Posted on 03/02/2014 3:59:10 PM PST by Errant
As the book of the Revelation comes to a close, we are left with some very important words. Keep his commandments, know his Torah, and make yourself ready to be the bride of the King. He is coming quickly. Join Michael Rood for the final episode in the series From Here to Eternity – Yeshua’s Famous Last Words: Amen, Emet, Truth.
(Excerpt) Read more at youtube.com ...
We are no long under the Law of the Torah...Says so right there...
As we briefly touched on in another thread, the English word 'faith' no longer has the same meaning as it's Hebrew word 'aman':
"The Hebrew root aman means firm, something that is supported or secure. This word is used in Isaiah 22:23 for a nail that is fastened to a "secure" place. Derived from this root is the word emun meaning a craftsman. A craftsman is one who is firm and secure in his talent. Also derived from aman is the word emunah meaning firmness, something or someone that is firm in their actions. When the Hebrew word emunah is translated as faith misconceptions of its meaning occur. Faith is usually perceived as a knowing while the Hebrew emunah is a firm action. To have faith in God is not knowing that God exists or knowing that he will act, rather it is that the one with emunah will act with firmness toward God's will. [i.e. Follow his Commandments]"
http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/27_faith.html
You will find the same misunderstanding exists with our used of the word 'believe'.
No, we don’t all know that. You may not have noticed but it’s only two of you who stand in opposition to the rest of us and scripture. We all agree that it’s you who cannot read the scriptures with understanding.
CB, you can't even get your numbers straight. There were three of us...
At least you're half right in the statement above, we do stand in opposition to your misinterpretations of scripture and of course your lies.
The law was fulfilled in Christ on our behalf. Here are the words of Jesus concerning the law.
Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
Then we have these words to know who actually knows God.
1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
I would contend that from your vitriolic words in these threads to others and your obvious disdain for those who call themselves Christians you do not know God.
100% ey? Show us which of the 613 “commands and ordinances” from the Torah apply to us today and that you follow and how you have “sold all and given to the poor”. If you can’t or won’t we can only believe that you are a hypocrite.
It appears that some hold to the belief that only those of the lost house of Israel will be or can be saved.
Therefore, anyone who is saved, is by default an Israelite by heritage, whether they know it or not, because nobody who is not of the house of Israel can be saved.
So when it says that the Gentiles will be saved, it doesn’t mean REAL Gentiles, but people who think they’ve Gentiles but are really of Israel but didn’t know it.
No. That is *not* 'the words of Yeshua concerning the Law'. Every_single_bit of the Mosaic covenant is ratified into the Messianic covenant by these words:
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
Don't you see that simply by denoting 'the greatest', one implies 'the rest'? Every one of them is a COMMANDMENT. The ONLY way for Matt 5 and Mark 12 to BOTH be true == Matt 5. The 'greatest' do not, cannot negate the rest.
Then we have these words to know who actually knows God.
1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
1Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
I would contend that from your vitriolic words in these threads to others and your obvious disdain for those who call themselves Christians you do not know God.
That's a bit like the pot calling the kettle black, no? Y'all have done every bit as much to me directly, and witness against yourselves. ES is abrasive, probably more than he needs to be, but then again, so are you... So maybe one is best to mind his own tongue before passing judgement upon others.
So might makes right? Psst! your Catholicism is showing...
So post a list of the 613 laws from the Torah that we are to follow. Surely you have followed them and have “sold all you have and given to the poor” to prove that you are serious. So let’s have it. Which of the 613 are we to literally follow today?
2 Corinthians 3:14 But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. 15 But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; 16 but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.…
Those who turn to Christ have the veil “taken away”. Rood's teachings have put a veil on you heart and you cannot see truth.
Riiiignt... What it says is that one cannot understand Torah without Messiah - Once one has Messiah, the veil is removed and Moses can be understood. In LARGE part, that means that Torah is to be read with a servant's heart - Pharisees impose. Servants DO.
Galatians was written in Greek, not Hebrew. Feel free to dispute that if you wish, but the onus is upon you to present a Hebrew text of Galatians that clearly predates the Greek, rather than the other way around.
The Greek word translated "faith" in Gal. 3:25 is pistis, which has the same definition as the English word "faith": conviction that something is true, taking someone at his word, etc.
Paul's meaning in Galatians 3, therefore, is plain: Abraham was declared righteous by God because of his faith: he took God at his word when he was promised that his descendants would be many and great. The law, on the other hand, brought a curse upon anyone who could not perfectly obey it. Jesus Christ redeemed his people from that curse by taking it upon himself on his cross. Those who place their trust in the Christ, share the faith of Abraham and are his spiritual heirs.
