Child Services Interviewed My Child ... Then Came to My House!

I have been very hesitant about releasing what happened to me regarding Child Protective Services. But after discussing this with Dave Hodges, from the Commonsense Radio Show on Republic Broadcasting, he said I need to get this information out to the public.

I got a call from Child Protective Services, the woman said they had gotten a “call” about me and abuse of my child. I was in shock, when she told me this. I was completely confused and it also freaked me out, as I could not comprehend on why someone had called Child Services on me. Anyone that knows me, knows how blessed I feel, in having my “miracle child”!

I asked the woman, if they were going to have to go to her father’s house also, she said “OH, I didn’t know the father did not live there”. I gave her, the father’s phone number and name. I also, asked “How can I be sure, you are who you say you are”. She gave me the phone number for the office and said I could call it back. After she let me know they would be at my house early the next morning and I was still completely freaked and confused on how someone could even think I have ever abused my child, I hung up. I called her father and let him know what was going on. The phone call was just a few minutes before my child was due home from school.

When my child got home, I got a bigger shock! My child told me, child services had come to her school that day and interviewed her! I told her to wait, to tell me anything, as I wanted to put her on speaker phone with her father so she could tell us at the same time, what questions they asked.

My child said, these are the questions they asked ” Does your mother have SOLAR PANELS? Where Exactly does your mother take you camping? Where exactly have you gone hiking? Do you hike and then camp? Does anyone else go with you camping? What do you do when you go camping? Does your mother have alternative energy? Does your mother have stored food? Does your mother have any guns? Does your mother saying anything about “The end of the world”? What kind of remodeling has your mother done to your home? Do you have a “safe room”, like a bomb shelter in your home?

***EDIT***12/5/10 9:20am est – I forgot to include another question, they asked my child: IF your mother takes you to church and exactly which church do you go to? They did not ask ME that question when I was interviewed – BUT they did ask the father that question in if he knew, if I take my child to church or not. I was surprised at this question, I thought there was a separation of Church and State and did not know those type questions were allowed. – END OF EDIT***

My child also said she told child services, her father does not live with me and there was shared custody and that included being at my house for one week and then her father’s house for one week. So my child TOLD Child services the father and I did not live together! I was upset, as the woman then lied to me on the phone saying “She did not know the father didn’t live here”. I hung up with her father to call Child services and confront the woman. Besides Child services asking what I considered were the MOST Bizarre questions I had EVER heard of, for a child abuse case! What the the World do ANY of those questions have to do with “Child abuse”?!!!!!

When the child services woman answered the phone, I started into her right away, saying she was not truthful about not knowing the father didn’t live here to me on the phone earlier! She was a little taken back it seems, that I would be confronting her as I was! She said “she did not remember my child telling her that”! I was telling her “Really?, MY Child TOLD you all about her living with her father and about her brother there and Everything, and you DON’T remember that?!” She said “No” she didn’t! I then said I had a HUGE problem with that fact then, because “What else, doesn’t she remember in her conversation with my child, when she had just interviewed my child?”. I also asked her “Why in the world would you ask a child about “the end of the world and even put any ideas like that in a child’s head”? She was flustered and said “they have to ask questions in regards to any accusations”.

I told her ” I will have witnesses here tomorrow, to make sure things stay “straight”! I also told her, she would NOT be allowed anywhere else in my house, EXCEPT for my child’s room, since that was required. *Child services has to confirm a child has a bed to sleep in, clothes and food, with any visit to a home*. She asked me Why – they would not be able to see the WHOLE House? I told her, because the ONLY thing required is her bedroom and that would be IT! She somewhat hung up the phone on me, with exasperation from the call.

I was One Upset person now! To me this was the Most Bizarre event happening. I sat back down with my child and asked her.. “was there anyone else in the room besides the child services people?” My child said “No”. I then asked my child “Did they ask, if I have ever hit you, did they ask if I drink, did they ask if I do drugs”? She said “No”, they did not ask ANY questions such as that! I was NOW completely confused! How in the heck, is it Child services did NOT ask what I would think would be NORMAL Child Abuse questions that would be abusive to a child! NOT ONE NORMAL CHILD ABUSE QUESTION WAS ASKED!

I called my sister, who lives by me and then I called some neighbors and asked them to be witnesses the next morning. Also I asked my sister to bring her video camera, as I wanted to TAPE the whole Child services interview!

The next morning, my neighbors and sister arrived early and my sister set up the camera, we waited.

The child services people as I opened the door saw the video camera rolling – there were 3 of them. The woman had brought her associate and her supervisor with her. They waved at the camera and I told them, for their protection as well as my own, the WHOLE interview was going to be recorded.

I told them, I had a right to know what the Accusations were against me, though they did not have to say WHO made the accusations, as soon as they acknowledged the camera.

The woman said the accusation was “mental abuse and neglect” against me. I asked how child services, decides if there is “mental abuse”, since that is very subjective in opinion? They simply agreed it was “subjective”. I then said, “Well, I will show you her room, clothes and food now, so that part is over with”. I took them to her room (I had all doors shut to all rooms of the house, as I felt it was none of their business in seeing any other rooms of my house). Then we came back and I opened up the fridge and freezer and then showed them the pantry, so they could see food was there. My sister followed us with the camera, everywhere we went, taping the child services workers.

They then asked if they could sit down and discuss the accusations. First they asked me “normal questions, my date of birth, my name, my child’s date of birth, my address, and other form questions as that.

