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To: Buffalo Head
There is no such cartridge designated ".45 Long Colt". Never has been and never will be. Nor is there a .45 Short Colt, .45 Extra Long Colt or .45 Extremely Long Colt.

That's very strange, because I have a 1880s period box of old, old ammo around here labelled .45 Long Colt. Strangely it was manufactured by. . . wait for it. . . Colt.


Left .45 Long Colt v. .45 S&W Schofield

The .45 Long Colt designation came about when the US Army adopted the 1873 .45 Colt . . . at the same time they were also purchasing the 1870 Smith and Wesson break top .45 S&W Schofield which used a shorter .45 round. These rounds could be easily be confused so the ordnance officers started specifically ordering the .45 LONG Colt to better differentiate it from the shorter .45 Smith and Wesson round which WOULD chamber in the Colt SAA. The reverse would not occur. The chambering and firing of the S&W rounds in the Colts caused jams and mis-fires as the .45 S&W dimensions were also smaller in diameter and had a tendency to expand too much.

Later, after Colt introduced the 1911 Auto, the confusion between to two Colt cartridges, one the .45 ACP, and the .45 Colt, still resulted in problems, so people started asking for either the .45 LONG Colt indicating the longer .45 Colt, and often even asking for the .45 SHORT ammo. . . meaning the .45 ACP. . . because people were confused which they needed. This was further confused with the introduction of the Colt (Model 1917) and Smith & Wesson (Model 25-2) revolvers that were capable of shooting BOTH cartridges, using a moon clip to load the .45 ACP into the cylinders that would chamber the 45 Colt (or the .45 LONG Colt cartridge.

As mentioned in Wikipedia:

"It is sometimes referred to as .45 Long Colt or .45LC, to differentiate it from the shorter .45 S&W Schofield, as both were used by the Army at the same period of time prior to the adoption of the M1887 Govt.[1]"

The US Army armorers designated the cartridges in their orders as .45 Long Colt because the .45 S&W Schofield would chamber in the Colts but COULD occasionally over pressure the Colts do to fouling and mistiming issues if used in the Colts. . .

The use of the .45 Long Colt designation started WAY before the 20th Century and is a time honored designation in both antique and gun shops.

All of this "usage" PREDATES such organizations as the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) or the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers Institute (SAAMI).

I assure you that in the 1970s the gun parlance was to refer to the .45 Colt as the .45 Long Colt and it was neither STUPID nor IGNORANT to do so because that is what the users of the cartridge referred to when asking for the ammo. I've sold one hell of a lot of it, variously as .45 Colt, .45 LC, or .45 Long Colt. All are considered correct and help differentiate the round from other .45 rounds.

Now, Mr. Pedantic. Look at this and tell me what is correct, the normal everyday usage of what you can fit on a HEAD STAMP! Do you see what every single one of these are being sold as in their descriptions?

While I have never seen a .45 Long Colt head stamp, I do have cartridges with the HEAD STAMP of .45 LC on them. What, pray tell, does the "L" stand for in "LC", Buffalo Head?


Next time you want to call someone "Stupid!" be sure you are on firm common usage, industry, historical, and factual grounds.

44 posted on 11/27/2016 6:42:09 PM PST by Swordmaker (This tag line is a Microsoft insult free zone... but if the insults to Mac users continue...)
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To: Swordmaker; Buffalo Head
Got me this Rossi Matched Pair Pistol a while back. It shoots 45LC 410Ga & 22LR


49 posted on 11/27/2016 7:10:43 PM PST by JoeProBono (SOME IMAGES MAY BE DISTURBING VIEWER DISCRETION IS ADVISED;-{)
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To: Swordmaker
"....because I have a 1880s period box of old, old ammo around here labeled (sic) .45 Long Colt."

I believe that you are mistaken. Please post a photo of that box and a head stamp from the cartridges contained therein. It is the head stamp stupid.

Have you yet checked the SAAMI website? It is "saami.org"

Your photos prove that many on-line retailers are also ignorant of proper cartridge names. Notice that the cartridge boxes shown over the retailers description has the correct names. But yes, there are some non-SAAMI members and several off-shore manufactures that show their ignorance of proper cartridge designations.

And yes, there are several custom shellcase makers that will apply any head stamp you wish, if you are willing to pay a premium for the service.

I am on very firm ground and am historically and factually correct. You, however, have displayed much misinformation. When you find yourself in a hole, it is best to quit digging.

68 posted on 11/27/2016 9:52:41 PM PST by Buffalo Head (Illegitimi non carborundum)
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