Bush’s Immigration Proposal “Save A Political Party” -- Sellout A Nation!

FrontPage.com ^ | 1-18-04 | The American Man

[The American Man]

Hispanics: Key To GOP's Future writes Dick Morres from Neocon Headquarters at Front Page.com

[Lexinom]

Some seem to derive pleasure from tearing down other ideas and the people behind them. In my experience they are not representative of the mean for Freepers. Welcome.

[The American Man]

Thank you! Actually I was very impressed by some of the commentary here -- some,
indeed, highly intelligent! That's why I was a little surprised at my "reception!"

[hellinahandcart]

1. Eris was a troll?

2. "Professional trolls"? There's such a thing? How well does it pay? I spend so much time online, and I'd be really GOOD at it, why didn't anyone ask me?

[Savage Beast]

In one stroke Bush converted his core support from red hot to luke warm.

[Poohbah]

Amazing. He sounds exactly like TLBSHOW. Coincidence?

[The American Man]

It wasn’t supposed to be about “strokes” or strategies. We wanted a president that would(1)uphold the constitution(2) Put his country first: even if it ran contrary to self interest(3)Be honest with the American people.

I would support -- sight unseen -- ANYONE -- even one who I may disagree with on certain policies: if the they could simply live up to these principles.

I don’t pretend that I would be incorruptible. We all know the weaknesses of man when he is wined and dined by the rich and powerful.

President Lincoln once threw a man out of his office for -- as Lincoln said latter -- “He came too close to my price.”

When they offered to make George Washington a King he refused. Washington did and said many things, so that we would have an example to live by.

All a president has to do is ask himself (if in doubt): what would the founding Fathers require me to do? How would I act if they were standing here with me?

If any one can tell my why we should stand by “patiently” and allow the Trans-National-Global-Elite(borders mean nothing to them)to finish the job of “merging” our Country (European “union” style) with the world -- “The New World Order” -- I would like to here it.


Why are they ( the Tranzis) doing this: They are doing it so that they can control the flow of currency. It’s business. It’s Power! “The almighty dollar trumps it all”. I’m not sure where that’s written in the Constitution but I’m sure it’s in there somewhere ... maybe I just missed it
somehow!

Wars. Going into countries like Bosnia ( the overthrowing of Milosovich and placing him in the “world" court) Whenever a leader -- any leader -- asserts his countries sovereignty -- gets “ too big for his pants” -- he gets taken out. ("uneasy rests the head that wears the crown")

Do you really think these people walk on the same earth you do! Do you really think you live in the same world they do?

Under the so called “MISSING” (it’s been recently “found": case pending) 13th amendment:“titles and nobility”; most of our leaders and politicians (whom are lawyers)would be stripped of their American citizenship -- but that’s a discussion for another time. The lawyers (how many of our leaders hold law degrees?) gerrymandered the “world banking system” -- “freedom“ liberty” It’s all about money, my friends,(isn’t that in the constitution somewhere?)

Lets all just admit it! You wont have to hear me ranting and raving about that silly Constitution: The laws of the land, “the people” and all the rest of that childish nonsense that we teach, eh, I mean used to teach our children.

It’s OK. I’m probably just a quixotic old fool.(“Beware the patients of the bovine masses: who don’t wake up tell it’s to late.” American Man)

[The American Man]

> Amazing. He sounds exactly like ??????. Coincidence? <

Sorry guys. I know when a man lives in a dark little room with others in the same dark little room: it can be uncomfortable to have someone come along and turn on the light!

By the way I’m beginning to suspect that some of you are operatives for the left! Are you sure YOU belong here? If not,I suggest that we UNITE: Because divided we will fall.

Let me know.

If you are really conservatives than you are my friends. Arguing among ourselves is a VERY BAD idea and gives ammunition to our (assuming you are really conservatives) enemies.


The ball is in your court.

[Poohbah]

You're a newbie, and you insist that only YOUR way is the true way.

As far as I'm concerned, you're just another poserboy looking to stir up trouble.

Go away.

