Conspiracy? Something keeps bothering me about this Birth Certificate thing

11/28/2008 | Neverbluffer

[neverbluffer]

Ok, we all have doubts about the birth certificate. But, several things keep bothering me. From reading many blogs and posts, the same issues continue to raised.

1. Why is nobody in the MSM, including all the people we thought would be all over this... Hannity, O'Reilly, Levin, Rush, etc completely silent on the issue?

2. Why was Senate Resolution 511 drafted? Most notably, by all Democrats who seemed to be defending John Mccains birth eligibility. Why would Democrats go out of their way to draft such a resolution. The primary sponsor was Claire McCaskill, who we all know has been so much in the tank for Obama and practically has a crush on him. Why was this resoultion drafted in April 2008 right when it was obvious that barack wuld win the nomination over Hillary. Why did Barack co-sponsor this legislation and add language, when he normally was never in Washington during the campaign time?

It is obvious to me. Senate resoultion 511 addressed the issue of John McCains "natural born" status, so the issue could be brought to the table without mentioning Obama. But, could be used in Ovama's defense if the issue ever arose. In my opinion, several Senate Democrats including "The One" created an ALIBI!!! Senator Leahy even when so far as to get Michael Chertoff to agree, that it is their interpretation that anybody born to an American citizen is "Natural Born"

Remember, Claire McCaskill was also a potential VP nominee.

Am I crazy here? I think that if this issue of birth certificate ever becomes a problem, there will be a reference to the senate respolution to muddy the legal waters.

Somehting bigger than just the birth certificate is going on here. There seems to be a whole consipracy!

Please share your thoughts.

[tomkat]

No birth certificate. No peace

Having seen variations of the above on numerous threads,
imho none of them roll off the tongue easily enough to be good sign material.

Try:

No Proof
No Peace

Has the same self-melodic thing goin' on as our Get Outta Cheney's House ! that further unhinged the Gork back in the day ...

[limeade]

The text to Resolution 511 is pretty specific as to what it refers to: "Whereas there is no evidence of the intention of the Framers or any Congress to limit the constitutional rights of children born to Americans serving in the military nor to prevent those children from serving as their country's President;"

[Irishhighlander]

It does not matter what Congress does or tries to do; The US Constitution is the over riding authority here. The only way Obama can become POTUS; if he truly is not a naural born citizen is an amendment to the Constitution. That would take years; I do not beleive 38 states would act on it once they found out he lied about his status for the last two years!

[Irishhighlander]

The problem here is both of McCains parents were American Citizens at time of his birth. BO father was a British subject at time of his birth. Chertoff says “if you are born of American parents” Plural not singular.

“My assumption and my understanding is that if you are born of American parents, you are naturally a natural-born American citizen,” Chertoff replied.”

I think Chertoff understood the question and answered correctly. I believe Bush knows the truth; his spokesman haven't offered a real comment when asked a question; if they thought it was crazy; my guess is they would have out right dismissed the question as such.

I believe the best solution is to let SCOTUS rule on the matter. Its a Constitutional issue and let it be decided that way and it gives cover to everyone. That way MSM will have cover and say we didn't know about that part of the Constitution.

[nanetteclaret]

I have thought that it might be the dates, also. I don't know enough about the details of Stanley's life to put out the scenario you have, but the thought definitely crossed my mind that it could be the dates. I surmised on another thread that perhaps he was born before Hawaii became a state, but was shot down on that theory because the details of Stanley's life didn't match up. Your theory of a discrepancy of months (as opposed to years) makes more sense.

[DrC]

You asked about sources for (in italics):

1. applied to a Chicago university and it appears that was always her plan in the summer of 1960
Ann did get early acceptance at U Chicago (from which I think one can reasonably infer intent/hope/plan to attend), but her father blocked this: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1729524-3,00.html

2. she didn’t get pregnant in November and deliver in August 1961

3. She was pregnant probably in late July or early August of 1960...and likely delivered at the end of April or early May 1961
There is no such evidence for #2 or #3. This is raw speculation. Moreover, it fails to square with the contemporaneous letters being sent by Ann to various former high school friends. http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/chi-0703270151mar27-archive,0,91024,full.story

4. they married at the end of April 1961,
This is flatly contradicted by the only documentary evidence of this marriage: its later dissolution. To my knowledge, the divorce decree is the only "official" record of this marriage. To my knowledge, divorce decree itself has never been made public, but the above link and other news accounts suggest it is reasonable to believe it exists. It's POSSIBLE there's a massive MSM conspiracy to fabricate both the divorce decree and the marriage date contained there-in; the principle of Occam's razor suggests a far more plausible alternative.

5. they arrive six weeks into the fall semester in 1960
I've heard this repeated more than once, but never seen evidence offered. Stanley's father had found his Hawaii job by the time she graduated from high school: "Seemingly out of the blue, her father had found a better opportunity -- another furniture store, this one in Hawaii. "He just couldn't settle," Box recalled." http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/chi-0703270151mar27-archive,0,91024,full.story. So again, it's certainly possible it took from June until September to finally get settled in Honolulu. But if a strategic decision already had been made that family would relocate and Ann would attend UH in fall, it would seem surprising that parents who apparently were very devoted to ensuring she got a good education through high school would put that at risk by letting her start so late in the semester. True, it could be argued that parents who really wanted the best for that daughter never would have forced her to give one of the world's foremost universities (Chicago) in favor of a much lower-ranked public university.

But in light of her dad's job situation, my guess is that finances may have been a non-trivial consideration even though it was justified/framed/argued on completely different grounds. Early admission was a great honor, but unless accompanied by scholarship resources--far more rare back then than today--attending Chicago may literally have been out of reach. This was before the days of there being readily-available student loans for college. Indeed, even UH may have been affordable if and only if Ann lived at home rather than have to pay for room and board etc.

