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Apple's Jobs criticizes Flash's 'closed system'
Reuters ^ | Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:43am EDT

Posted on 04/29/2010 10:07:50 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach

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To: ctdonath2

My understanding is that Silverlight apps also won’t run on the iPad, is that right?


61 posted on 04/29/2010 12:01:50 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Noumenon
You were saying ...

Well, I didn't say that, but I certainly agree with it, so let's move on.

You might be new here, so it will pay to know that the first person on the ping list is the quoted person and the second and third and so-on person -- they are the "pingees" ... either because they responded or were replied to or said something in regards to it or are interested parties ...

That's the way it works on Free Republic ... :-)


Which platform has the widest array of applications and other software - stiil, today? And who outsold whom? And continues to do so? Which architecture domintes the business world?

Well, the reason why the Windows platform is going downhill now and the reason why the Mac OS X platform is increasing now -- is because the Windows platform is so full of holes that they've got over 100,000 viruses/malware (and rising all the time) on that platform, while the Mac OS X has not even the number to equal the fingers on one hand... if even that much.

You can't find more than that (if that much) for the Mac OS X that infects and has spread among the Mac OS X users. For the last decade or more, the Macintosh users can't even be persuaded to get anti-virus software for their computers, because there's nothing out there that has infected and spread among the Mac OS X users...

Of course, there are those who say, "But, but..., it will happen ... " -- however nothing's been happening for the last decade.

So, that's why you find more and more Windows users moving over to the Mac OS X platform, since they're tired of the holes in the Windows platform that allow the over 100,000 viruses run rampant on those machines.

What Apple has found is that over 50% of the buyers of the Macintosh at the Apple Retail Stores are Windows users that have never owned a Macintosh before... hoo-boy! What a deal!

And that keeps right on going. So, I'm glad to welcome over all the former Windows users over to the safe Mac OS X platform.

In addition, you can run all the software from many platforms, if you wish... like Windows and/o Linux and/or UNIX and/or who-knows-what-else that they're running on the Macintosh. Some Windows users say that Windows even runs better and faster on a Macintosh ... LOL ...

BUT, what you'll also find is that Apple is not sitting on its haunches and "riding it out" in the last century paradigm for computers, like Windows is. Apple has taken over the "mobile platform" and is the "new standard" for excellence and wildly successful products for "going all things mobile".

Apple has about 90% of the laptop market for the $1,000 machines and up. And, it's taking over the mobile market in iPhone, iPod Touch and iPad, with 100 Million devices by the end of 2010.

Apple is going forward, while Windows sits in the past.... what a deal! :-)

62 posted on 04/29/2010 12:11:35 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: ctdonath2
When you buy a product touted as having an 11+ hour battery life, and it lasts for 2, you’re going to blame someone.

My car can go 400 miles on one tank of gas, if driven carefully. But if I drive 100+ mph the tank won't last half that much. Should I call my lawyer? :-)

Ask any Hulu.com user how long they run Flash for (hint: feature films average 2 hours).

It's their battery and their choice. Of course it doesn't help that Apple elected to use non-swappable batteries.

The assumption is one will always use it unplugged.

Again, *whose* assumption? I thought the user is the boss here, not Apple. How Apple can possibly decide that? I may want to nail the iPad to the wall, plug it in permanently and play Flash video from my security camera all day long. Why Apple would interfere with my plans? Their way or highway?

As for enabling Flash only when plugged in, c’mon - will most users be accepting of Flash apps not running when unplugged?

Enable Flash and find out :-) There is no other way to know. Second-guessing is never reliable; in this case it is even offensive (would you like me to decide for you what newspapers you should read?)

Even if that is deemed an acceptable solution, there are plenty of other problems with Flash

I posted another comment about that. Personally I haven't seen a single Flash failure in years; and it now supports multitouch.

63 posted on 04/29/2010 12:15:30 PM PDT by Greysard
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To: dfwgator; ctdonath2
You were saying ...

My understanding is that Silverlight apps also won’t run on the iPad, is that right?

Ummm... that's not another one of those proprietary things for use on the web, is it? :-)

Microsoft Silverlight

I don't know what it is that some companies want to make the entire web their "playground" with their own proprietary standards, that everyone else on the web must use ... LOL ...

Heck! Let everyone pick their own machine to use, if they want, proprietary components or not, on that machine -- but don't make the Web proprietary too... doncha know... :-)

64 posted on 04/29/2010 12:17:56 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: discostu
You were saying ...

