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To: ansel12
"If you are Catholic, then you might know that your denomination..."

The Catholic Church is not a denomination. By definition, if it were it would not be Catholic. It is THE One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church. Only schismatic and heretical groups are denominations.

Peace be with you

21 posted on 06/08/2013 9:55:57 PM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a book, He left us a Church.)
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To: Natural Law

No, the catholics belong to a Christian denomination, but interesting post on a Mormon thread, I think the Mormon Prophet believes that they are the only thing going and teaches that to his followers.


23 posted on 06/08/2013 10:01:08 PM PDT by ansel12 (Social liberalism/libertarianism, empowers, creates and imports, and breeds, economic liberals.)
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To: Natural Law; ansel12; All
The Catholic Church is not a denomination. By definition, if it were it would not be Catholic. It is THE One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church. Only schismatic and heretical groups are denominations.

ALL: Don't let this kind of assumption fool you.

And all of these Catholic-based "religious orders" from the chart below (& many other dozens/hundreds NOT included) exploded from how many originally?

And all these Catholic-based orders assume that their rule--their order-- is the right one...because obviously...if a previous order had it all correctly, then they were a needless overlap overkill...superfluous

Hence, haven't all these Catholic-based religious splinter orders operated as a sort of “mini-denominations” operating under the broader umbrella of Roman Catholicism?

Sorry...but Catholicism isn't as "united" as Catholics LOVE to pretend...It's not -- as is oft' presented by Catholics -- one giant monolith.

Even theologically, it's not monolithic. Liberation theology has invaded Catholicism. Solid theological reform movements – like Jansenism – hit Catholicism in the 1600s.

Some of the Roman Catholic order jumpstarters themselves bounced around before getting them off the ground. Take Isaac Thomas Hecker, founder of the Paulists (latter 19th century). Hecker was a Methodist-turned-transcendentalist-turned-member of the Catholic Redemptorist order before founding the Paulists. Hardly a “model heritage” deeply rooted Catholic.

And the “Romanizing party” was itself a party that grew stronger in the 7th century. As I look at the book of Acts, I don't see mention of “the Romanizing party” in the earliest church. Do you?

Instead of all these diverse Catholic orders, why couldn't have one said, “This is the rule of Christ. We'll follow it – and Him” ??? And then the rest of these man-made orders could have followed suit if generational stability and a unified front is so important.

