Posted on 08/27/2013 10:44:47 AM PDT by one guy in new jersey
Natural Born Citizen means Citizen at the moment of birth and absolutely nothing else.
You have NO legal authority on your side of this issue.
Hi. Sorry but i bowed out of that topic. Partly because of
Inaccurate assertions by folks who have not studied the matter. I have previous posted several references and others have had time to share a lot more than that. Look into the history and the concerns of the founders and look at the constitution itself. Or just observe that language is given effect when applying the constitution or any controlling statute or case. NBC is not the same thing as citizen or native citizen. It is a different phrase with a different meaning. That meaning was in circulation And rather well known And indeed was used in cases See my previous or just get a good history of the constitution. (There are partisan “experts” of both sides of the political aisle who have tried to gloss over this or massage it in their candidates’ favors so caveat emptor on those. ) But I’m out of here on this. I gave it my best in the time I had What it generates now is not scholarly discourse but rather mostly Obama and Cruz (who I like ) partisans making assertions I’ve both studied and taught this subject and while there are greater experts to be sure , this was not a big controversy until of course 2008. It was really rather widely and well understood. Now that half the country still wants to justify Obama and the other half hopes Cruz can get elected , trying to just explain what and why is quite frankly a thankless undertaking. And since our country’s constitution has been ignored or trashed or twisted into a pretzel in several additional respects now, it seems unlikely we’ll suddenly decide to reverse course and honor it on this subject of all possible provisions. A lot if people feel its only fair that if the one party can get away with something then the other party should be allowed to do likewise. Trying to explain or discuss the legal principles in this highly politicized Mileau is like the proverbial rolling of a boulder up a mountain. Bye! Best regards. Write me about something else and I will be very happy to chat with you here further. But please leave me out of this argument. Others can take it up with you with my blessings. . Thanks very much.
Totally - being born in Canada to a Cuban father has no weight whatsoever. His momma was an American citizen when he was born, and he moved here when he was 4. Without a doubt, NBC.
Thank you for your response. That is exactly how I see it as well.
Natural Born
or
Naturalized
PERIOD!
Thosee are false statements and claims as evidencedd by the SCOTUS decisions, the word definitions, and historical practices. False swearing and claims on your part or anyone else’s part does nothing whatsoever to change the historical realities that a person born abroad with U.S. parents was only a U.S. citizen at birth due to statutory laws that retroactively authorized the status, and then such status was not authorized by Congress for many years. Such making a citizen and unmaking a citizen is not possible when the person is a natural born citizen. Sen. Ted Cruz was born abroad, and he therefore cannot possibly be a natural born citizen anymoree than those persons who were denied U.S. citizenship under comparable circumstances in the 19th Century.
I recognize that you want to evade the evidence with some more false and abusive accusations and claims, but your doing so does nothing to change the historical fact that children born abroad with two natural parents having U.S. citizenship and even natural born citizenship were denied any form of U.S. citizenship on the basis those children were alien born and not U.S. citizens of any kind, especiall natural born citizens. Given the fact that these children born abroad were not U.S. citizens of any kind nor natural born citizens of the United States in the early 19th Century, then there can be no basis for a false claim that just one citizen parent is sufficient to qualify a child borm abroad in the 20th Century as a natural born citizen of the United States, when two U.S. citizen parents were incapable of qualifying the child for status as a natural born citizen or any kind of citizen whatsoever of the U.S. in the 19rh Century.
The law can and does change.
The Constitution gives CONGRESS the right to change the law.
The Constitution gives ONLY CONGRESS along with the States, the RIGHT and DUTY to determine eligibility.
The Courts have virtually no role in this process at all. Those who say otherwise are the real Anti-Constitutional Liberals.
And btw, the States ALL OF THEM, and Congress, DOWN TO EVERY LAST MEMBER -—
The all agree with ME and the all disagree with YOU!
I’ll respond to the rest of what you wrote later. For now, let’s address one point of the discussion.
Do you or do you not acknowledge the United States Government denied the status of of a natural vorn citizen of the United States for children born abroad with two natural parents having U.S. citizenship at the time of the birth? during the 19th Century?
Congress has the authority to change the requirements for Citizenship, and it has done so several times.
At the time that Cruz was born, the law made Cruz a Citizen at the Moment of his birth, and that is what Natural Born Citizen means.
Natural Born Citizen means CITIZEN AT BIRTH, under the laws in place at the time of birth, and absolutely nothing else.
Do you acknowledge or do you not acknowledge that Ted Cruz would have been without any form of U.S. citizenship, including natural born citizenship, hade his date of birth been in the year of 1932?
Do you acknowledge or not acknowledge that the Constitution enumerates the power of Congress to repeal the Public Laws it previously enacted and the power to enact Public Laws that rescind the U.S. citizenship of Ted Cruz and other persons born abroad with one or two U.S. citizen parents?
With all due respect, you have no legal training at all.
I do not answer questions from people who do not know what they are talking about.
Ted Cruz is and always will be a Natural Born Citizen, fully qualified to be President of the United States. Cruz met the requirements at the time of his birth, and that is all that is required.
Congress and the States are the ONLY authorities on this issue, and they will agree with me on these issues.
The Courts have no say, under our Constitution, on this matter, and you are fighting the Constitution if you insist on Court challenges to eligibility questions.
Dyou acknowledge or do you not acknowledge that the Government of Canada gave Ted Cruz the status of a Canadian citizen at birth in Alberta, Canada?
Do you acknowledge or do you not acknowledge that Ted Cruz was born in Alberta, Canada; given Canadian citizenship at birth along with a Canadian birth certificate; was subject to and obligated to obey the laws and regulations of the Government of Canada whether or not they conflicted with U.S. laws and regulations; was subject to and owed allegiance and a duty of obediance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom of Great Britain; and was subject to conscription into the armed forces of Canada in the event of another Canadian enactment of a conscription law?
The only thing that would make me dislike Cruz, and I expect it from all politicians eventually, is to start moderating his positions and start being comfortable “playing the game” in DC.
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