Posted on 04/02/2011 7:53:41 AM PDT by JoeProBono
A hush fell over the crowd filling the elegant hall in downtown Richmond, Va. The vote was about to be announced, and a young staffer of the Museum of the Confederacy balanced his laptop across his knees, poised to get out the news as soon as it was official.
Who would be chosen "Person of the Year, 1861"?
Five historians had made impassioned nominations, and the audience would now decide.
Most anywhere else, the choice would be obvious. Who but Abraham Lincoln? But this was a vote in the capital of the rebellion that Lincoln put down, sponsored by a museum dedicated to his adversary. How would Lincoln and his war be remembered in this place, in our time?
A century and a half have passed since Lincoln's crusade to reunify the United States. The North and the South still split deeply on many issues, not least the conflict they still call by different names. All across the bloodstained arc where the Civil War raged, and beyond, Americans are deciding how to remember....
(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...
Since this is an anonymous inter-net chat room anyone of us could be anyone at all. Notwithstanding, I’m not assailing the US Navy or the ‘’gentleman’’ per se, I’m just a little fed up with the glorious ‘’Lost cause’’ bs. And I don’t need anyone’s ‘’education’’ thank you.
Lee’s will was filed in a distant county, so he could hide the ownership of his slave, Nancy, and her 4 boys. Interesting that he only kept the boys... what happened to the girls.... Of course fathering children on his slaves was honorable. Of course selling slaves was honorable. Of course paying debts was honorable. Of course pursuing runaway slaves was honorable. So everything Lee did was very precisely honorable. As are you, my dear sir.
Rather odd that south Carolina wanted to end states’ right to forbid slavery within their own boundary, and wanted to coopt the federal government to enforce their domestic institutions within the boundary of another state. Yes, you said it right, the Slavers wanted the federal government to be their servant, to coerce the other states. When it looked like that would not happen, they fired on US soldiers performing their duty.
Not despicable. Not untrue. Just an illustration how differently we see honor now, thanks to the abolition movement. Raping slaves was well within the rights of slave owners or even employees. Selling female slaves to serve in brothels was common, and the prices paid were very high if they were mostly white. Lee had to pay off his father in law’s debts, and had to free the slaves named in his father in law’s will. And he did it. Where did the money come from? From working slaves before they were given their freedom. From selling slaves that were not named in his father in law’s will, and getting a very good price, depite the glut on the market. Lee’s slave Nancy was given her freedom in Lee’s will, along with her 4 sons. He filed his will in a western county, to hide it from his neighbors. His daughters by Nancy are not mentioned in the will. They helped him supplement his army pay while he lived in Texas.
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| Secession Timeline various sources |
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| [Although very late in the war Lee wanted freedom offered to any of the slaves who would agree to fight for the Confederacy, practically no one was stupid enough to fall for that. In any case, Lee was definitely not fighting to end slavery, instead writing that black folks are better off in bondage than they were free in Africa, and regardless, slavery will be around until Providence decides, and who are we to second guess that? And the only reason the masters beat their slaves is because of the abolitionists.] Robert E. Lee letter -- "...There are few, I believe, in this enlightened age, who will not acknowledge that slavery as an institution is a moral and political evil. It is idle to expatiate on its disadvantages. I think it is a greater evil to the white than to the colored race. While my feelings are strongly enlisted in behalf of the latter, my sympathies are more deeply engaged for the former. The blacks are immeasurably better off here than in Africa, morally, physically, and socially. The painful discipline they are undergoing is necessary for their further instruction as a race, and will prepare them, I hope, for better things. How long their servitude may be necessary is known and ordered by a merciful Providence. Their emancipation will sooner result from the mild and melting influences of Christianity than from the storm and tempest of fiery controversy. This influence, though slow, is sure. The doctrines and miracles of our Saviour have required nearly two thousand years to convert but a small portion of the human race, and even among Christian nations what gross errors still exist! While we see the course of the final abolition of human slavery is still onward, and give it the aid of our prayers, let us leave the progress as well as the results in the hands of Him who, chooses to work by slow influences, and with whom a thousand years are but as a single day. Although the abolitionist must know this, must know that he has neither the right not the power of operating, except by moral means; that to benefit the slave he must not excite angry feelings in the master..." |
December 27, 1856 |
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| Platform of the Alabama Democracy -- the first Dixiecrats wanted to be able to expand slavery into the territories. It was precisely the issue of slavery that drove secession -- and talk about "sovereignty" pertained to restrictions on slavery's expansion into the territories. | January 1860 |
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| Abraham Lincoln nominated by Republican Party | May 18, 1860 |
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| Abraham Lincoln elected | November 6, 1860 |
