[gogeo]

My simple contention is that our side WILL NOT fight outside of legitimate constituted authority.

I think you're comparing apples and pineapples. The so-called authorities in 1776 were considered by the "legitimate" authority, the King, to be traitors to the Crown and criminals.

During the Civil War the legitimacy of the Confederacy came from the consent of the governed.

Both were wars of independence. The next Civil War, if any, will be to maintain the lawful government against a coup, an internal insurrection, a revolt against the Rule of Law, against anarchy.

The current government is the lawful authority. We delegate authority; in a sense, we are the lawful authority.

[BroJoeK]

gogeo: "During the Civil War the legitimacy of the Confederacy came from the consent of the governed."

Well, technically from the consent of their slaveholding elites.

1. It's often said only 6% of Confederates were slaveholders and that's true enough.
   The total was 317,000 of 5.5 million whites.
   But if all those slaveholders voted in the 1860 election, they made up about 1/3 of the Confederate electorate ~900,000).
   And we can easily imagine most slaveholders had family members eligible to vote and so the slaveholding interest group could well be over 50% of Confederate voters.

2. However: of the Confederacy's 5.5 million whites nearly one million were Unionists who provided over 100,000 white troops to the Union army.

3. Plus the Confederacy's 3.5 million slaves provided another 100,000 colored troops for the Union army.

4. And, of the roughly one million Confederates who served the Confederate army, over 100,000 were drafted, proportionately double the Union army, suggesting they weren't so happy to be there.

5. Finally, today it's often claimed only a small percent of Confederate soldiers owned slaves, but estimates at the time fell between 25% and 33% of Confederate soldiers came from slaveholding families, and virtually all of their senior leadership did.

So, consent of the governed?
Sure, but not all the governed consented, many were forced and many more refused.

[BDParrish]

You misunderstood my contention. It is irrelevant what the King thought. It is irrelevant whether the authority is truly legitimate or not. It is enough for our people to believe it to be so in order for them to fight. But I tell you, without that legitimate constituted authority our side WILL NOT FIGHT!!!

Do you think that I am wrong about that? What makes you think so? I want to ask this question whenever I see one of these 2nd civil war threads, until I get an answer. Thanks for your reply!