[Uncle Chip]

The Resolution is wrong. John McCain, although born of two American parents, was not born in the Panama Canal Zone or on an American military base. He was born in Colon, the Republic of Panama, in a civilian hospital.

You're right -- but note how they defined "natural born" in the Resolution. Their definition by virtue of their "whereas's" included two American parents -- not just one. Thus this Senate resolution backs up Leo Donofrio's argument and essentially admits to it: both parents must be American citizens not just one.

Thus Obama fails this Senate definition of "natural born" with just what is currrently in the public domain and even in that forgery on his own website.

This very Resolution is testimony against any Senator who would vote to accept Obama's electoral votes in January. Are they going to deny that they voted for it????

[caver]

Congrats, you have posted number 4,349,678 in a line of neverending vanities concerning Barry’s birth certificate. This positively makes FR look like a conspiracy based forum.

[patriotspride]

” Bottom line: I was trying to point out that I don’t trust any politician in Washington or anywhere else to do the right thing. That was the point I was trying to make.”

And you are right. There are many of us who question the real level of pre-cooked deals...........

The only way to change this is to go for candidates who are solid on core principles.

The Dems have shown that even with illogical core principles they can get more of them to vote than us.....

That’s reality, and the sooner we realize that thier motto is

” What’s mine is mine, and what’s yours should be mine” and combat it the better off we will be.

Thanks for standing on your beliefs.

[txrangerette]

I can answer your questions but you might not accept the answers.

Rush et al are not 100% certain of the facts here. Suspicions aren’t enough for them to risk their reputations and make this a cause celeb, only to have the rug pulled out at the end.

They don’t wish to become associated in the public mind with some of these individuals filing lawsuits, either, not being certain that either the individuals or the lawsuits will turn out to be legit. And that includes Alan Keyes.

President Bush has always, always, always said when something is under litigation in the courts he wishes not not comment on it. He has said that in all other situations I’m aware of, therefore acting in that manner now would fit his prior stated philosophy and conduct.

You must understand, finally, that even if the BC situation is murky and the waters muddied up, these people you are castigating do not want to be the ones to make it THEIR ISSUE, in that it involves the first African American ever to be elected President of the United States.

They especially don’t want to if the courts are litigating the matter.

And Sarah Palin is no different in that regard.

Sorry to disappoint you with answers you would rather not accept.

I’m merely pointing out the obvious answers...they are out there staring us all in the face.

[mo]

“What about HILLARY? When she was running against Obama, she became quite desperate near the end. Yet, she never brought up the COLB issue....”

IMHO, she did, finally, get hold of his birth certificate...

“But Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton hugged, kissed and joined forces in Orlando last night to launch a concerted three-day push to win over undecided voters in the key swing state.....”

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/oct/21/obama-clinton-florida-democrat-election

but probably not until October!

[txrangerette]

Please see my post #50.

[joygrace]

Interesting post. Rev. Wright in one of his sermons referred to BHO’s mother as a “single mother.”

I don’t know if that statement admits she was legally single or geographically single since BHO’s Kenyan father abandoned the family.

I believe the Kenyan Dad is his Dad but I don’t believe he ever married his Mom ever. This may be a source of shame for BHO but I don’t think it has legal bearing on the “natural born” requirement for US President. I think the fact that Obama was born as a dual citizen makes him absolutely not eligible to become President.

We may never be able to see the true valid birth certificate. I believe he was born in Kenya which of course cancels himself out immediately as being “natural born.” TRUTH will rise up out of the ashes.

Those covering for him will be forever remembered as part of the biggest conspiracy in the United States history. DNC, Howard Dean, Nancy Pelosi,RNC, Congess...etc. have aided and abetted a fraud. I hope they are proud of themselves.

Thanks for your post.

[UglyinLA]

caver wrote: Congrats, you have posted number 4,349,678 in a line of neverending vanities concerning Barry’s birth certificate. This positively makes FR look like a conspiracy based forum.

Sorry Caver, I only counted 117,209 posts in regards to Barry’s birth certificate. You’re BIG number looks like a forgery.

[FreeAtlanta]

Somehting bigger than just the birth certificate is going on here. There seems to be a whole consipracy!

Every honest and thinking person's radar should be going off. There is a lot of stinky rotten fish being passed around by the elite snobs that are ruling over us peasants.

When did we go from "We the People" to "We the Suckers"?

[FreeAtlanta]

What worries me is the shock and then violence from all the uninformed Obama supporters, if this happens suddenly. They need to know there is an issue so that it will start sinking in that Obama might not take office.

[Colonial Warrior]

[Eastbound]

"Barack Obama fails to meet either part of the Senate's very own definition of "natural born" in this Resolution."

I can hear them gasping, 'My God! What have we done?'

[antisocial]

I like this conspiracy better:

http://gunnyg.wordpress.com/2008/11/20/the-first-time-i-heard-of-barack-by-tom-fife/

[FreeAtlanta]

This positively makes FR look like a conspiracy based forum.

Big deal. As Mr. Robinson pointed out in an earlier post a couple of weeks ago, one of the founding tenets of FR is that posts are from news sources, rumors and even conspiracies. I am paraphrasing, but he actually posted the orginal mission statement.

There is something wrong with Obama's birth certificate, or he would just release it. Instead, he has an army of lawyers trying to suppress the story and to defeat the law suits. It is ridiculous that he won't tell Hawaii to hold a press conference and release the records. Are we not a nation of law? Does he not want to be our #1 law enforcement officer?