[The American Man]

Dear Mr. Poohbah:

Please Refer me to the post where: “I insist that only (MY) way is the true way.”

You, on the other hand, have not spoken to any of my arguments.

Are you intellectually incapacitated?

If not, I would certainly welcome your comments on the substance of what I wrote.

Your lack of commentary on the substance of my post(assuming that you are not intellectually incapacitated)leads me to conclude; that you do not disagree with what I wrote, but rather: the BOLD manner, in which -- as a “newbe” -- I entered the forum!

The Following may help us find our way out of this morose encounter.

I’m sure that you recognize this from the Free Republic front page

I have taken the liberty (irony unintended) to emphases certain key words for better clarification.

Please show me where I may have gone astray so I may emend my misstep.

Welcome to Free Republic!
FREE Republic is an online GATHERING place for INDEPENDENT, grass-roots CONSERVATISM on the web. We're WORKING to roll back decades of governmentallargesse, to ROOT OUT political FRAUD and CORRUPTION, and to CHAMPION causes which further CONSERVATISM in America. And we always have FUN doing it.
Hoo-yah!

Your statements toward me : > “as far as ‘I’m’ concerned” (and) “go away” < seem to run contrary to the intent and spirit of this forum.

Again, sir, (assuming you are not reading impaired ) please be so kind as to point out where I have erred ?

Mr. Poohbah, the shoe you wear : “my way or the highway” seems to fit your foot well!“

Fortunately, Mr. Poohbah,I don’t think the shoe that fits you so well, would be comfortable on most of the forum members here... maybe they have been to intimidated to tell you.

I am not.

...Or perhaps other forum members didn’t consider discussions with you worthy of their time.


Indeed, if all you can say is “go away," than I am, in fact, wasting my time and -- it would seem -- further exchanges between us -- under such an imposition -- are rendered pointless.

[Poohbah]

Your statements toward me : > “as far as ‘I’m’ concerned” (and) “go away” < seem to run contrary to the intent and spirit of this forum.

Maybe you don't understand the subtle dynamics of Free Republic.

You have been here less than a week now, you post half-literate gibberish (there's even a spell-checker now, so you no longer have that excuse), you lob insults freely, and you insist on stirring up the pot on an issue that cuts across multiple layers of conservative thought in different ways.

And now you presume to lecture me on the purpose of this forum.

Lots of people have done that I've just described over the past five years, just to start food fights. I've been around long enough to recognize the Delphi Technique. Your posts are practically a how-to primer for that particularly odious form of "discourse."

Until you have some seniority around here, and you've actually demonstrated that you are a serious, thoughtful person, I'm going to regard you as just another troll. If you aren't a troll, then you might wish to reflect upon the wisdom of how you have only one opportunity to make a good first impression, and how you've blown it.

I am sorry that I am relying on personal experience in making this judgement, but that's the only kind of experience I have.

[dighton]

You have been here less than a week now ...

C'mon, give him credit for past incarnations.

;-)

[The American Man]

Dear Mr. Poohbah: You still haven’t answered the question I asked after your accusation.

I will try one more time to get a direct response from you.

Please Refer me to the post where: > “I insist that only (MY) way is the true way.” <

You can’t: because there is no such post.

You write: >And now you presume to lecture me on the purpose of this forum.<

No, I simply posted the mission statement from the front page!
Why would you abject to that?

You write: > “you lob insults freely”<

I wrote you in a very cordial way on the forth line of my post as follows:
“I would certainly welcome your comments on the substance of what I wrote.”

However, I still await even one comment on “the substance“ of anything I’ve written

Your whole “argument” seems to be based on the fact that I’m a newbe!

Please explain what that has to do with the validity (or fallacy) of my argument. Or any argument for that matter?

It’s irrelevant!

You write:> I've been around long enough to recognize the Delphi Technique.”<

And I’ve been around long enough to recognize the: “Evade The Issue Technique.”

You seem to be a Master at this Technique.


