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To: philman_36; Perdogg; LucyT; MestaMachine; C. Edmund Wright; randita; cripplecreek; allmendream; ...
"The question of citizenship at birth turns on the citizenship statute in effect at the time he was born."

We're right back to where we were years ago...what statute are you talking about? Are you talking about a statute from USC 8?

And isn't Congress' authority only related to establishing a uniform rule of naturalization?

So how can a statute written after the Constitution was written have a higher standing than the Constitution?

In inverse order: It can't (have higher standing than the Constitution); I haven't researched the question but as far as I know and certainly as far as the Constitution goes, it (the authority of Congress is limited to naturalization) is.

That is what I thought I said.

If what you are asking is how he gets to be a citizen at birth without being under the naturalization power, the answer is I don't know; I haven't looked at international law and other authorities on the question and probably should; but I don't see that he does.

But--there is no reason Congress can't exercise its naturalization power to make a person a naturalized citizen at birth either; and I would see that as what the citizenship statutes do.

So if you thought he got in under a citizenship statute at birth, he became a citizen at birth--it is just that he is a naturalized citizen, not a Natural Born Citizen.

If that reasoning is sound, and it may not be correct, it is the answer to the Natural Born question as far as person's born outside the US.

Frankly, I think that casts doubt also on the ancient historical question as to Goldwater--how does Goldwater get to be Natural Born?

57 posted on 03/06/2013 4:52:23 PM PST by David
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To: David

There is a difference between a naturalized citizen and a natural born citizen. A naturalized citizen can be created by statute, but a natural born citizen is only such by circumstance.


59 posted on 03/06/2013 5:13:14 PM PST by 9YearLurker
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To: David
But--there is no reason Congress can't exercise its naturalization power to make a person a naturalized citizen at birth either; and I would see that as what the citizenship statutes do.
Let me see if I can put this another way...

We are each born male or female, right? This is a "State of Nature", something that simply is. (I won't get into anomalies such as hermaphrodites as this is a basic example)

Now, Congress can come along and pass a statute that says a person's gender is to be decided by that person upon reaching their maturity. A man can call himself a woman, but his "State of Nature" is that he is a man.
A man will always be a man and a woman will always be a woman. If you've got the right parts an intelligent human knows what gender you are and Congress can never pass a law that can dispute natural law. A tree is a tree, not a bush, and one simply can't be the other by natural law.

A natural born citizen exists in a "State of Nature" and no statute can grant such a thing.

It's not that complicated of a concept! How you don't grasp it is beyond me!

68 posted on 03/06/2013 6:52:39 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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