Posted on 11/24/2011 10:44:11 AM PST by Kevmo
Sven Kullander On Rossi And eCat
admin on November 23, 2011 — 6 Comments
http://ecatnews.com/?p=1409
The following was posted on the Facebook Energy Catalyzer page. It comes from Hampus Ericsson who attended Sven Kullander’s Örebro talk today. Kullander has been a key player in gaining Rossi credibility in the past few months. Taken in the sweep, it appears to me that he believes in Rossi and his claims but reserves the right to be wrong until definitive independent tests drive the nail home. His comment about AR’s prickly response to anyone who distrusts him is interesting. This flies counter to his public stance on genuine scepticism. No scientist should work completely on trust. No scientist will truly trust him/herself. Perhaps the comment relates to personal attacks on his integrity. That I would understand. He is right to be angry at those type of attacks.
I couldn’t stay for all of it because I have a train to catch. The lecture was good. He started by going I’ve all different types of nuclear power. And then he talked about hot fusion and when that might be functional.
Then the good par came, he talked about all the different test that have been made of Rossi’s ecat( basically read the NyTeknik reports.
Then he talked about his own test, he said that it proved that heat was made but he couldn’t say how, and he dont believe it’s cold fusion because that impossible by today’s science. But it could only be explained by cold fusion happening. He was very confused .
He also said that Rossi is definitely not a fraud and that his friend Focardi and Levi is absolutely not frauds. They are his friends and he trust them.
Rossi on the other had he said to be a black box.
He said that NASA had contacted him and asked about rossis ecat. So NASA was the first American customer that bailed. Apparently they wanted to know how it worked and Rossi wanted to keep the secret for himself.
Sven kullander did not know who the final costumer is.
He also said that Rossi can be a little bit angry at people who don’t trust him. That’s why Sven have kept on Rossi god side and never told him that it don’t work.
Sven said that he have asked Rossi if Uppsala university can independently test the device, with the demand that all information will be reveled to the public. If Rossi says no to this Uppsala will not test the device.
One of the most interesting thins was that Sven kullander sad that Focardi and Levi are both excellent professor that he believe a 100% in, Rossi on the other hand is a little bit of a black box. He said that there are two black boxes in this history, Rossi and he ecat.
He also said that his colleague Roland Peterson (think that was his name) is very positive on the ecat.
Sven also showed the test of the nickel fuel and the copper nickel that is left after the reaction. They will come out with a full article on this when all the testing is done. But the first test show copper in the waste
[With thanks to Akira Shirakawa on Vortex]
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More On The Sven Kullander eCat Talk
admin on November 24, 2011 — 11 Comments
http://ecatnews.com/?p=1416&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ecatnews%2FAdFD+%28+%C2%BB+eCatNews+-+Rossi%E2%80%99s+Cold+Fusion+2.0%29
The pedigree of Sven Kullander and Hanno Essen is interesting. From Wikipedia:
Professor Kullander is professor emeritus of High Energy Physics at Uppsala University. Kullander received his doctorate from Uppsala University in 1971. Since 1990, Kullander has been a member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences and chairman of its Energy Committee
Hanno Essén is an associate professor of theoretical physics and a lecturer at the Swedish Royal Institute of Technology and former chairman of the Swedish Skeptics Society
Their role in the Andrea Rossi affair began when they expressed an interest in the eCat and then attended a Bologna demo. During that demo, the eCat seemed to produce around 5kW of heat from a small sealed vessel (50 ccm) containing Hydrogen and Nickel. They were allowed to check for hidden conduits and examine the instruments and various elements of the system. They were not allowed access to the core but since it was small and the claimed energy large, it was reasonable to treat the device as a black box to determine its utility.
In many of the arguments posed by reasonable and unreasonable sceptics alike, doubt is often cast on those attending these events. Various inventions are created to explain why otherwise intelligent people could be so stupid as to fall for Rossi’s tricks. Senility, stupidity, human error, dishonesty, fraud and gullibility are all wheeled out in turn. If you have been there and leave believing the claim might be real, there has to be something wrong – you are either in on the scam or too dumb to see it.
No one can accuse Kullander or Essen of not being independent. How often have we heard that a scammer would never let an independent and qualified scientist near their scamming machine? And yet, here we have two physicists, both active and experienced, one the chairman of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences’ (of Nobel fame) Energy Committee and the other the former chairman of the Swedish Skeptics’ Society and both allowed dangerous and intimate access to a working eCat.
Both scientists are well aware that what they saw and measured does not constitute proof and neither can say with certainty that Rossi’s claims are true. They would be foolish to do so. Indeed both admit that they could not check everything and although they do not suspect fraud, they have to leave that door open as a small possibility.
They published a travel report detailing the demo and results and expressing their belief that (assuming no fraud) the eCat was producing so much energy that it had to be nuclear in origin.