I read it. And that first part is a fat pile of hypocrisy. notice how carefully he ignores over a decade of Macs being closed and all the iGadgets being closed. Again it’s the “you can’t put your stuff on my closed system because it’s closed”, that is pretty much the definition of hypocrisy.

From what I understand -- a company can make whatever products that they want and they can be proprietary in their parts and/or design and/or its functionality as far as that device is concerned -- and that's fine.

The reason why it's fine is that you can buy that device or machine and/or software or not. No problem.

BUT, there is only one web out there and you don't have too much choice on what to do if the web is going to use something proprietary by one company (no matter whether they charge nothing or a little money or whatever) for it.

For the web and how you access it (those standards and its functionality) -- that's an area that needs to remain open and non-proprietary.

And that's not a contradiction with having a machine with proprietary components in it, or a "proprietary operating system" for running that machine -- when you are accessing the web.

You see... here we're talking about the web and those standards by which others can access those various websites and parts of the web -- either with those proprietary standards or with open standards.

For the web, kick out the proprietary standards and kick out the companies who want to make the web their own "proprietary playground" with stuff that only they control -- and keep open standards there -- no matter what machine you use to access that web.

65 posted on 04/29/2010 12:24:36 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Greysard
You uses the power, you takes your risks.

What percentage of iPhone users have a clue as to their power demand? They take their phone off the charger at home, and use whatever app makes them happy. That night,they plug the phone back in and repeat. If they find that they are out of power at noon - they will practically NEVER say "Oh, I guess I shouldn't have watched that TV show on Hulu.". No, they will curse Apple for making such a great phoen with such a lousy battery.

A really good example of power drain is 'tethering'. Recently plugged a fully charged jailbroken iPhone in, ran My WiFi and tethered an iPad to it. After 3 hrs of use, the PLUGGED IN iPhone was now half-drained when we unplugged it to go to lunch. Yup, the tethering drew more power than the charger delivered - so the battery drained almost half-way in 3 hrs.

Software emulation is not really noticable to the user - unless the user is aware of how to check the processor's load. Windows provides a function in Task Manager, so open that little puppy up - then launch a Flash based video from Hulu and watch how much Flash adds to your processor's overhead.

Now, this does not include the security issues that have plagued Flash for years; presently the Apple OS is based on Unix and is pretty robust and secure. Flash is a means for low-level access to protected processes. And, as Apple has pointed out - there is no longer a need for Flash - you can do anything Flash does with HTML5, and HTML5 is not only secure, it's 'free'.

66 posted on 04/29/2010 12:26:34 PM PDT by Hodar (Who needs laws .... when this "feels" so right?)
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To: ctdonath2

I prefer his approach over Microsoft’s ...which is to maintain legacy computability forever....much of the reason for the HUGE malware problem ....


67 posted on 04/29/2010 12:35:17 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach ( Support Geert Wilders)
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To: Protect the Bill of Rights

If you view FR with a white background, try highlighting my entire comment space... ‘-)


68 posted on 04/29/2010 12:45:13 PM PDT by TXnMA (Remember the Alamo! Remember Goliad! REPEAT San Jacinto!!)
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To: Star Traveler

You might want to put down that jug of kool-Aid, son. You’ll be the better for it.


69 posted on 04/29/2010 12:46:49 PM PDT by Noumenon ("Upon what meat doth this our Caesar feed, that he has grown so great?" - Julius Caesar)
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To: Star Traveler

I don’t have a problem with Apple being proprietary. All I’m pointing out is that Jobs built his empire on closed system, most of the stuff his system sells is STILL a closed system, and therefore his complaining that somebody else has a closed system is hypocritical. If Gates made the same complaint you’d agree, just like Jobs he built his empire on a closed system. Some people not in a position to lay certain types of criticism, this is like Michael Bay complaining a movie has too many special effects and not enough plot.

The fact that it’s on the web has nothing to do with it. It’s still a closed system guy complaining about something because it’s a closed system. That’s hypocrisy, pure and simple.


70 posted on 04/29/2010 12:47:07 PM PDT by discostu (wanted: brick, must be thick and well kept)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
I was having problems when browsing. Shortened battery life and high temperatures. Downloaded a CPU monitoring widget and found that flash was the biggest resource hog. Another freeper gave a link for a flash blocker. The flash blocker allows you to select which images you want while leaving the advertisements unloaded. After installing my computer ran faster, battery life was dramatically improved and the CPU temperature became nominal while surfing.

