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To: metmom; imardmd1
Still waiting for the Scripture that states that God hates sinners.

Not an explicit statement, but nonetheless,

The Lord trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth. (Psalms 11:5)

For the wicked boasteth of his heart's desire, and blesseth the covetous, whom the Lord abhorreth. (Psalms 10:3)

God judgeth the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day. (Psalms 7:11)

I think God can hate and love the same people, hating sinners for what they are, annd fit for the fire, and yet loving them despite that, sparing not His own dear Son to save them. Because God hates sinners then Israel was marked for destruction. But because He yet loved them,.

I sought for a man among them, that should make up the hedge, and stand in the gap before me for the land, that I should not destroy it: but I found none. Therefore have I poured out mine indignation upon them; I have consumed them with the fire of my wrath: their own way have I recompensed upon their heads, saith the Lord God. (Ezekiel 22:30-31)

108 posted on 11/15/2017 7:24:34 PM PST by daniel1212 (rust the risen Lord Jesus to save you as a damned and destitute sinner + be baptized + folllow Him)
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To: daniel1212
http://biblehub.com/greek/3404.htm

Strong's Concordance

miseó: to hate

Original Word: μισέω

Part of Speech: Verb

Transliteration: miseó

Phonetic Spelling: (mis-eh'-o)

Short Definition: I hate, detest

Definition: I hate, detest, love less, esteem less. HELPS Word-studies

3404 miséō – properly, to detest (on a comparative basis); hence, denounce; to love someone or something less than someone (something) else, i.e. to renounce one choice in favor of another.

Lk 14:26: "If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate (3404 /miséō, 'love less' than the Lord) his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple" (NASU).

[Note the comparative meaning of 3404 (miséō) which centers in moral choice, elevating one value over another.]

Romans 5:8 but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

Romans 5:10-11 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

Jesus the One who wept over Jerusalem, those who kill the prophets, the One who said from the cross as they were crucifying Him, "Father forgive them, for they know not what they are doing", the One who rebuked the apostles for wanting to call down fire from heaven to consume an entire village that had just rejected Him, the God who is gracious and merciful, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love.

God is love. His nature is love. He loves the creation of His hand, made in His image.

I would love to see the success rates of people who evangelize by telling others that God hates them cause they're sinners and they'd better repent so God can love them and be nice to them. Otherwise, He's going to send them to hell cause He hates them.

But people going to hell is not on the basis of God's love or lack of love for them. It's based on the demands of His just and holy nature.

118 posted on 11/15/2017 11:50:33 PM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: metmom; daniel1212
imardmd1: God hates both Sin and sinners. (Post #45)

metmom: Still waiting for the Scripture that states that God hates sinners. (Post #100)

daniel1212: Because God hates sinners then Israel was marked for destruction. But because He yet loved them,. (Post #108)

There are some incidents we ought not to forget, while formulating our list of what God hates, For instance:

o The Flood

Gen 6:3
And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh:
yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

Gen 6:5-7 AV:
And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the
earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his
heart was only evil continually.
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth,
and it grieved him at his heart.
And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created
from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the
creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth
me that I have made them.

>> God so regretted the world, that He destroyed every land animal, including man, save enough creatures to repopulate it including only eight humans of faith in Him. Didn't He hate the obstinately oppositionally defiant human subjects enough to destroy them all? <<

o Esau versus Jacob, before they even were born:

Mal 1:2-4
I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast
thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the
LORD: yet I loved Jacob,
And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage
waste for the dragons of the wilderness.
Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return
and build the desolate places; thus saith the LORD of
hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they
shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people
against whom the LORD hath indignation for ever.

Rom 9:13
As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Hebrews 12:14-17
Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no
man shall see the Lord:
Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God;
lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and
thereby many be defiled;
Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau,
who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
For ye know how that afterward, when he would have
inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no
place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

>> Esau and his descendants of Edom became The Jews' enemy perpetually to this day because Jacob received the great blessing of Isaac that went from generation to generation, and the heritage of the Messiah, the Savior with it. The hatred of The God has followed the Edomites ever since. <<

o Regarding Ephraim, who was designated as the head of the Northern Kingdom of ten tribes of Israel that separated from Rehoboam/Judah and became the bitter enemy of Judah(Christ):

Hos 9:11-17:
As for Ephraim, their glory shall fly away like a bird,
from the birth, and from the womb, and from the conception.
Though they bring up their children, yet will I bereave
them, that there shall not be a man left: yea, woe also to
them when I depart from them!
Ephraim, as I saw Tyrus, is planted in a pleasant place:
but Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer.
Give them, O LORD: what wilt thou give? give them a
miscarrying womb and dry breasts.
All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them:
for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of
mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are
revolters.

Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear
no fruit: yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay
even the beloved fruit of their womb.
My God will cast them away, because they did not hearken
unto him: and they shall be wanderers among the nations.

>> Where are those ten tribes now, which earned God's hatred for all the time until the great tribulation? Dan is not mentioned even among the twelve tribes of the 144,000 mentioned in Rev. 7:4-8 (the tribe of Ephraim through primogeniture was finally restored and reconstituted as "the tribe of Joseph.") <<

o The Revolt of Korah, Dathan, Abiram, and their conspirators:

Numbers 16
I am not going to copy all this in, but here is one selection:
Num 16:27,31-33
So they gat up from the tabernacle of Korah, Dathan, and
Abiram, on every side: and Dathan and Abiram came out, and
stood in the door of their tents, and their wives, and
their sons, and their little children.
. . .
And it came to pass, as he had made an end of speaking all
these words, that the ground clave asunder that was under them:
And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and
their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah,
and all their goods.
They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive
into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they
perished from among the congregation.

>> Korah and his associates tainted the whole congregation, and not only they and their families, but thousands more of their adherents died for their sinfulness because Jehovah hated what they were doing, and them. Remember, they were already under condemnation, and the consequences were being staved off by close obedience to the ordinances of the Law, which they trid to lay aside. <<

*********

There's more (Ananias & Sapphira, Simon the magician, etc.) but I don't want to waste more of your and my time to prove the point. God hates all sin, as well as some deliberate practitioners of it who in His ability looking into the future, were not going to change in their passive or active aggressiveness against His sovereignty.

One proper definition of the meaning of agape (translated as love or charity) is this:

"Agape love is the sovereign preference of one, above self and others."

And if I may apply that to the hate that proceeds out of God's righteousness, perhaps this might be expressed as:

"God's miseo hatred is the sovereign detestation of those who unceasingly without end prefer self and sin above righteousness."

Apart from The Christ, that is us. So to cap it off, all you need for an example of how much God hates Sin, sinfulness, and the inherently committed practitioners of it, is the picture of the human personification of one who bore our sins in His Body, hanging on the tree of torture, who cried out in agony of separation from and rejection of His Father God, "Eli, Eli! Lama sabachthani!" as the Might God increased the pressure to full bore.

Our Redeemer received there all the celestial fury of God's righteous wrath that we rightly and fully deserve. He paid the price for all creatures that they might be saved.

But now look at this: For those who refuse to accept that free-to-them gift of the complete remission of sins through faith in his blood, the price that He paid on the Cross will be exacted from them in the Lake of Fire, in my truly humble opinion.

So, don't overdo the compassion thing when chastening is fit. A sugary compassion won't be respected or accepted as genuine. Jesus bore The Mighty God's vengeance that was due me, for which I do not know how to be grateful enough. But I am His, and He is mine. When He comes back for good, He's going to clean house, if I understand the Apocalypse correctly. Upsetting money-changers' tables will be the least of the sanitizing project. Actually, blood will flow. Not His then.

I hope this satisfies your wait on this topic.

=========

Christ Liveth In Me

1.

Once far from God and dead in sin,
No light my heart could see;
But in God's Word the light I found,
Now Christ liveth in me.

Chorus:

Christ liveth in me,
Christ liveth in me,
Oh! what a salvation this,
That Christ liveth in me.

2.

As rays of light from yonder sun,
The flow'rs of earth set free,
So life and light and love came forth
From Christ living in me.

3.

As lives the flow'r within the seed,
As in the cone the tree,
So, praise the God of truth and grace,
His Spirit dwelleth in me.

4.

With longing all my heart is filled,
That like Him I may be,
As on the wondrous tho't I dwell
That Christ liveth in me!


-----

(Maj.) Daniel W. Whittle
1840 - 1901

150 posted on 11/16/2017 11:56:09 AM PST by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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