Moses' law, which came centuries afterward, cannot nullify the covenant made with Abraham. Its purpose is to show everyone their sin, and to point them to Christ. Paul likens the law to a "schoolmaster," that is, a paidagogos—a slave in the Roman household that was responsible for the moral upbringing of the children, as well as their discipline. Of course, once the children came of age, there was no further need of the paidaogogos; similarly, once the children of God have come of age—placed their trust in their Messiah, Jesus—there is no further need of the law.
If Paul were alive today, he would recognize this Hebrew Roots crap as the very thing he opposed in the churches of Galatia. For them, the issue was the necessity of circumcising Gentile Christians, rather than keeping Jewish festivals or intoning the magic Hebrew names for God, but the principle is the same: those who will bind you to a tiny part of the law, really seek to bind you to all of it. You can have the law, or you can have the Christ. You can't have both. I will put my trust in the words of Paul in Scripture, and the Messiah whom he proclaimed, and not in the apostate ravings of this Michael Rood. Amen.
Well then! We eagerly await the list out of the 613 that you believe apply to us today and which you follow ”blameless” and have sold all that you have and given it to the poor. Surely you are a "servant that does" and not a hypocrite aren't you?
Our Master provided the list - not one jot or tittle - What need is there for me to reiterate?
And you get an Amen from me.
Oh no, no, no. We have been told that some of the 613 don’t apply to us today. Besides, you three have said we can’t read scripture, understand it, and that we follow a false Jesus. Surely you would want those of us who don’t understand the benefit of your self proclaimed greater understanding and help lead us to a more correct “way”. For the benefit of all of us here and the lurkers you need to list which of the 613 we are to follow today and since you just said “not on jot or tittle" would you please tell us where you do your sacrificing also?
BTW Attempting to impose all from that “not on jot or tittle” on others while not assuring us that you follow “all blameless” will assure us that you are simply a hypocrite.
Just like you, eh?
Can dish it out but can't take it.....OK. Here's some Scripture.
In light of the following Scripture passages, he falls short in way too many ways.
1 Timothy 3:1-13 The saying is trustworthy: If anyone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a noble task. Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church? He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. Moreover, he must be well thought of by outsiders, so that he may not fall into disgrace, into a snare of the devil.
Deacons likewise must be dignified, not double-tongued, not addicted to much wine, not greedy for dishonest gain. They must hold the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience. And let them also be tested first; then let them serve as deacons if they prove themselves blameless. Their wives likewise must be dignified, not slanderers, but sober-minded, faithful in all things. Let deacons each be the husband of one wife, managing their children and their own households well. For those who serve well as deacons gain a good standing for themselves and also great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.
Titus 1:5-16 This is why I left you in Crete, so that you might put what remained into order, and appoint elders in every town as I directed you—if anyone is above reproach, the husband of one wife, and his children are believers and not open to the charge of debauchery or insubordination. For an overseer, as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain, but hospitable, a lover of good, self-controlled, upright, holy, and disciplined. He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it.
For there are many who are insubordinate, empty talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision party. They must be silenced, since they are upsetting whole families by teaching for shameful gain what they ought not to teach. One of the Cretans, a prophet of their own, said, “Cretans are always liars, evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” This testimony is true. Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith, not devoting themselves to Jewish myths and the commands of people who turn away from the truth. To the pure, all things are pure, but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled. They profess to know God, but they deny him by their works. They are detestable, disobedient, unfit for any good work.
ARBITRATION BOARD RULES AGAINST MICHAEL ROOD
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_RoodArbitraRep.htm
Michael Rood
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/688-michael-rood-2
Michael Rood Teachings
http://www.seekgod.ca/roodteachings.htm
MICHAEL ROOD, DOOMSDAY PROPHET
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_rood.htm
Michael Rood of A Rood Awakening and Nehemia Gordon
US Speaking Tour January 2005
http://www.seekgod.ca/roodnewsflash.htm
Michael Rood and His “Rood Awakenings”
http://www.isitso.org/guide/rood.html
Michael John Rood: Marine Chaplain, Jewish Gentile Rabbi, & Reverend?
http://www.seekgod.ca/roodmarine.htm
ROOD’S CULTIC ROOTS IN “THE WAY INTERNATIONAL”
http://empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_roodCultRoots.htm
ROOD’S “REVELATIONS” SELL CD’S
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/rec_megalomaniacRood.htm
Michael Rood: WAY Colleagues, Occult Calendars & False Prophecies
http://www.seekgod.ca/roodzodiac.htm
Signs of The End Times Michael Rood
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_RoodArbitraRep.htm
From Here to Eternity, the Gospel of Michael Rood’s False Prophecy
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_roodprophecy.htm
The Ever Changing Michael Rood
http://www.seekgod.ca/roodeverchanges.htm
The Hebrew Roots Cult
http://fortheloveofhistruth.com/2012/04/17/the-hebrew-roots-cult/
DOES OBEYING THE LAWS AND COMMANDS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT PLEASE GOD?