Year Founded Name of Order [a 'Mini-Denomination' of Sorts] Man-Made Founder
6th century onward Benedictine-Based [Break-offs Included]
525 Benectines Benedict
Early 6th century Female Benectines Scholastica
Early 10th century Cluny [many Southern France orders were reformed under 'Clunaic lines] Odo
11th century Vallumbrosians John Gualbert
1100 A.D. Fontrevault Robert of Arbissel
1701 Mechlarists Mechitar [w/16 others]
Dominican/Augustinian Rule-based Note: The Dominican order was NOT initial order based on Augustinian rule; hence not listed first
1120 Premonstratensions [also known as Norbertians] Norbert [German-born who set up French orders and died residing in Italy]...so hardly a Middle-Ages localized presence only
Late 12th century Trinitarians [reformed group called 'Barefoot Trinitarians' still exists] John of Matha
1206 Dominicans Dominic
1210 Franciscan-Based Francis of Assisi
Franciscans also known as Friars Minor; Some Lay Franciscans known as Franciscan tertiaries; some Franciscans came to be known as 'Observatist Franciscans' others as 'Recollect Franciscans' and then 'Discalced Franciscans'...Such 'unity' of names even within the Franciscan bunch, eh?
1557 Alcantarines [Spanish Discalced Franciscans] Peter of Alcantara
Late 16th century Camillans Camillus [break-off of first Capuchins and then recollect Franciscans]
1540 Jesuit-Based
1540 Jesuits originally known as The Society of Jesus Ignatius Loyola
Cistercian-Based
About 1099 Cistercian Robert of Molesne [with Stephen Harding as key early leader]
1084 Carthusians Bruno
1128 Knights of Templar Bernard of Clairvaux
Mid-12th century Gilbertines [no local presence only; a network of 25 monasteries] Gilbert of Sempringham
Latter-17th century Trappists Armand-Jean le Bouthillier De Rance'
Ursulines/Carmelites-Based
Early 1500s Ursulines Angela Merici [Later, Barbe Jeanne Acarie helped establish Ursulines]
Latter 16th century Discalced Carmelites John of the Cross a leader, but not founder
1603 Carmelites Barbe Jeanne Acarie
Other Orders – Listed chronologically
961 Mt Athos Athanasius the Athonite
Early 1000s Camaldolesians Romauld
1113 Victorines William of Champeaux
Early 1200s Poor Clares Clare
1235 Mercedarines [Our Lady of Mercy] Peter Nolasco and Raymond of Penafort
Latter 13th century Celestines Celestine
1346 Bridgetines Bridget
1360 Gesuati John Colombini
14th century Sisters of the Visitation [the Jesuatesses] Catherine, cousin of John Colombini
Latter 14th century Brethren of the Common Life Geert de Groote and Florentius Radewijns
1425 Oblates of Mary [Later called Oblates of Torde' Specchi] Frances of Rome
1436 Minims [Ordo Fratres Minimorum] Francis of Paola
1524 Theatines [break-off of Orators of Divine Love] Cajetan and Giovanni Pietro Caraffa (Pope Paul IV)
1532 The Somaschi Emiliani Jerome
1548 Confraternity of the Most Holy Trinity Philip Neri
1572 The Brothers Hospitalliers John of God
Cistercian-Based
1575 Oratorians Philip Neri
16th century Volokolamsk Joseph of Volokolamsk
1597 Piarists Joseph Calasanctius
Early 1600s Jansenism [not an “order” but a theological reform movement] Cornelius Otto Jansen
Very early 17th century Visitation Francis of Sales and Frances de Chantel
1633 Sisters of Charity, Lazarites Vincent de Paul
1737 Vincent de Paul Society Frederick Ozanam
1737 Passionists Paul of the Cross
1835 Pious Society of Missions/Pallottini Fathers Vincent Pallotti
1843 Similar Pious Society of Missions for women Vincent Pallotti
Mid-19th century Sisters of Providence/Fathers of Charity Antonio Rosmini-Serbati
1859 Salesians [Female version: Daughters of Our Lady Help of Christians, 3rd largest Catholic order today] Giovanni Melchior Bosco
1880 Sisters of the Sacred Heart Frances Cabrini
Latter 19th century Paulists [break-off of Redemptorists] Isaac Thomas Hecker
1903 Catholic Daughters of the Americas
1917 Baptized and Unbaptized Disciples Narayan Vaman Tilak
1933 Little Brothers of Jesus/Little Sisters of the Sacred Heart Formed post-humously after the rule of Charles Eugene DeFoucald
1939 Sisters of Jesus Formed post-humously after the rule of Charles Eugene DeFoucald
1958 Little Brothers of the Gospel Formed post-humously after the rule of Charles Eugene DeFoucald
1965 Little Sisters of the Gospel Formed post-humously after the rule of Charles Eugene DeFoucald

25 posted on 06/08/2013 10:06:36 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Natural Law
The Catholic Church is not a denomination. By definition, if it were it would not be Catholic. It is THE One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church. Only schismatic and heretical groups are denominations.

No, it's your church, plain and simple. You believe it is the one and only church, but it is not.

The only Church that God cares about, are those souls whose lives have been redeemed by the blood of Christ, their sins forgiven and their hearts changed.

Membership in the Catholic Church will gain you nothing with God, if your heart has not been changed, if you have not been born again.

Membership in the Catholic Church will not automatically gain you a spot in heaven. However, if you are born-again, sins forgiven you do have a place in heaven.
68 posted on 06/08/2013 11:44:33 PM PDT by SoConPubbie (Mitt and Obama: They're the same poison, just a different potency)
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To: Natural Law

ex-Catholics make the best MORMONs .

http://mormon2catholic.wordpress.com/2006/01/28/catholics-make-good-mormons-but-do-mormons-make-good-catholics/


112 posted on 06/09/2013 3:23:41 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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