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Free Republic's resident scientist speaks. Heed her words people for she is a real scientist.

Love ya Mom, but you are always so full of yourself that I just feel obligated to point out the errors you make.

"Vaccines consist of a killed or attenuated pathogen, or of proteins extracted from a pathogen"

I think what you meant to say Mom was that some vaccines consist of a killed or attenuated pathogen, or of proteins extracted from a pathogen. Was there some reason that you left out toxoid vaccines which protect against the toxins made by the pathogen and do not contain the pathogen itself (killed or attenuated) or proteins extracted from the pathogen? Diptheria, tetanus and pertussis vaccines are examples of toxoid vaccines - I'm sure you've heard of them.

"The vaccines have no capacity to actually cause disease."

Not true in the case of shingles. Children vaccinated against chickenpox have an increased risk of shingles as adults. One of many cases where having (and surviving) a childhood disease leads to a more informed immune system.

Or how about the ability of tetanus immunizations to cause Antiphospholipid Syndrome?

Here is a study showing this ability in mice but still it refutes your contention that, "vaccines have no capacity to actually cause disease" unless you would like to weasel out by saying a syndrome is not the same as a disease - yes, but it is a harmful condition caused by an immunization.

Vaccine model of antiphospholipid syndrome induced by tetanus vaccine

"Successful induction of antiphospholipid syndrome (APS) in two different non-autoimmune prone mouse strains, BALB/c and C57BL/6, was achieved by tetanus toxoid (TTd) hyperimmunization using different adjuvants (glycerol or aluminium hydroxide), and different adjuvant pretreatments (glycerol or Complete Freund's Adjuvant (CFA))."
Or maybe you would like to discuss encephalitis caused by pertussis and MMR vaccinations?

The National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program considers encephalitis to be a "table injury" in which the plaintiff has the presumption of compensation and is not required to prove injury by the preponderance of evidence if symptoms occur within 72 hours of the pertussis immunization or 15 days of the MMR immunization. Seems to be a matter of "settled science" by your fellow government ~~employees~~ scientists LOL

"In addition, the toxins from pathogens are detoxified when made into vaccines, so they do not and cannot have the same effect on the body that the actual pathogen has."

No Mom, the attenuated viruses produce less of their toxins but that does not mean they are "detoxified" as some of the toxins are still produced. Lets try to be precise here as befits a real scientist such as yourself.

"Another consideration is that if the immune response to a vaccine were capable of causing autism, then the immune response to the disease being prevented would cause autism."

Poor reasoning Mom. It doesn't have to be the disease being vaccinated against that would be the cause of autism. You fail to take into account the effects that adjuvants included in the vaccine have on the recipient's immune system. Sensitizing the immune system to increase its reaction to the vaccine's included pathogen also sensitizes the immune system to other pathogens or even other biologically active materials that may be in the recipient's body at the time of the immunization and the immune system's heightened response to any of these other pathogens or biologically active materials may be the cause of other diseases or syndromes.

The human body is a soup containing many live and biologically active materials which in small quantities are beneficial or even necessary to health but which in larger quantities are harmful - and an immune system sensitized by a vaccine's adjuvants may not be able to make this distinction and may be trained to attack even the small (necessary) amounts of these microbes and substances.

Free Republic's resident scientist speaks. Heed her words people for she is a real scientist.
Love ya Mom, but you are always so full of yourself that I just feel obligated to point out the errors you make.

I know that you are trying to be clever (or something) here, but the fact is that I've been posting on FR for about 17 years now. People actually do recognize my expertise. What you cannot possibly know is that they PM me sometimes specifically because of that expertise. If their physician can't explain what's going on, they know they can ask me and I'll explain in terms that they understand. So cut out the attempt to be sarcastic, I doubt you'll get anywhere with it.

Was there some reason that you left out toxoid vaccines which protect against the toxins made by the pathogen and do not contain the pathogen itself (killed or attenuated) or proteins extracted from the pathogen?

You should have probably looked up the definition of "toxoid" before posting that. A toxoid is a detoxified toxin extracted from a pathogen. A toxin is a poisonous protein. Toxins can be extracted directly from the pathogen and deactivated (e.g. diphtheria toxin) or they can be genetically modified to be non-toxic and grown in an organism like E. coli. And I very specifically was not trying to cover every vaccine type, but to convey an idea of what vaccines are to an audience that is not scientists.

Not true in the case of shingles. Children vaccinated against chickenpox have an increased risk of shingles as adults. One of many cases where having (and surviving) a childhood disease leads to a more informed immune system.

Utter nonsense. If the chickenpox vaccine caused an increased risk of shingles, then shingles should have been exceedingly rare prior to the vaccine, and people who've had chickenpox wouldn't have to worry. The vast majority of shingles cases occur in people like me, who had to suffer chickenpox because there was no vaccine for it when I was a kid. If you have had chickenpox, you have the virus in your body--it never goes away. The vaccine has not been used for long enough to make any kind of determination on its effect on the incidence of shingles, but researchers expect to see a drop in the incidence of shingles as the vaccinated population ages.

Or how about the ability of tetanus immunizations to cause Antiphospholipid Syndrome?

So, "antiphospholipid syndrome" is a synonym for tetanus now? Somehow, I don't think so.

Barring manufacturing errors (which have happened), a vaccine is utterly incapable of causing the disease it is meant to prevent.

"In addition, the toxins from pathogens are detoxified when made into vaccines, so they do not and cannot have the same effect on the body that the actual pathogen has."

No Mom, the attenuated viruses produce less of their toxins but that does not mean they are "detoxified" as some of the toxins are still produced.

Ah, here I see that your problem with reading comprehension (which you have already amply demonstrated) runs into your lack of scientific knowledge, with disastrous result.

The toxins from pathogens are exactly that: toxins which have been extracted from pathogens and rendered non-toxic using biochemical methods. This is completely unrelated to the process used to make attenuated vaccines.

Sorry, I'm not even going to bother with that illogical and unscientific mess that is your "discussion" of the role of adjuvants. I see that in another post that you linked to mercola.com--which is as egregious a pseudoscience website as any. I've suspected for a while that you are an aficionado of pseudoscience, and now you have provided the proof.