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To: gandalftb
The only issues that remain is a sentimental sympathy for the property losses and destruction of the South, and a continuing strain of white supremacy in both the North and the South.

I don't think those are the only issues remaining. I think this business of "consent of the governed" is an issue that was decided wrongly in the 1860s, and needs to be corrected.

I believe states should and do have the right to regain independence. This notion of a compulsory union is anathema to the principles of our own founding.

If California wants to leave, so long as they pay us what they owe us, i'm okay with them leaving. They are nuts anyways.

74 posted on 07/05/2018 11:11:14 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: DiogenesLamp

OK, I agree, there are many forms of secessionist movements all over.

WA, OR, CA has them every year.

The secessionist movements that tend to work are typically unincorporated urban areas that incorporate to gain local control.

Mostly the schemes are too grandiose and lack a thorough financial/tax plan and have not gone anywhere.

Frankly, the South is too heavily embedded with Northerners to ever have a cohesive states rights movement.

There is a very popular bumper sticker in the TX: “We don’t care how you did it up North.”

I have no general opposition to states splitting into more states. But forming another country is just not right.


77 posted on 07/05/2018 11:25:01 AM PDT by gandalftb
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To: DiogenesLamp; gandalftb; x
DiogenesLamp: "I don't think those are the only issues remaining.
I think this business of 'consent of the governed' is an issue that was decided wrongly in the 1860s, and needs to be corrected."

You know, until recent years when Democrats became totally unhinged there was a well established legal principle that convicts could not vote -- that when you seriously break the laws, you are no longer a fully entitled citizen.
That's the legal principle which applied to former Confederates after 1865, and along with enfranchising former slaves it's what got the 13th, 14th and 15th amendments passed, thank God!

And if you fantacize that's entirely evil, then just ask yourself: how many Southern states revoked their ratifications after 1876, when they got Federal troops removed and were free again to do whatever they wished to their African-American fellow citizens?
The answer, of course, is: none.
Much as they ignored and subverted those amendments, they rightly never tried to overturn them.

Nor would you, if you could, so why pretend otherwise?

113 posted on 07/07/2018 12:23:54 PM PDT by BroJoeK ((a little historical perspective...))
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