No, my friend , I don’t employ the “Delphi Technique” Rather I employ the system of a certain Philosopher, that the Oracle at Delphi proclaimed to be the wisest man in Greece. It’s a system that purports to get at the truth.

This Philosopher also “stirred a few pots.”

He was loved by many, but certain little people didn’t like him very much!

The agitated “little people” that opposed him are long forgotten.

But the name -- the influence -- of this great man lives on even to the present time!

You write: >“you ‘insist’ on ‘stirring up the pot’ on an issue that cuts across multiple layers of conservative thought in different ways.” <

Some times pots need to be stirred.

The problem with “pot steering“ is that you never know what kind of muck is going to come to the surface.

However it’s the only way to get rid of the rot. The longer it stays in the pot, the worse it smells!

You write: >Lots of people have done that I've just described over the past five years, just to start food fights.<

The above should read: > Lots of people have done “WHAT” I've just described.< Not: > Lots of people have done THAT I've just described (to ere is human; to forgive is divine. we all make mistakes)

I came here to have intelligent discourse; Not “food fights.”
.
You write: > I am sorry that I am relying on personal experience in making this judgment... <

Well, I’m sorry that you have had some sort of bad experience in the past. I assure you that if you approached me a little more gingerly, you would find me a very agreeable person.

[Poohbah]

You write: > “you lob insults freely”<

Yes, you do. Go back and read your remarks. Everyone who smelled something fishy in your actions got remarks about their low intelligence, about how they love serfdom, about how they're too blind to see what you see (which, incidentally, also satisfies the "your way is the only true way" issue).

Your whole “argument” seems to be based on the fact that I’m a newbe!

Yes. You are a newbie. That makes you suspect. It is incumbent on you to prove that you are a serious contributor and not a troll. After the 2000 elections, we've had a string of self-proclaimed "true conservatives" show up and start food fights.

Please explain what that has to do with the validity (or fallacy) of my argument. Or any argument for that matter?

By itself, nothing.

In conjunction with

Tell me this: do you support law enforcement when they use "profiling" to catch criminals?

You're being profiled, and your profile says "troll." If you didn't intend for it to be such, that is your problem, and not mine.

It’s irrelevant!

It's entirely relevant.

No, my friend , I don’t employ the “Delphi Technique” Rather I employ the system of a certain Philosopher, that the Oracle at Delphi proclaimed to be the wisest man in Greece. It’s a system that purports to get at the truth.

Did this technique include insulting your opponent's intelligence?

That is a hallmark of the Delphi Technique.

So are attempts to engage in secret communications via FReepmail with someone you have an antagonistic relationship with.

The above should read: > Lots of people have done “WHAT” I've just described.< Not: > Lots of people have done THAT I've just described (to ere is human; to forgive is divine. we all make mistakes)

When you can post in standard written English, free of idiot-grade spelling errors, fractured syntax, and bizarre punctuation that conforms to no style manual I've ever read, then you will have earned the right to lecture me about minor lapses in grammar. Until then, it just makes you look like a fool. If such is your intent, then knock yourself out.

I came here to have intelligent discourse; Not “food fights.”

Then start engaging in intelligent discourse; nobody is stopping you. The problem is that you haven't actually engaged in intelligent discourse yet, but you demand to be treated as if you are.

Please do not post further to me. Also, do not send me FReepmail.

[The American Man]

Dear Mr. Poobah:

It was (and is ) not my intention to humiliate you further in front of your friends.

Anyone can see that I did not pick a fight with you but, like most bullies, when they get a bloody nose: they are the first ones to start crying..

Most of your friends, wisely, departed after round one.

You on the other hand have managed to drag yourself out bloody and beaten “rocky style” for round three!

You have had every opportunity to be a man -- a gentleman.

You write: > “Did this technique include insulting your opponent's intelligence?”<

No. Nor does one -- in the Socratic method -- actually have an “opponent” in the ordinary sense of the word.

How it works is one person asks a series of questions, and than the other answers.

After a time the other person may ask some questions; and the first person answers.

It can be very enlightening in that ones “opponent“ can often teach us many things.