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| Robert Toombs, Speech to the Georgia Legislature -- "...In 1790 we had less than eight hundred thousand slaves. Under our mild and humane administration of the system they have increased above four millions. The country has expanded to meet this growing want, and Florida, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, Texas, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, and Missouri, have received this increasing tide of African labor; before the end of this century, at precisely the same rate of increase, the Africans among us in a subordinate condition will amount to eleven millions of persons. What shall be done with them? We must expand or perish. We are constrained by an inexorable necessity to accept expansion or extermination. Those who tell you that the territorial question is an abstraction, that you can never colonize another territory without the African slavetrade, are both deaf and blind to the history of the last sixty years. All just reasoning, all past history, condemn the fallacy. The North understand it better - they have told us for twenty years that their object was to pen up slavery within its present limits - surround it with a border of free States, and like the scorpion surrounded with fire, they will make it sting itself to death." | November 13, 1860 |
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| Alexander H. Stephens -- "...The first question that presents itself is, shall the people of Georgia secede from the Union in consequence of the election of Mr. Lincoln to the Presidency of the United States? My countrymen, I tell you frankly, candidly, and earnestly, that I do not think that they ought. In my judgment, the election of no man, constitutionally chosen to that high office, is sufficient cause to justify any State to separate from the Union. It ought to stand by and aid still in maintaining the Constitution of the country. To make a point of resistance to the Government, to withdraw from it because any man has been elected, would put us in the wrong. We are pledged to maintain the Constitution." | November 14, 1860 |
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| South Carolina | December 20, 1860 |
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| Mississippi | January 9, 1861 |
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| Florida | January 10, 1861 |
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| Alabama | January 11, 1861 |
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| Georgia | January 19, 1861 |
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| Louisiana | January 26, 1861 |
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| Texas | February 23, 1861 |
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| Abraham Lincoln sworn in as President of the United States |
March 4, 1861 |
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| Arizona territory | March 16, 1861 |
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| CSA Vice President Alexander H. Stephens, Cornerstone speech -- "...last, not least. The new constitution has put at rest, forever, all the agitating questions relating to our peculiar institution -- African slavery as it exists amongst us -- the proper status of the negro in our form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution. Jefferson in his forecast, had anticipated this, as the 'rock upon which the old Union would split.' He was right. What was conjecture with him, is now a realized fact." | March 21, 1861 |
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| Virginia | adopted April 17,1861 ratified by voters May 23, 1861 |
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| Arkansas | May 6, 1861 |
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| North Carolina | May 20, 1861 |
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| Tennessee | adopted May 6, 1861 ratified June 8, 1861 |
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| West Virginia declares for the Union | June 19, 1861 |
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| Missouri | October 31, 1861 |
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| "Convention of the People of Kentucky" | November 20, 1861 |
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You dodged the primary issue Obammasucker. I am saying that NJ has the some of the most aggressive laws against the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution; and I nowhere said that the Confederacy would have been better or worse. I am saying right now that NJ is a socialist hellhole with respect to gun rights. NJ also has the highest property taxes in the nation. NJ isn't anywhere right with respect to gun rights in the US Constitution or the Confederate Constitution for that matter.
You’re particularly audacious today cva ;-) You spew your seditious crap and then complain about others being nasty?!
I see he didn’t favor the hoops that he had to jump through to pay his father in law’s debts, free the slaves, and leave the land to his grandchildren. He was a bit grumpy about the burdens it put on the White Race... He was aware that his daughters after being sold to the brothels would pay for his father in law’s poor management and the low productivity of slave plantations.
If you revisit my statement to you, you will see it isn't an education I'm suggesting.
Would you mind sharing what you know of the abolitionists? Do you believe that bond labor (indentured servitude) is a form of slavery?
He was aware that his daughters after being sold to the brothels would pay for his father in law’s poor management and the low productivity of slave plantations.
This appears to be your personal theory and should be noted as such. I notice you haven't chosen to share any theories regarding US Major Robert Anderson's slaves.
If your definition of sedition includes defending the republic of our founders then I appear guilty.
>Can you carry a pistol in your car without registration? Can you have 100 rifles that aren’t registered in your house and carry them to a shoot? <
Heck, doc. He can’t even pump his own gasoline in Joisey, can you, Snooki?
What you are experiencing is what passes for knowledge at universities that special in appeasing a certain race.
special = specializes
n. (law) an illegal action inciting resistance to lawful authority and tending to cause the disruption or overthrow of the government.
Nope. Nothing there about defending anything - which of course you don't do at any rate. Your rants have been consistent - you hate the Republic and long for its demise.
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