Posted on 05/27/2016 2:40:37 PM PDT by GraceG
All these threads about Hiroshima got me to do some thinking.
What would have happened had by some miracle we didn't drop the nukes on Japan and they had surrendered after a the equivalent amount of firebombing but right before an invasion.
Some libs would think this would have been the "best Case Scenario" but I think it would have been a disaster! This is why:
After the two nukes hit Japan many news reels in the months and years after it showed off to the whole world the absolute horrors of what Nuclear Weapons could do. We saw images of Kimonos being burned into the flesh of Japanese women, Children who were blinded by the flash of the blast, and wide panning panoramic of entire sections of the cities that were flattened and burned to a crisp. The whole world had a few years of peace to catch their breath and see all the naked horror of what atomic weaponry could do. As a result the atomic weaponry became a "weapon of last resort", a weapon to only use when all other options had been thoroughly exhausted.
Now let's move back to to the "Best Case Scenario" of Japan Surrendering without needing to use the Atom Bomb....
The atomic weapon program, the "Manhattan project" would have still remained very secret to the US citizenry and everyone else in the world who wasn't a military official, the Soviets would have continued their program and would soon have the bomb around the same time they normally would have acquired it.
Based only on limited testing the impact of the bomb on civilian targets would have been only theoretical and there wouldn't be as much of a taboo on using it.
Enter the Korean War....
The atomic bomb would have been used in the opening stages of the Korean War, and probably on Military target, not the horror of a civilian target (remember at this point the US military was developing the atomic bomb to be deployed via artillery ).
Instead of two hard choices at the end of the war it would have turned into multiple "easy choices" in the opening days of the Korean war, the nuclear exchange would have been far far worse by the time Korea ended... Maybe the Korean War would have ended sooner, but if it dragged on there would no doubt have been many more nuclear exchanges....
A dangerous precedent would have been set...
We should thank Truman and the citizens who were sacrificed to end the brutal Japanese aggression in Hiroshima and Nagasaki for showing the world the Destruction of atomic weapons...
A terror that directly lead to the policy of MAD " Mutually Assured Destruction" that kept the soviet war machine in check for over 50 years!
As I posted in another thread, but is more appropriate for your thread:
A comment/question I asked a college professor who said that we shouldn’t have dropped the bomb or dropped it on a deserted island.
“Have you ever considered that the reason no one has used atomic and hydrogen bombs since Hiroshima and Nagasaki is that those two uses showed the destructive force of such weapons? Perhaps only our initial use has prevented all out nuclear war since then?”
His response was a blank stare and he walked away without responding. I considered that I had made the point and he had never or refused to consider that point.
“...that were intact so they could measure the destruction.”
True - but also to be able to show the Japs how powerful it was.
“Okay - this map shows the blackened area of the 60% of Toyko that has been burned to the ground. See that round area of grey - that’s where we dropped the bomb.
The firebombings destroyed MUCH more and killed far more than the A-bombs did. But, as back then, the A-bomb had a much larger impact on the heart and soul of the people. “Shock and Awe.”
Imagine how much longer and how many more dead if we attacked the Japanese mainland and tried to work toward a surrender.
Maybe we would never of had an Obama presidency
I spent a summer in a Tokyo suburb. I also took a trip to Hiroshima (spent the day and left the next morning). I visited all the sites including the A-Bomb building. My hotel was just a quarter mile from it. I stood right there at ground zero (snuck some dirt in a film can). But you’re right. We needed to show them how powerful that bomb was.
FYI, I had a class on the then-recent diplomatic history of the US, circa 1981, with a prof who was retired State Dept.
One day, when discussing the Korean War, he told us something that he said, “You won’t see in any history texts.” Specifically, he said that after Ike had won the 1952 election, but before he was inaugurated, he was very upset about the continued carnage and about the plight of US prisoners. So he passed word, very discreetly, to the Norks, that if they didn’t release ALL of our prisoners very shortly after he got into office, he’d nuke their asses even further back into the Stone Age than they already were. Needless to say, they took seriously this threat from a former 5-star general who had literally led millions of men in an all-out assault against Festung Europa. Our guys were released not terri bly long after Ike assumed office.
I am sure that the willingness of the Norks to be serious about negotiations had something to do with what happened to Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and the Russian and Chinese worries about riling up a nuclear-armed US.
Sorry, we should have ended the Korean war with one
or two. Then no one would doubt our resolve today.
The problem we have is that the world believes we
won’t use them again.
We should have nuked China/N Korea before the Korean War got out of hand.
Now our enemies laugh at us since we can’t even beat stone age, mud hut dwelling 3rd Worlders.
Thanks Truman!