For many months, both scientists remained out of the light and some hard sceptics wondered if they were distancing themselves from Rossi and that report – now embarrassed that they had ever been involved. However, recently Kullander has begun to publicly reveal his current thinking and yesterday gave a talk (Swedish) to an audience in Örebro. Today, Ny Teknik, the Swedish magazine responsible for extensive reporting throughout the year has published a pdf of that talk. Together with an audio recording by a member of the audience (again, in Swedish) and a variety of interpretations from around the Net, we begin to get a good idea of Kullander’s current view of Rossi and the eCat. It is nuanced and intelligent and does not conform to that expected of the term ‘Believer’.
To be fair, I doubt a reasonable sceptic would place that moniker on him as the scientist clearly leaves room for his conclusions to be wrong. That said, most of us have read others who are less supportive than Kullander being labeled as a believer as though the tag could colour you gullible.
The following has been Googleized from a report by Bertil Nilsson on a Swedish forum discussing Kullander’s talk (here is the audio):
Biggest “scoop” is well that, according to Rossi, it works without a catalyst. It can be measured net energy even with only nickel and hydrogen. He says that as a reason why his patent to go through. But it opens the course for the reproduction of this, we have many who can kalimoetri precision now after all the thinking.
Kullander is deeply skeptical of the proton capture of nickel, believes that there are other possibilities. He outlined a number of them, but I must return later. I can not enough to sum up the piece. He was puzzled by the presence of natural copper in the ash, but a detailed isotopic analysis is expected to be ready for Christmas
Kullander told further about their personal experiences of a large number of people at the University of Bologna has been more or less concerned about the ECAT, the most active of course Focardi and Levi. He feels these people knowledgeable and up to serious, from the president down. Kullander feel even Rossi as sincere and serious and a very knowledgeable and skilled engineer but somewhat discursive reasoning when entering the field of physics. He also talked about discussions he had with Levi for a large number of tests that are not described but conducted by Levi, who personally knows the ECAT works.
Kullander believes that Rossi for their own sake must be sure to get an independent verification of heat output and that he was not to be overtaken should ally itself with some great players, like Siemens or ABB. One problem here may be that Rossi has a deep personal relationship with their cats, as he usually describe them. Kullander has offered Rossi to test and verify an ECAT in Uppsala in collaboration with the University of Bologna. Discussions on this are ongoing. Kullander preclude an agreement whereby secrecy around that they have an ECAT in place or that the results may not be shown publicly.
The above is in addition to yesterday’s report which I repeat here:
I couldn’t stay for all of it because I have a train to catch. The lecture was good. He started by going I’ve all different types of nuclear power. And then he talked about hot fusion and when that might be functional.
Then the good par came, he talked about all the different test that have been made of Rossi’s ecat( basically read the NyTeknik reports.
Then he talked about his own test, he said that it proved that heat was made but he couldn’t say how, and he dont believe it’s cold fusion because that impossible by today’s science. But it could only be explained by cold fusion happening. He was very confused .
He also said that Rossi is definitely not a fraud and that his friend Focardi and Levi is absolutely not frauds. They are his friends and he trust them.
Rossi on the other had he said to be a black box.
He said that NASA had contacted him and asked about rossis ecat. So NASA was the first American customer that bailed. Apparently they wanted to know how it worked and Rossi wanted to keep the secret for himself.
Sven kullander did not know who the final costumer is.
He also said that Rossi can be a little bit angry at people who don’t trust him. That’s why Sven have kept on Rossi god side and never told him that it don’t work.
Sven said that he have asked Rossi if Uppsala university can independently test the device, with the demand that all information will be reveled to the public. If Rossi says no to this Uppsala will not test the device.
One of the most interesting thins was that Sven kullander sad that Focardi and Levi are both excellent professor that he believe a 100% in, Rossi on the other hand is a little bit of a black box. He said that there are two black boxes in this history, Rossi and he ecat.
He also said that his colleague Roland Peterson (think that was his name) is very positive on the ecat.
Sven also showed the test of the nickel fuel and the copper nickel that is left after the reaction. They will come out with a full article on this when all the testing is done. But the first test show copper in the waste.
[With thanks to Tom in the eCatNews.com comments section and Akira Shirakawa on Vortex]
Steven Chu, a Nobel Prizewinner, is acting the stooge’s part in the Solyndra give away part of Obama’s green play.
***Steven Chu works for Obama, who controls trillions of $ of resources and is beholden to him. Kullander does not work for Rossi; nor does Rossi have anywhere near the kinds of resources, so your parallel breaks down.
So I ask you to post evidence of lies and you did not.
Lx has 2 things going on. One, he’s wound up way too tight, as if quoting cliches need to have academic citation here on the internet. Second, he doesn’t read very well or he would have seen that the thing was addressed.
