Posted on 01/27/2017 11:58:11 AM PST by C19fan
The Army today confirmed the caliber for its new Modular Handgun System will be 9mm, one week after the service announced it selected a version of Sig Sauer’s P320 to replace the M9 service pistol.
Army officials sent out a press release with additional details on the MHS but did not explain why the service chose 9mm, a decision that Military.com asked the Army to explain its reasoning behind.
(Excerpt) Read more at kitup.military.com ...
It's tempting but that would be one additional caliber of ammo I'd have to stock up on, so I'll stick with the 9.
The 10mm is a great cartridge and deserves to be popular but it is not. I once owned several and could barely tell the difference in recoil from the .45 auto.
It is much more powerful tho. If I could afford a new gun right now it would be a high capacity Glock in 10mm.
Yeah. 9MM Excellent target gun. We used the 1911 for 70+ years. Now we have women in combat and other sexes like Bradley Manning. That’s why we use the 9mm.
Special Ops, Seals, Rangers etc often opt for the .45 ACP. Not saying we shouldn’t use lighter weapons. But there are plenty of lighter handguns which hold the .45 ACP or other powerful rounds with fairly large capacity magazines. We’re not Europeans. We can handle a mans gun.
See 23
I have always liked the M1911 but I also like the 9mm. It is a great cartridge and has proven to be effective.
They should have waited until Trump amd Mattis can get rid of all the girls, trannies and assorted sissies in the combat arms before deciding on to stick with a cartridge long proven to be ineffective in quickly stopping the enemy.
9mm subsonic 147gr makes a fairly hard hitter (real good with silencers). I would prefer a bigger or faster round with higher energy against car doors and body armor.
I’m not recommending 1911. There are modern lighter, high capacity handguns in plus calibers.
Like 9mm diameter for better penetration? .357 Sig and .38 super are both 9mm. (.355”)....but with much faster rounds and in heavier projectile.
The Military.com link you posted beats around the bush a lot. Maybe because even the Army hasn’t decided on universal hollow-points.
“The Army’s Modular Handgun System will include special ammunition such as jacketed hollow-points...” And then they go on to imply that it will be a command decision as to which ammo is used, which sounds a lot like the current situation. The only difference will be the standard issue SIG will be able to use HP’s, while the current standard issue M9 will not. Currently, only special forces issued with other pistols (M11, etc.) can use HPs.
And, on to the esoteric stuff. I am a generalist when it comes to firearms, and I own calibers in .22 to .44 Mag, so I have no axe to grind. I will say that a recent test I did opened my eyes to 9mm capabilities.
I was searching for a carry round for my new Charter Arms Boomer in .44 Spl. with a short 2” ported barrel. I fired into 4 ply denim and non-calibrated gel. The only round to expand was Hornady .44 Spl 165g FTX. It went 13” deep and expanded to .62”.
However, as a comparison, I fired a 4” barreled 9mm (the shortest I had) with Federal 9mm 124g HST. It went 15” and expanded to .60”!
1. To be fair the test should have been against a 3” barreled 9mm handgun (which I don’t have) for carry gun equivalence.
2. Even fairer would have been FTX in both calibers. If federal ever comes out with a .44 Spl HST, it will probably blow the 9mm out of the water, as evidenced by their excellent .45 ACP HST.
3. This is a corollary to 2. Everyone that says 9mm benefits from recent advances in ammo ignores the fact that all calibers benefit. And .45 still beats 9mm, FMJ to FMJ, and HST to HST.
Still, you can’t ignore the 9mm benefits of small dimensions/high capacity with reasonable recoil in a round that is now much more, and more reliably, effective against people.
No - it's still a glorified .38 Special with a lighter hardball slug - and the same round the Germans lost two wars in a row with. The army picked 9mm so they'd have a caliber young ladies could handle, not to actually kill anybody with..
Only to computer geeks. In real life, the real killers are .45 ACP and .357 Magnum.
There are other articles about this out there. I chose the Military.com one because they apparently forgot about their own article when questioning why the Army decided on a 9mm. It also makes army sense to me that the article says the army will not use HP rounds with the current M9 pistol because it was not tested with hollow points. Adding the expense of testing the new pistol with HP rounds makes me believe they are serious about using them.
Which is fine if your targets are paper. If your targets are large, robust men trying to kill you, .45 is the real thing. 9mm just wounds them.
The Germans lost two world wars because of the 9mm? I want some of what you are smoking.
I imagine tens of millions of dead Russians thought the German Army was pretty efficient.
I like the 9mm, and before I read this thread, I thought I still had a complete set of daddy parts...but now I’m not so sure.
The 9x19 is a NATO round.
Our entire military will likely not switch to Sig in an instant, with guard units likely to take up to 10 years to fully transition.
We likely have inventory of 9x19.
9x19 can hold more rounds.
Now this last one is REAL important for all the John Waynes out there who have to push a wheel barrel around to hold their genitals: The military service pistol is for personal self defense. It is a weapon of last resort.
Who carries a pistol:
Pilots
Armored Crewmen
Staff officers
What to infantrymen who kick in doors and shoot monsters in bodyarmor carry? M4, M16, Grenades, etc.
9mm should do just fine.
Army is not allowed hollow point, only FMJ.
Tunnel rats
Vietnam-era M60 machinegunners
You're kidding, right? The Wehrmacht used 7.92mm rifle caliber stuff for the serious stuff and artillery and mortars for the rest. Pistol carriers didn't last long in WW II.
Most of the serious killing the Germans did was 7.65mm in the back of the head of helpless civilians.
“In real life, the real killers are .45 ACP and .357 Magnum. “
Actually, in real life, the most prolific killer is the humble .22lr.
Thx....Did not know that...
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