[ The liberals today didn’t live through that era and don’t know squat on how Americans felt during the war or their feelings towards the Japanese. ]
Yeah, Libs have no clue at all.
I do have a lot of respect for the Japanese, they went from medieval age lifestyle to full blown industrial revolution in under 50-60 years, 1860-1920. The problem was it was such a culture shock that they went power mad after they beat the tar out of the Russians During the Sino-russian war in the early 1900’s.
They got too big for their britches and started taking over the pacific Asian rim on island and country at a time. They were essentially running under a medieval war code using modern weapons and military tactics. As a result they ROLLED over the other less well armed and less industrialized Asian countries. They needed a wake up call to get them out of the Medieval mindset and getting thoroughly humiliated and humbled by the nukes.
Douglas MacArthur is essentially a “re-founder” of Japan, in that during the rebuilding of Japan after the war he made damned sure not to repeat the mistakes of Germany after WW-I and in the process we gained a very important ally in the Pacific. As a result the average Japanese citizen today has been more or less “Tamed and Civilized” due to his efforts in introducing more of western culture into Japan while at the same letting them retain many aspect of their Island culture.
Funny how you almost never hear the Libs talk about Douglas MacArthur, and when they do they Hate the Man for no damned good reason. This is a man who saw all the atrocities that Japanese Soldiers did in the pacific fronts, but he didn’t hold it against the citizenry after they had surrendered and were humbled when it came to the post war activities of rebuilding and humanitarian relief for the citizenry. He also helped establish their Constitution as well.
But the Libs love to cite the atomic bombing of Japan while ignoring how much we did to get their society back up on their feet.
Except when it suits THEIR agenda.... Of course they all forget that Nation building only works after the entire country has been thoroughly humbled and humiliated.
You got that right. I was born in 1935 and well remember WW11.
Americans wouldn't have minded if we dropped more atomic bombs on Japan.
I get a kick out of today's lamenting about Roosevelt interning Japanese Americans as being outrageous.
I believe had he not done that, some of those Japanese would have been beaten to death by American citizenry.
I personally witnessed, in Boston, after the war was on for several years and some wounded service people were coming home, Chinese being beaten, because the Citizenry didn't differentiate between orientals in that time period. -Tom
[ We should have nuked China/N Korea before the Korean War got out of hand.
Now our enemies laugh at us since we can’t even beat stone age, mud hut dwelling 3rd Worlders.
Thanks Truman! ]
Agree, MacArthur was given the short end of the stick by Truman because he feared MacArthur ... POLITICALLY....
If we had never hit the nips w/the big one we never would’ve had all those Godzilla movies.
I love those!
Truman won WWII only to lose the rest of our wars because of his damn pride.
Mac was right then and now.
I remember doing some hangar flying with some WW2 vets. One a ninety YO said that right after the attack on Pearl he and his buddies went cruising to find Japs (as he still calls them) to beat them up. The crying libtards never mention that Italian-Americans and German-Americans were put in camps as well. One guy told me his mother was interred while he was fighting in Italy.
People tend to forget that the bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, not to end the war against Japan, but to stop the Soviets from invading Japan and stealing it away from us. Per the Potsdam Agreement dealing with the ending of WWII, the Soviets were not to make a move against Japan and go beyond the 38th parallel divide in Korea. The bomb was dropped the same day the agreement was up, and the Soviets were poised to invade Japan but the bomb was dropped to stop the Soviets from doing so. The Soviets were already on the move to invade, moving their equipment towards Japan. A second bomb might have been used against the Soviets if they didn't stop. Effectively kept the Soviets out of Japan after WWII.
If not for the Nukes, most likely Japan winds up divided, like Korea.
one reason “libs” don’t like MacArthur regarding his rule over Japan, is that he refused to permit the Soviets to take possession of the northern island and to have representatives on the other islands. He came the Soviets out of Japan and thus thwarted their plan to turn at least part of Japan into a communist state, like happened in North Korea and East Germany.
Doesn’t Russia still occupy one of Japan’s furthest northern island? The Kuril Islands
“I stood right there at ground zero...”
Wow - that must have been interesting. Although your visit reminds me of those comparison pictures between Hiroshima and Detroit today!
I walked all around the A-Bomb building, the one that’s always depicted in after pictures. Lots of flowers being laid there as well as a small memorial. The building is constantly being re-enforced and kept in exactly the same condition it was right after the bombing. There’s a low fence around it so you can’t go in but you can see the rubble at the bottom. As an aside, that building was designed by a Czechoslovakian architect and I believe erected in 1935. There’s a plaque with an image of the building before and it was a bit larger like to the sides.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.