Since you responded to message 824, and since that message is about the actions of Lieutenant Porter, would you care to answer the same point I made to BroJoeK about Porter's actions?
Porter tried to initiate an attack on the Confederates. Captain Meigs stopped him.
Was his actions in initiating this attack in compliance with the President's orders, or was he going rogue?
Here is your opportunity to demonstrate how you won't ignore facts to support your premise.
Well a couple of thoughts come to mind. (In no particular order):
It matters not what I say - you will reject it.
Bold assertions offered up without reservations or wriggle-room are foolhardy at best.
“The fog of war”
Hanlon’s razor
“Porter tried to initiate an attack on the Confederates. Captain Meigs stopped him”
Of the various narratives surrounding the events of Fort Pickens I find this one to be the most detailed and complete. There is no mention of your claim in this (or any other narrative that I have read). Where did you see this?
https://www.americanheritage.com/relief-fort-pickens#1
Just letting you know that I haven't forgotten your challenge. Life has gotten in the way and there was a great deal of reading to do as well ;'} In truth I wasn't paying particular attention to the specifics of the go-around between you and BroJoeK. In truth, most of the claims and counter-claims don't add up to a hill o beans - from either of you. But (just for schitz und gigglez) let's examine this exchange and see where it sends us.
As best I can tell, the root of contention lies with this assertion by you:
"Speaking of Fort Pickens, that is exactly where Lincoln sent Lieutenant Porter in the Powhatan under hand carried secret orders. Porter immediately upon arrival, tried to fire on Confederate shore batteries and did indeed fire on Confederate ships, and all with no knowledge of the events in Charleston. So yes, Lincoln fully intended to start the war somewhere else and was only conning Virginia to get them to do what he wanted long enough to keep them in line."
You then double-down here:
"This has been explained to you before. Lieutenant Porter immediately tried to engage the confederate shore batteries as soon as he arrived. If you think he was doing this contrary to the President's orders, you are greatly mistaken. One can only conclude that his orders were to start a d@mn fight as soon as he got there. Nothing else is reasonable."
Thus brings us to your challenge to me:
"Was his actions in initiating this attack in compliance with the President's orders, or was he going rogue?"
Ignoring the stink of the "When did you stop beating your wife?" gotcha and (for a moment), dismissing the the strawman of "attacking", and setting aside the logical fallacy associated with the nonsensical "Nothing else is reasonable" we need to look at Lincoln's orders and then compare them to Porter's actions to make any sort of reasonable interpretation. Say, do you happen to have a copy of them handy?
Well, in case you don't, I suppose that we'll just have to guess at them. My guess is, "Git your butt down to Pickens post haste, secure the fort, and relieve Colonel Brown."
It's about here that I want to insert an analogy. When Lincoln assumed office on March 4, 1861 it was like taking possession of a used car. You don't know much about the condition and worthiness of the vehicle - only that it was misused by its previous owner.
Lincoln was caught flat-footed by circumstances that threatened to spiral out of control and all needed immediate attention. The institutions of the United States were being threatened in all quarters, from illegal seizures to mutiny and desertion. Even his "inner circle" of cabinet members were akin to cats requiring constant herding. Problems needed to be addressed. Solutions needed to be identified. Choices needed to be made. And actions needed to be initiated. On every front and in every respect. Now!
What we can glean from the records that survive is a recognition of the confusion, the pandemonium, and the need to stave off panic. There was massive treachery afoot by those both without and within. There were conflicting opinions as to what to do (or not do), who to do what, and who to do the ordering. As a result conflicting orders and countermands were being issued. Hindsight being 20-20 we can look back at the events as they were unfolding and presuppose our own values onto the flow of events. In truth the fog of war blinds all of us equally.
So what do the records tell us? First, that Gustavus Fox had devised and initiated a relief expedition for Fort Sumter. We also know that (unbeknownst to Fox) an expedition similar to Fox’s was simultaneously being fitted out under the command of Navy Lieutenant David Porter. Secretary of State William Seward, without the knowledge of Secretary of the Navy Gideon Welles, had obtained Lincoln’s authorization to divert Powhatan to the gulf expedition. Just as she was preparing to sail from New York on April 6, Powhatan was ordered to leave the Charleston expedition and diverted to Fort Pickens. Communication breakdown.
As to the orders, Porter states he wrote them himself:
"'Lincoln reluctantly agreed', taking no notice of the incompatibility of the Pensacola scheme and the Sumter relief expedition, perhaps simply confusing the name of the ship whose presence was vital to assure success in both places.
"Porter immediately wrote the 'confidential' carte blanche orders. Lincoln picked up his pen; "Seward,' he said, see that I don't burn my fingers.' - Porter David D. “The Naval History of the Civil War”.
"Porter tried to initiate an attack on the Confederates."
Not accurate.
"Captain Meigs stopped him."
Sorta. Since Meigs had arrived before Porter he intercepted Porter to let him know of Colonel Brown's desires. Having specific written orders from the president, Porter was conflicted but insisted that Lincoln's orders superseded the Colonel's.
Among my readings was cited opinion by a couple of officials, including Welles, that initially distrusted Porter. Suspicions ran high what with all the treachery underway. Porter was known to have many southern friends and associates and there was speculation that he might join the exodus to the rebs. As it turned out Porter liked where he was situated and eager to join the fray.
"Was his actions in initiating this attack in compliance with the President's orders, or was he going rogue? "
My guess is that he acted in compliance (more or less) of Lincoln's orders.
"Lieutenant Porter immediately tried to engage the confederate shore batteries as soon as he arrived."
Not accurate. There were no "shore batteries". Remember that Brown and even Meigs were already onsite and had already taken possession of the fort when Porter was intercepted upon by Meigs and acceded (more or less) to Brown's order to stand down. The next day spotters saw vessels bearing down on them. No vessel names, flags, captains, or intentions are listed in any of the accounts I read. Porter fired a warning shot. The vessels retreated and did not return.
"One can only conclude that his orders were to start a d@mn fight as soon as he got there. Nothing else is reasonable."
Nonsense.
"Yes, if Lincoln fully expected to start the war somewhere else, and only told Virginia what they wanted to hear until he could pull another trick to start a war, then you are correct."
Pure speculation. You wish it to be true so you int4rpret the narratives one way. I interpret them differently.