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To: rustbucket; Homer_J_Simpson; colorado tanker
rustbucket: "What tangible evidence did Anderson have?
None.
As I remember, the governor had promised to stop any mob from attacking Fort Moultrie."

For clear evidence, you need look no further than Homer's post #28, of Gov. Pickens' orders.
They sound ominous & threatening to me.
I'd want to be as safe as possible.

In Homer's post #27 an astute military observer notes how vulnerable Fort Moultrie is.
So why ever would Maj. Anderson delay moving out of it?

31 posted on 01/01/2021 10:35:59 PM PST by BroJoeK ((a little historical perspective...) )
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To: BroJoeK
For clear evidence, you need look no further than Homer's post #28, of Gov. Pickens' orders.
They sound ominous & threatening to me. I'd want to be as safe as possible.

What? The "stay out of our waters" statement issued on January 1, 1861? That statement, made after Anderson moved to Fort Sumter on December 26, 1860 against his orders, justified Anderson to move his command? Man, that Anderson was clairvoyant.

A "stay out of our waters" statement is what any self governing entity might say to potential enemies.

Remember what South Carolina said in its causes for secession document? They cited the Tenth Amendment of the Constitution: "... the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States, respectively, or to the people." Respectively means individually.

That Amendment was proposed by Madison in 1791 because three states had put in their ratification documents that they could resume or reassume their own governance, and four other states had proposed Tenth Amendment like statements that accomplished the same thing. That made a majority of the original states, and, like it or not, the Amendment was ratified and became part of the Constitution. It overruled anything to the contrary in the earlier text of the Constitution. As Madison said when proposing what became the Tenth Amendment, the Constitution already means this, but it doesn't hurt to add it (my paraphrasing of his words).

In Homer's post #27 an astute military observer notes how vulnerable Fort Moultrie is.
So why ever would Maj. Anderson delay moving out of it?

Moultrie could have been overrun eventually if South Carolina put enough troops into the effort. However, Anderson had had the entrance to Moultrie made such that people had to crawl through a tunnel one by one to get into the fort. Foster, I think it was Foster, had experimented in Moultrie with buried mines that popped up out of the ground when trod upon. In his experiments he had not yet added an explosive charge that would detonate in the air after it popped up out of the ground. Workers had told the South Carolinians of the mine experiments at Moultrie. Moultrie's soldiers could sweep invaders off of the upper parts of the fort with their muskets, but Moultrie's defenders could be quickly overcome if enough soldiers came at them. I don't doubt that Moultrie could be overcome.

The point, however, is that the December 21th order to Anderson from Floyd (that was dictated to Floyd by Buchanan) said the following (from the Official Records): Mp>

Sir. : In the verbal instructions communicated to you by Major Buell, you are directed to hold possession of the forts in the harbor of Charleston, and, if attacked, to defend yourself to the last extremity. Under these instructions, you might infer that you are required to make a vain and useless sacrifice of your own life and the lives of the men under your command, upon a mere point of honor. This is far from the President's intentions. You are to exercise a sound military discretion on this subject.

It is neither expected nor desired that you should expose your own life or that of your men in a hopeless conflict in defense of these forts. If they are invested or attacked by a force so superior that resistance would, in your judgment, be a useless waste of life, it will be your duty to yield to necessity, and make the best terms in your power.

This will be the conduct of an honorable, brave, and humane officer, and you will be fully justified in such action. These orders are strictly confidential, and not to be communicated even to the officers under your command, without close necessity.

In other words, if a superior force came at you in Moultrie, surrender before your people get killed. As I have pointed out earlier from a book about Buell, Anderson was upset by Floyd's latest orders because they took away any flexibility he had under the orders he got from Buell. Consequently, on the next day, December 22, Anderson asked Washington for orders to move to Sumter, which Washington never gave him.

Moving Anderson's troops to Sumter would piss the Carolinians off, something Anderson knew and Buell's "orders" told him to avoid. It would also put Anderson's forces in a situation where they could be starved out eventually. Once in Fort Sumter, Anderson was offered free food supplies by the Governor, but Anderson refused the offer.

33 posted on 01/02/2021 9:35:45 AM PST by rustbucket
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