Posted on 11/02/2006 2:45:28 PM PST by dogbyte12
1. Yeah, heard that on the radio since the last time I checked FR.
2. The fact that Haggard is guilty of some (or all) of this conduct changes nothing about the bigoted nature of some of the comments on this thread. Take the Kobe Bryant rape case, for example. "He's a Christian so he did it" or "He's a different kind of Christian than I am, so he did it" are no less bigoted than "Of course Kobe raped her, he's black."
This "pastor" could learn from that example.
Regards, Ivan
Nope, doesn't hurt me at all. I'm far more likely to suffer consequences from people who can't think running around claiming to be conservatives than I am from some guy doing meth and then losing his pulpit. You read far too much into my defense. I defended the idea that a man is innocent until proven guilty.
I go by common sense, and it makes no sense that he steps down if these are outrageous lies.
It appears now that Haggard did do at least some of this stuff, but that doesn't change this: You condemned this guy on no evidence but the word of a prostitute and meth user and think that's "common sense." The fact that he stepped down meant bupkis, as it did in the Gingrich incident.
Speaking as an old Charismatic from the 70's, It ain't necessarily so!.
i would not label myself as Charismatic any more (more of an issue of not being identified with some of the unsavory elememts of that movement than doctrinal issues), but i can tell you from experience with that community, that there is no difference between them and non-charismatics on this one short coming...Discernment is often selective.
i was a member of an independent Charismatic congregation in the 70's and early 80's. Lots of people there claimed that they could see demonic spirits, and presumed to be capable of deliverance ministries...yet they lacked the basic spiritual discernment to be aware that the Senior pastor of that congregation was in an adulterous affair with a woman half his age.
Fortunately, the man's marriage was saved, and remains together to this day, although the congregation fell apart a few years after this failing was revealed.
Lots of so-called deliverance ministers spend their time "Casting out flesh and Crucifying demons" when scripture admonishes us to cast out demons and crucify the flesh.
Incidentally, the pastor in question (Haggard) has admitted some failures in this matter. That said, it was definately a homosexual lobby hit piece for political purposes.
Guys, it doesn't mean a thing that the guy stepped down. The congregational by-laws...legal requirement for the 501c(3) corporate structure of that congregation required the accused to step down from his position until disposition of the matter was complete. (in this case, investigation by four independent...outside that church...ministers)
In my small Presbyterian denomination, such a person would be temporarily suspended from the excercise of his ministerial functions by the Presbytery, until the disposition of the matter. It has often been done over much lesser matters, and should be no basis for suspicion at all.
I think this guy is a complete hypocrite, and the fact that a gay prostitute selling meth ruled the day for this religious leader and he's admitting to "some" of it makes me once again know I can trust my own instincts.
interesting - but nothing would've stopped him from stepping in front of the cameras and saying to the world that these are complete lies (cause they're not) - I feel very sorry for his family and all the people who followed him.
Of course he can sit next to all the other sinners, but lead the Church? I can't even imagine what would've possessed this man to do or want to buy meth? and a gay relationship? I am just shaking my head.
We do have to be careful,
but when one of our members in Christ says she sees the homosexual demon, don't you think she would see it in the pastor? He MIGHT have commited other sins (we all have)... but I doubt he got banged in the butt. I hate faggots as much as any of us, but I just don't believe brother Haggard should be stoned yet! AND IF HE IS GUILTY, all it proves is that Satan is alive and well. He is 99% alive in the Democratic party and 49% alive in the Republican party. We all need to drop to our knees and pray for Jesus to save our party from the unGodly 49% who have sex outside of marriage!!!!!
Please support me, true Chritians! We can't have sinners for Jesus!
Nobody's business? Are you serious? We don't want faggots talking to the President!
Ok, I need to be careful in what I say, because I don't know for sure he is guilty (wink wink).
I've tried to calm the storm because it's better to pretend he is innocent, but sometimes I get so mad because he is so obvioulsy flaiming. Praise God that TN will hand a Republican Senator (Corker) to Congress. We will also vote negative to the faggot agenda (praise God). I attended a rally for the same sex marriage ballot thanks to the Godly preacher of my church ( THE Baptist church in Knoxville, TN in west Knoxville)
I am not shocked. Surprised, but not shocked. Here's why:
I do truly believe we are all sinners (I know I am one). I know he is a sinner and that all of us have a very dark nasty side to us. So I am not shocked that he was caught in sin. I am surprised, more out of the 'not in my church, no never' type thing.
No, I did not suspect or wonder...strong personalities even in the church (or especially in the church) can leave other impressions though.
Yep, I think leadership in the church is no longer an option in my opinion. There is a lot of concern for his family obviously, the look on his wife's face was the worst part for me.
You are a credit to your Church....you have the right attitude about all of this.
I am just so tired of these types of scandal, it's very disillusioning.
Never heard of him.
"" it's nobody's business but the congregation and his family. That the MSM and RATS are trying to influence the election with this is despicable, but not surprisng. They'll stop at nothing.""
I totally agree!!!! All day long Fox Radio News has been reporting on Haggard. I had no idea who he was and did NOT care. With all the important issues going on in the world, why is FOX News reporting this at the top and bottom of the hour, on my local radio talk show station?
The MSM is using Haggard for pure politics and it's disgusting. Like you said, it's between him, his family and his church.
This just shows how desperate they are to be grasping at straws like this. The pastor is not running for office.
If you are simply keeping score then you are not playing the game. If you quit then you were not playing a good game. If you played a good game then you would never want to quit nor would you give a damn about the score.
"One of Haggard's church members says she can see the homosexual demon"
Plenty of mega-preachers with mega-churches (and therefore political clout) could be next. IMO, they're all questionable characters, earning millions in the temple, specifically prohibited by Jesus. The only prohibition he issued, as I recall.
I don't know whether Haggard is guilty or not, but I do know he's a creepy character, exactly like a caricature of an evangalist one might see on a late-night comedy show. Craig Ferguson will probably "do" him on his late late show tonight.
I saw Haggard on tv and wanted a shower after watching him, just to clean off the yucky feeling he gave me.
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