If it takes 200 thousand Freepers “5 minutes” (that’s a load of crap) to learn HTML, then that’s about 2 years’ worth of peoples’ time. I’ve been on other internet boards where there are simple HTML options available, and it probably only takes the same “5 minutes” for someone to set up. Your efforts should be towards saving those 2 years rather than me. Besides, if you don’t like these threads, as usual, you don’t have to log onto them.
HTML tags are easy to set up on a website.
This will be my standard post to you that says you’re not worth trying to have reasonable discussion, also says “buzz off” & doesn’t leave crickets. But if it offends you to the point that you get it removed like my prior innocuous citation then I’ll have to come up with some other ‘ignore button’ post.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2800058/posts?page=55#55
To: Moonman62
This means I have nothing more to say to you about LENR. Bye.
55 posted on Sunday, October 30, 2011 4:41:07 PM by Kevmo (Caveat lurkor pro se ipso judicatis: Let the lurker decide for himself)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies | Report Abuse]
You would probably be better off looking that term up ~ no doubt your last and possibly only experience dealing with the substance was in the framework of the wheel well of the 747 where you stowed away for your trip to America.
The Leonardo Technologies Inc. part looks like a private sector mirror image of the White House Czar operation except they were contracted to provide "consultancy services" ~ to wit, where to stick the appropriated money.
Rossi doesn't just pop up out of the mists ~ he was around in the mid 1990s and so were the LTI guys but as DOE employees, or working with other DOE related subcontractors or lobbying operations (much of it in the "clean coal scam" ~ later on (meaning 3 years ago) an Obama favorite ~ even used in the 2008 campaign.
Now, let's flip back to Chu ~ he sounds like a total doufous ~ possibly selected for his job because he is too naive to understand the thefts taking place under his nose. Solyndra turned out to be a very bad deal ~ but yet LTI's consulting contract value doubled over 2years. Same guys ~ same number of employees ~ double the cost ~ which usually means something!
My statement was a hypothetical response to a poster's question of what could possibly cause a respected scientist to get sucked in by something that was questionable; it isn't a judgement on Rossi specifically.
I hope he's right; but there are some things he does which make me wonder. For example, recently he trumpeted the fact that National Instruments had agreed to work with him instrumenting the E-Cat. Well, my first thought was that NI will sell DAC boards to anyone--it seemed like a self-promotional announcement. Things like that make you wonder--but that's not the same as being there and able to form a definite opinion one way or the other.
Poor poor kevmo, reading comprehension really isn't your strong suit is it? I said you only need to learn five simple commands, not every one there is.
You must relish being an Internet keyboard tough-guy, does it help you make it thru the night or do you still have problems from being picked on at school?
What will you do when Rossi takes the money and runs?
That's what I do...
Lithium bicycle parts? Really? I like to think that if only I could be bothered to ponder the metaphysical meaning of this, it would indicate some profound truth.
My bike is made from Nobelium bicycle parts, it's kind of heavy. I don't think the manufacturer really understood the periodic table...
Well worth reading if you believe anything that is.
I especially like the part where he puts Edison, Tesla and Einstein on his front page like he is the next in line.
Nothing else worth mentioning in Google or Wiki, so that means Rossi has invented something else, a B.S. term or a song, take your pick.
Oswald Bates sounds more scienc-y than Rossi...
First of all, we must internalize the flatulation of the matter by transmitting the effervescence to further segregate the crux of my venereal infection...
...holistic, taken from the Latin word, jalapeno...
You won’t provide a link because you know that I caught you flat out lying about titanium parts in Chevrolet brakes.
Muawiyah, you are a liar. What’s strange is the type of things you choose to lie about!
I gave you two examples of your statements. Sorry you don’t like having your own words thrown back at you.
Good comeback ~ glad somebody has expertise in these matters.
Thanks for the tip. I was ready to live forever until I got to the part which said "Open your own Immortality Website."
dino: I gave you two examples of your statements. Sorry you don’t like having your own words thrown back at you.
***Basically, you are full of bowl sheet. For the benefit of lurkers I will rebuild the thread. It shows that you said there were lies. I asked for evidence of lies that I had “by my own admission” been aware of. You did nothing of the sort.
Original statement: he’s only lied about his education, criminal record, various companies, and (by your own admission, Kevmo) the performance and construction of his machine.
***Please provide evidence for this assertion.
Here’s one where you suggest that Rossi doesn’t want to provide physical evidence to back his claims:
***That is not a lie. That is, as you say, not backing up his claim with physical evidence.
Here’s one where you say that Rossi is intentionally witholding information regarding how his device works:
***That is not a lie. That is, as you say, intentionally witholding info.
I remember other posts from you where you outright said that Rossi is intentionally misleading about his device in order to protect his interest.
***And yet you do not provide the evidence. You are so full of bowl sheet.
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