He is more of a partner than an “opponent”; you both work together to reveal the Truth. This is why I have continually asked you to comment on what I wrote: I wish to learn.

Did you know that Socrates -- “the wisest man in Greece” -- at his death -- when asked what he had learned of truth -- said: “all I can tell you for sure is that I know nothing. “

My intention in posting was to get a response. To get at the truth! I have gotten one or two positive comments -- but frankly -- I don’t WANT to be right about this immigration issue.

So there you have it!

I would like this to end on a positive note.

When I was a young man we were raised to be gentlemen.

If we got in a spat we were made to “shake hands.”

It was part of being a “good sport.”

I have a code of honor.

Therefore, as a gentleman, I extend my hand to you.

You may shake it, or not, it is entirely up to you.

I hold no ill-will toward you; and I wish you well.

Sincerely, American Man .

PS: If you go over the posts carefully you will find that I never directly said that you are unintelligent. Yes -- at the worst -- I used innuendo.... And that, at a time when I was under constant personal attack. Of course, I defended myself! (you should see the stuff I deleted. Oyevay!) Anyway, I have since been to your personal information page, and I enjoyed it very much. It’s very creative! So NO, in big letters: I DON’T THINK YOU ARE UNINTELLIGENT -- humorless yes; unintelligent, No ( that’s a joke: please don’t go nuts).

[Poohbah]

If you go over the posts carefully you will find that I never directly said that you are unintelligent.

Nice, Clintonian touch. I didn't mention it in relation to myself; you were insulting others.

So we can now add dishonesty to your list of traits.

You, sir, are no gentleman. Do not ever post to me again.

[The American Man]

THIS IS AN INSULT THAT I DID MAKE TO MR. POOBAH (AND FRIENDS )ON THIS THREAD (GO UP YOU WILL FIND IT ): >" By the way I’m beginning to suspect that some of you are operatives for the left! Are you sure YOU belong here? "<


I FIND IT RATHER ODD THAT OF ALL THE INSULTS I SUPPOSEDLY MADE: MR. POOBAH: REMAINS STRANGELY SILENT ON THIS ONE INSULT.( A REAL INSULT TO ANY TRUE CONSERVATIVE) WHY!

MR. 'POOBAH' IS NOW SUSPECT. I’M GOING TO ASK SOME
PEOPLE I KNOW, WHERE I HAVE “SENIORITY," TO LOOK INTO THE (ALLEGED)POSSIBILITY THAT 'LEFTIST,' ‘RIGHTIST,' OR AGENTS OF THE GOVERNMENT: HAVE INFILTRATED CONSERVATIVE SITES.(BECOME SENIOR MEMBERS)

THE IDEA IS CERTAINLY NOT FARFETCHED.HE EXERTS WAY TO MUCH ENERGY ON “NEWBES” THAT IN HIS EYES ARE SUPPOSEDLY TROLLS(MISDIRECTION TECHNIQUE)THERE MAY BE TROLLS AROUND, BUT THAT WOULD BE EVEN MORE CONVENIENT TO HIS PURPOSE


FAR MORE INSIDIOUS WOULD BE AN AGENT POSING AS A SELF APPOINTED WATCH -DOG: THAT ULTIMATELY GAINED THE TRUST OF THE HOST SITE.

WHO IS YOU MR. “POOBAH?’

AND WHO DOES HE WORK FOR ?

[The American Man]

TYPO ALERT: WHO IS MR. POOHBAH

[Unadorned]

Savage Beast, that's his typical modus operandi -- he goes out of his way to stick it to conservatives. The reason is, he's a liberal. Worse, he's a radical left-wing wacko. Get rid of the turd. Impeach him.

[Unadorned]

American Man, this post, number twenty-six, is excellent and moving. I agree with what you say in it. As you know, I consider Bush to be contemptible. I strongly favor his removal from office by means of impeachment. Thank you for this very important thread, American Man! Just as you always do at the Poe Forum, you've expressed yourself extremely well here.

[Savage Beast]

No. All of the alternatives are waaaaaaaaaaaaay off the chart.