"Wolf, a professor of ecclesiastical history at University of Muenster, Germany, made the discovery and has retold it in his book The Nuns of Sant'Ambrogio."
And when those in authority heard of what was going on at that place -- what happened? They shut the place down.
So-- what 'scandal' is that for the Roman Catholic Church itself?
It's not like such goings-on were being supported, or that lesbo's were being quietly shifted from parish to parish (where they would continue their little peccadilloes...)
Perhaps you are correct to compare the two -- this lesbo nun book, and the Tuam mother and baby home story, as in how these kind of things can play out on the pages of FR.
In both, there was something of a knee-jerk, hair-partially-on-fire response from 'scandalized' Roman Catholics.
As for the book -- that was allegedly sourced from Vatican archives, if we can believe the article...
For the Tuam babies ---- there most certainly was a 'septic tank' designated on an old map of the place -- right about where the discovery of infant and small child sized human remains were.
Corliss denies saying the word "dumped". She never denied supplying the information which included strong possibility that the structure which eventually became used as burial vault was originally built to be a septic tank -- as one old map indicates that it was.
Yet there is more to the Tuam story that I came across -- that has yet to make it to the pages of FreeRepublic.
Not only were there adults from the work house days found buried on the North side of the property (which there was some slight mention of on these pages)...but not far from the 'septic tank' location...there was yet another area of graves discovered...
According to a woman who claimed she fell into a collapsed portion -- she saw shelves with what she perceived were small bodies, stacked neatly in rows.
I've lost the link to that -- but could find it again -- maybe -- but it could take me hours of rooting around, though one of the articles about use of ground-penetrating radar at the site, may be where I first encountered the info?
For it was in "comments" to an online article -- which led to an Irish radio personality who had done a bit of digging into the issue on his own, and on a few pages he had up last summer, supplied valid information which many here seem to not have seen or contemplated -- or else they would not be saying the things which they do -- like -- "it was a burial vault" (as if that had been actually proven instead of just conjectured) and that there is a map which indicates "septic" not "burial", etc... Oh, and there were even some 'architectural drawings' from the 19th century which show tunnel-like affair which lead to "tanks" outside of the footprint of the buildings themselves.
And the man who with a friend opened the 'septic tank' structure? The same radio show reporter-guy who interviewed him, also said the man related that as a boy he had encountered and explored tunnels on the Tuam property.
These kind of things could help explain why in the 'tank' (whatever it truly was) which was accessed from the top -- the bodies were in something of a disorganized pile, yet for the other "collapsed" area which a woman fell partially into (according to what seems to be as yet to be uncorroborated story) there were "shelves" and orderliness.
That area --- had been accessed by a tunnel perhaps?
So now do the right thing, Mrs. Don-o, and ping all the people which you pinged to your initial response to me on this thread, and let them question myself directly.
All I need is one single polite individual who is willing to concede the strong possibility that there was a map designating "septic tank" (or similar) right about where the underground structure where the piles of bones of babies and small children were discovered --- and I will spend the hours of digging around on the internet to -- find the map, and more.
Like -- provide here to these pages again link to the radio show interview with the individual who encountered the "tank" structure full of bones.
If you don't ping all those persons -- then let everyone see your own efforts for what they are.
Damage control. Down with all critics of the RCC! Up with "the Church" at all costs, including insinuations aimed at discrediting my own person, and my own integrity.
If you have something real on that last aspect -- BRING IT -- and spell it out. If you have something real to say -- then say it. Don't just insinuate.
That professional anti-Catholics possess such energy to generate scabrous material that might reflect badly on one Catholic institution or another only shows that Protestantism as a theological system is nearing its shameful collapse.
Let me deal with just one of your points, BlueDragon--- one which is quite sensible. I'll get to the others if I have time. (French Onion soup on the stovetop right now.)
"Herbert Wolf, a leading scholar of the Catholic Church, learned of the Sant'Ambrogio scandal when he became one of the first allowed into the archives of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith"."Wolf, a professor of ecclesiastical history at University of Muenster, Germany, made the discovery and has retold it in his book The Nuns of Sant'Ambrogio."
And when those in authority heard of what was going on at that place -- what happened? They shut the place down. So-- what 'scandal' is that for the Roman Catholic Church itself?
This is a very good point, and thanks, BlueDragon, for bringing it up. The author of the Sant'Ambrogio book, repeatedly called Herbert Wolf in the article, is Hubert Wolf, a legitimate ecclesiastical historian. He apparently wrote this account to appeal to those with University backgrounds in his field, because the customers over at Amazon who gave it low scores all described it as "dry," "dense," "legalistic," "too technical," "too academic," "page after page of scrupulous Vatican investigations, canonical charges, and due process" etc. Evidently not a bodice-ripper.
It's the Daily News which decided to skip all the social and legal history and go straight for the lesbian jiggery-pokery, making it sound like some sort of "Eurotrash horror story," in the words of one of the customer reviewers. Several others said it was disappointing to readers who were motivated principally by "prurient interest" --- although others found it prurient enough to repay their having to slog through the "presumption of innocence," forensic evidence standards and "witness protection" provisions of an 1859 Canonical Investigation.
There was an embezzler, lesbian and inveterate liar who got control of a convent in Rome in the 1850's; she was investigated by Church authorities and found guilty of peddling miracles, sexual predation, theft, attempted murder, and murder. All the evidence was handed over to the secular authorities and the criminal sister got jail time.
So you're quite right, BlueDragon: the story itself does not cast a scandalous light on the Catholic Church per se. The Church prosecutors did an excellent job. End of the story, except for the many pages of academic footnotes.
It's the Daily News, I would say, which decided to report this as some kind of Dan Brown Gothic murder mystery. They took out all the parts which were of legal or historic interest, left in the dirty bits, and headlined it like something from the supermarket tabloids.
Then came certain FReepers who shall remain unnamed (thought you can get their names by scanning this ugly thread) who specialize in scandal and defamation, and you get yet another platform for vicious generalizations against the Catholic Faith and the Consecrated Life.
I am disgusted. Where is the edification for our brothers and sisters here? Where is the grace? How I wish we in the Religion Forum would follow the standards of St. Paul:
Ephesians 4:29
Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for timely edification according to the present need, so that it will give grace to those who hear.