitudes, and more time to fall back from reaching those altitudes, plus they had to add DISTANCE, distance while those times were used in movement from the location of the initiating event!

Unfortunately for both the CIA and the NTSB, there are two pretty well fixed points in time for the TWA-800 disaster that prove either of their are completely bogus! Those are the times when the initiating event occurred within a five second window of secondary radar pings, and when the two main parts of the wreckage of TWA-800’s airframe landed in the ocean from two separate primary radar sweeps to about 3.5 seconds. In addition, the USS Rude, a US Naval ship that was closest to the area received the last position, heading, speed, and altitude of flight 800 at the time of the initiating event, plugged those data into their ballistic computer, calculated a simple, unpowered ballistic fall from those data and sailed directly to the spot the computer calculated the wreckage would impact the ocean… and found flaming wreckage, bodies, luggage, flotsam, etc, within a couple hundred yards. Had there been any “zoom climb” of ANY altitude, distance, or duration, it would not have been a ballistic fall, the wreckage would miles away from where the Rude was looking.

Another failure of both CIA and NTSB cartoons is you’ll recall that the 747 was climbing toward cruising altitude at ~1000 feet per minute under ideal conditions, yet both film scenarios have the aircraft zoom climbing at very high speed to cut the time factors… 3,200 feet in under 30 seconds for the CIA, 1,600 in the NTSB’s fraud. However the fact remains that between the initiating event and TWA-800’s final airframe splashdown in the Atlantic was a mere 41 seconds, plus/minus about 4 seconds. There’s literally no time for a zoom climb and fall from additional altitude.

The NTSB used the Zoom Climb scenario to exclude the eye witness testimony of over 220 witnesses, regardless of who, where, and how well it coincided or agreed, relying instead on FBI 302 reports that often the eyewitnesses claimed completely misrepresented what they told the agents who interviewed them or were complete fabrications! Not one eye witness was actually allowed to testify IN PERSON before the NTSB hearings.

Also, the primary, direct radar recordings were confiscated by the FBI and have not resurfaced to this day. They were reported to have gone directly to the Clinton White House.

273 posted on 07/15/2021 3:44:02 AM PDT by Swordmaker (My pistol self-identifies as an iPad, so you must accept it in gun-free zones, you hoplophobe bigot!)
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