http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/spl_RoodbiblOnLaw.htm
Satanic Translations:Shem Tov & The Toledoth Yeshu
http://www.christianmediaresearch.com/satanictranslations.html
HEBREW MATTHEW - Shem Tob - du Tillet - Munster
http://www.oneinmessiah.net/HEBREWMATTHEW.htm
The Cult that Snapped - A Journey Into The Way International
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/recommended-reading/cult-recovery/the-cult-that-snapped-—a-journey-into-the-way-international.html
What is the Way International?
http://www.gotquestions.org/The-Way-International.html
Why do you require that circumcision be practiced by believers?
Do you practice it along with the ritual purifications for childbirth?
How do you do the sacrifices with no temple and no Levitical priesthood?
Galatians was written in Greek, not Hebrew. Feel free to dispute that if you wish, but the onus is upon you to present a Hebrew text of Galatians that clearly predates the Greek, rather than the other way around.
The Greek word translated "faith" in Gal. 3:25 is pistis, which has the same definition as the English word "faith": conviction that something is true, taking someone at his word, etc.
Whether you/he are right or wrong is immaterial - Paul is a Hebrew, studied in the Word at the foot of Gamaliel. To strip the Hebrew sense of what he is saying is to lose a vast amount of context. The same applies throughout.
Paul's meaning in Galatians 3, therefore, is plain: Abraham was declared righteous by God because of his faith: he took God at his word when he was promised that his descendants would be many and great.
TRUE. And everyone saved by grace through faith is inherently a descendant and inheritor of Abraham - Since there is no record of ANYONE ever being saved by any other thing, we can draw the conclusion that All who are saved (even before Messiah, and before Abraham) are saved in and by Messiah, PERIOD.
The law, on the other hand, brought a curse upon anyone who could not perfectly obey it. Jesus Christ redeemed his people from that curse by taking it upon himself on his cross. Those who place their trust in the Christ, share the faith of Abraham and are his spiritual heirs.
I would point out that you correctly declared the redemption from the curse... not the Torah.
Moses' law, which came centuries afterward, cannot nullify the covenant made with Abraham. Its purpose is to show everyone their sin, and to point them to Christ. Paul likens the law to a "schoolmaster," that is, a paidagogos—a slave in the Roman household that was responsible for the moral upbringing of the children, as well as their discipline. Of course, once the children came of age, there was no further need of the paidaogogos; similarly, once the children of God have come of age—placed their trust in their Messiah, Jesus—there is no further need of the law.
This is brilliantly portrayed - What I would point to is that one cannot have been OF the House of YHWH without that paidagogos - My father's torah is 'written upon my heart' - It was ingrained in me as the 'right way' through discipline and pain... For I was a child, and rebellious, and didn't understand what my father was teaching me. Now, as a man, I am not subject to my father's torah. But the curses for not following his wisdom still remain - Not imposed by him, but by the nature of life on this big blue ball... And my torah, the law of my house, is like unto his.
Likewise our Father's Torah. How then can one claiming to be a child of YHWH pay no attention to the Torah of His House? How can one claim to have Torah 'written on their hearts' without even knowing Torah (which most in Christendom have studiously avoided)?
Torah IS for the knowledge of sin. As an evident example, the ten commandments - All of Christendom adheres to them and declares them valid - Yet The Catlicks keep 7, and the Protestants keep 9... Do you believe the Catlicks, the Protestants, or YHWH? In this is the knowledge of sin. Follow the tradition of your fathers, or follow YHWH. This has always been the primary problem.
If Paul were alive today, he would recognize this Hebrew Roots crap as the very thing he opposed in the churches of Galatia. For them, the issue was the necessity of circumcising Gentile Christians, rather than keeping Jewish festivals or intoning the magic Hebrew names for God, but the principle is the same: those who will bind you to a tiny part of the law, really seek to bind you to all of it. You can have the law, or you can have the Christ. You can't have both. I will put my trust in the words of Paul in Scripture, and the Messiah whom he proclaimed, and not in the apostate ravings of this Michael Rood. Amen.
I don't see that - If Yeshua is our (and Paul's) example, and if Yeshua is the head, how then can the body do differently than the head? And Yeshua kept (and keeps) the law perfectly.
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