I am surprised that people try to defend flash. I hear the defense that 9 billion flies eat s**t so everyone should use flash, however it is not compatible with a mobile battery driven platform.
71 posted on 04/29/2010 12:47:28 PM PDT by PA Engineer (Liberate America from the occupation media.)
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To: Star Traveler

He who owns the standards owns the item. That’s why they’re putting proprietary stuff out there. That’s how MS first went after the web browser market, they realized there was a standard out there being used by millions of people and not only did they not own it they didn’t have anything out there trying to own it. There’s a lot of money in owning standards.


72 posted on 04/29/2010 12:52:00 PM PDT by discostu (wanted: brick, must be thick and well kept)
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To: Hodar
What percentage of iPhone users have a clue as to their power demand? [...] Software emulation is not really noticable to the user - unless the user is aware of how to check the processor's load.

Well, that's something that Apple can, and should tell the user. My laptop can predict for how long the battery will last, given the current power draw. Why the iPhone, a marvel of technology, can't do the same?

launch a Flash based video from Hulu and watch how much Flash adds to your processor's overhead.

If Adobe can't make a Flash player that runs under 100% of the CPU utilization then it's Adobe's problem, isn't it? Apple would have a great cause to not allow that specific Flash player just because it doesn't work.

And, as Apple has pointed out - there is no longer a need for Flash

That's a dream. Half of Web sites out there use Flash for one thing or another. It's presumptuous to believe that all of them will ask "how high?" when Apple tells them to jump. Existing investment into Flash is huge, and many Web sites (such as industry sites) can't care less about Apple.

you can do anything Flash does with HTML5, and HTML5 is not only secure, it's 'free'.

"Flash Player 10.1 was actually 58% more efficient than HTML5 in Google Chrome on the Windows system tested" (link). That's what happens when Adobe is allowed to optimize the product.

73 posted on 04/29/2010 12:53:22 PM PDT by Greysard
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To: VanDeKoik

Actually Flash is WORSE than Jobs is saying. It’s a giant pig and horribly unstable. Before Adobe bought it Flash wasn’t too bad, but Adobe has been bloatwaring and destabilizing it with every release. There’s actually been quite a lot of complaining about Flash, especially after the Adobe acquisition when its quality started to plummet.


74 posted on 04/29/2010 12:57:50 PM PDT by discostu (wanted: brick, must be thick and well kept)
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To: RJS1950
Apple invented the concept of closed systems. They are the king of proprietary hardware and software.

So true! And I love my MacBook Pro and iPod.

Yet I am an open source dude. Go figure.


75 posted on 04/29/2010 1:00:27 PM PDT by rdb3 (The mouth is the exhaust pipe of the heart.)
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To: discostu

So YouTube being one of the most used sites in history, serving over a billion videos a day, is powered by something that is a “giant pig and horribly unstable”?

Are we all just not paying attention?

Flash is only as good as the person coding with it is.

If you use an iPhone app that is garbage and unstable, does that mean the iPhone OS is a pig?


76 posted on 04/29/2010 1:06:49 PM PDT by VanDeKoik (Iran doesnt have a 2nd admendment. Ya s ee how that turned out?)
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To: Noumenon
You were saying ...

You might want to put down that jug of kool-Aid, son. You’ll be the better for it.

I find Windows users carry around the biggest jugs of Kool-Aid around... doncha know ... LOL ...

77 posted on 04/29/2010 1:07:38 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: VanDeKoik

Just because it’s used doesn’t mean it’s good.

People probably aren’t paying attention. How many other web video options do you know about? How many have you used? Done any speed comparisons.

Flash can’t be better than the person coding with it, but the person coding with Flash can’t be better than Flash. Flash has problems, and plenty of them:
http://flashcrash.dempsky.org/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/02/09/adobe_flash_crash_bug/
http://forums.adobe.com/search.jspa?resultTypes=DOCUMENT&resultTypes=MESSAGE&resultTypes=COMMUNITY&resultTypes=TASK&resultTypes=PROJECT&resultTypes=SOCIAL_GROUP&resultTypes=COMMENT&peopleEnabled=true&q=crash
http://www.lockergnome.com/oztech/2009/02/17/adobe-flash-slow-choppy-and-sucks/
http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/02/why-do-adobe-flash-videos-slow-down/

The jury has been in for a while, Flash is a pig and unstable.


78 posted on 04/29/2010 1:16:13 PM PDT by discostu (wanted: brick, must be thick and well kept)
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To: TXnMA

LMAO! That was funnier!


79 posted on 04/29/2010 1:36:12 PM PDT by Protect the Bill of Rights (Just another loony nationalistic egotist.)
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To: TXnMA

LMAO! That was funnier!


80 posted on 04/29/2010 1:36:12 PM PDT by Protect the Bill of Rights (Just another loony nationalistic egotist.)
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