[Robert Teesdale]

No, with biker gangs, it can be a difference of seconds. As soon as one of them pulls a gun, it is going to become a gunfight, guaranteed.

I believe you miss my point, and it may help to clarify. I am referring to the mindset involved and not necessarily the actions devolving from that mindset. There is a large difference between throwing caution to the wind and risking arrest and imprisonment by committing the relatively minor crimes of disorderly conduct, assault and criminal mischief in the presence of law enforcement - and throwing caution to the wind and committing open public murder under the rifle sights and recording devices of law enforcement.

[Boogieman]

Well, I think that just shows you don’t know these peoples’ mindset. There is no large difference for them. Loyalty to the club is a higher priority to them than any of these concerns that you hypothesize would influence them. If a rival club pulls guns, they are going to pull too, without even thinking about it. These people don’t fool around and “weigh the odds” once the violence starts. They play for keeps.

[TexasGator]

“committing open public murder under the rifle sights and recording devices of law enforcement.”

Bikers pull out gun under public surveillance ...

VIDEO linked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HMmdLciNPo