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To: FLT-bird
FLT-bird: "Southerners very much did see by 1860-61 that industrialization was the way forward..."

Your 1987 authors are fantasizing.
In fact, there is nothing in any of the quotes about producing a "balanced economy" in the South, far from it.
Southerners hated the North's industrialization and didn't want to support it.
None said they wanted more industry "in the South"

FLT-bird quoting Jefferson Davis, April 29, 1861: "The people of the Southern States, whose almost exclusive occupation was agriculture, early perceived a tendency in the Northern States to render the common government subservient to their own purposes by imposing burdens on commerce as a protection to their manufacturing and shipping interests...."

What's true here is that many Southerners wanted low tariffs, and so did many from other regions.
What's not true is the claim that Federal spending went disproportionately to the North.
It didn't.

But the biggest deceit here is the claim that Northerners somehow ran Washington, DC and could do what they wished.
The opposite is true: Southern Democrats were the power brokers in Washington, DC, from about 1800 until secession in 1861.
What Southerners wanted they got, what they didn't want didn't happen, period.

FLT-bird quoting Jefferson Davis, April 29, 1861: "By degrees, as the Northern States gained preponderance in the National Congress..."

But they didn't, ever, until secession in 1861.
Sure, by 1860 for the first time there was a Republican majority in one house of Congress, but Southerners still controlled the other, and the President.

Of course, Democrats being Democrats naturally go nuts when out of political power, then as now.

FLT-bird quoting Missouri Senator Thomas Hart Benton: "Under Federal legislation, the exports of the South have been the basis of the Federal revenue.....
Virginia, the two Carolinas, and Georgia, may be said to defray three-fourths of the annual expense of supporting the Federal Government; and of this great sum, annually furnished by them, nothing or next to nothing is returned to them, in the shape of Government expenditures."

Both claims are false: those four states did not "defray" 3/4 of Federal expenses, nor was Federal spending focused outside the South.
Nor is the claim that Southerners were impoverished credible because, in fact, Southern planters and their white neighbors enjoyed the highest average standard of living of any country ever.

For example, in 1840, total US exports (including specie) were $132 million of which $61 million (46%) was cotton.
Everything else listed as "Southern products" was also produced outside the Confederate South and so continued with strong exports even after secession in 1861.

FLT-bird quoting John C Calhoun, 1850: "The north has adopted a system of revenue and disbursements, in which an undue proportion of the burden of taxation has been imposed on the South, and an undue proportion of its proceeds appropriated to the north ...
The South as the great exporting portion of the Union has, in reality, paid vastly more than her due proportion of the revenue."

It was not true in 1840 or 1850 or 1860.
In fact, truly Southern exports represented about half the total and Federal dollars were spent correspondingly, about half in the South.

208 posted on 04/17/2018 6:03:48 PM PDT by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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To: BroJoeK

Your 1987 authors are fantasizing.
In fact, there is nothing in any of the quotes about producing a “balanced economy” in the South, far from it.
Southerners hated the North’s industrialization and didn’t want to support it.
None said they wanted more industry “in the South”

Laughable BS. Most people could see by then that industrialization was the way forward. All anyone needed to do was look at the world. Those countries that were industrialized were the most powerful and wealthiest. The South just wanted to industrialize on its own terms and not have to pay for somebody else’s industrialization.


What’s true here is that many Southerners wanted low tariffs, and so did many from other regions.
What’s not true is the claim that Federal spending went disproportionately to the North.
It didn’t.

Yes it did.


But the biggest deceit here is the claim that Northerners somehow ran Washington, DC and could do what they wished.
The opposite is true: Southern Democrats were the power brokers in Washington, DC, from about 1800 until secession in 1861.
What Southerners wanted they got, what they didn’t want didn’t happen, period.

This is patently absurd. The North had an equal number of states from the start and later had more - thus more Senators. The North always had more people - thus more Representatives. To say that Southerners got what they wanted and did not get what they did not want is simply absurd. From the early high protectionist tariffs to tariffs being on manufactured goods but not raw materials to unequal federal expenditures favoring the Northern states to the Tariff of Abominations to the Morrill Tariff, it was clear the reality was exactly the opposite of what you claim.


But they didn’t, ever, until secession in 1861.
Sure, by 1860 for the first time there was a Republican majority in one house of Congress, but Southerners still controlled the other, and the President.

Simply false as I laid out above. The North always had more congressmen and the balance shifted ever further in their favor as time went on.


Both claims are false: those four states did not “defray” 3/4 of Federal expenses, nor was Federal spending focused outside the South.
Nor is the claim that Southerners were impoverished credible because, in fact, Southern planters and their white neighbors enjoyed the highest average standard of living of any country ever.

For example, in 1840, total US exports (including specie) were $132 million of which $61 million (46%) was cotton.
Everything else listed as “Southern products” was also produced outside the Confederate South and so continued with strong exports even after secession in 1861.

False. The South provided the overwhelming bulk of the exports from 1791 right up until 1861. Only in the last few years did Midwestern grain become a significant export. The South also paid the vast majority of the tariffs since those cash crops financed the purchase of manufactured goods to fill the holds of ships on their return journeys across the Atlantic.


It was not true in 1840 or 1850 or 1860.
In fact, truly Southern exports represented about half the total and Federal dollars were spent correspondingly, about half in the South.

Total BS on both counts.


212 posted on 04/18/2018 12:33:22 AM PDT by FLT-bird (.)
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