They then asked me, if I had ever talked to my child about “the end of the world”? I told them “No, in fact I asked my child if kids ever said anything about it, just a couple of weeks before. My child told me “Yes, kids say stuff about 2012″ I told my child NOT to listen to any of the ridiculous stuff kids say”. I then told the child services people, I know they asked my child about it the day before and my child TOLD them I had NEVER said anything about “the end of the world” to her! So don’t they take my child’s word for that?! She said “Yes, they do”. So I said “then you know I have not said anything regarding end of the world type stuff”.

Then she asked if I had “stored food”? I told her… I follow the guidelines which FEMA has up on their site and I am a Red Cross Volunteer and have gone out on disasters with the Red Cross and I have had all the training with the Red Cross, in knowing that people should be self reliant for a couple of weeks, without needing help from the government or any other source during that time. So “I follow the Guidelines of the government and recommendations from the Red Cross in that respect”!

They then asked if I had an “alternative heat source” for my house! I said “Yes, I have a Yukon Eagle heater, which burns, wood or natural gas for heating my house”. I said “I have saved lots of money by heating my house with wood, compared to natural gas”. oh, they said “a problem with it could be carbon monoxide”, I told them, natural gas heaters had problems with that, besides I have carbon monoxide sensors. . They asked if they could see it (which it is downstairs in my basement), I went and got a brochure and the owners manual on it from my file cabinet and handed it to them, so they could look at it there. I was not going to take them downstairs to my basement, as I felt they did not have a right to “check out my house in all ways”. They mentioned wanting seeing it once more, I ignored it and I went on to another subject. The supervisor was familiar with the unit I have, as he said they have lots of them up north, where he came from.

Then they asked me, “what renovations have I done on my home and do I continue to do renovations to it”? I laughed and looked at my neighbors and sister as they too laughed. I told them, I have done lots of renovations, and my sister and I put the wood floors in here, I tiled the entrance and I just redid the hall ways and the outside entrance. I also had taken down walls. The supervisor asked “what walls and where exactly were taken down”? I stood up and said “right here, I took down walls that used to go across here and the wall that separated the kitchen and den”.

She then said “We understand you are a “blogger” and what exactly is your blog about, also it is said you have a “conspiracy mind”? I was a little shocked at this question and told them “mainly my blog is about the Foreclosure Fraud that has been happening”. They asked how many hours I spend blogging, as that is where the “neglect” part of the accusation came in, in that I spent most of my time “blogging”. I told them the weeks I don’t have my child “I blog more and spend more time on the computer”. But when I have my child, I spend time with my child! My neighbors piped up and said, “we see her outside playing with her child and she is probably one of the best mothers and my child is about the most well balanced child they have ever come across”. One neighbor said “we would not have the problems we do, if all kids were raised, as I was raising my child, as she is so balanced”.

I told the child services people, “I spend lots of time with my child and I was raising her to “give to others” and that my child and I do fund raisers for the Red Cross and she loves volunteering and doing what she can for others!” I told them, “I have let my child know, doing for others is one of the best things you can do in your life and beauty comes from the inside, not the out”.

Then they said “Well, here is the biggest accusation and one of the oddest accusations we have had before. They said I was accused of “Being a member of a Top Secret Agency, that worked against the Government”. My sister, neighbors and I began laughing very hard with this! I looked at them and said “Are you Serious?”

I asked them to repeat the accusation, after they did, I just laughed and said “No” as I continued laughing!

The supervisor did say “Well, I would think you would be having “men in black” come see you, if you were”.

They then began talking about “militias” and how they raise their children, I just listened to them and the way they were saying it, left it with a question to me on if I was involved in any. I made a comment saying “I would have absolutely no clue, about anything regarding militias, as I had never entered that realm or researched militias”.

I asked them directly and asked them to be honest, regarding them seeing any validity to the accusations.

They said, “they didn’t see any problems or validity of the accusations to me, before they left”.

I was waiting for all the questions about my camping with my daughter and so on…. those questions never were asked and at the time I did not think about asking about it either.

I asked them “do you have any more questions”? They said ‘No”. They were at my house for about one hour and after they left, I called my child’s father, to let him know they were on their way.

After a few hours, my child’s father called me and said “they had been at his house for 2 HOURS and the whole time, they were grilling them about ME”! He said, they asked him all kinds of things about my camping, and if HE knew where we went and what we did while camping! He also said “they said they were concerned, since I did not let them see the downstairs of my house”. He said they asked him, if he knew what my blog was about and did he read it? He told them “mainly financial stuff and the diseases from last winter and if they were so worried about it, they could get on the internet and read it themselves”.

I was completely flabbergasted! I was “WTF”? They did NOT ask ME about my camping with my child and they had TOLD me, they didn’t see any problems, yet they were telling my child’s father something different! I called and recorded my message for the child services woman saying “I don’t understand where there is a problem with me taking my child camping and Where we go, as you Never asked me a single thing about that”!

I will say, I have left 3 messages for her, since that day, asking for clarification on what the problem is with camping and Why is there a problem with our camping? I have never received a call back! Last week, I called and spoke to the supervisor that was here that day and said I wanted to know what accusation was in my regards to camping with my child? He had to look and would call me back. When he did call back, He said “he could not find one on the paperwork”. He also said, the accusations were unsubstantiated in their opinion, but they were going to be talking to my child once more. ***That has still not occurred, as of writing this***

SO……. I still would like to know why there were so many questions about my camping with my daughter and where we go camping, hiking and what we do, when we camp. When they had asked my child she told them “we camp in a tent and make sure not to be next to an RV, due to their generator noise and we go hiking to falls and on trails”. So if my child told them the type of stuff we do, they don’t ask me, BUT then they grill my child’s father on it….. What the Heck is WRONG with Camping?!

The day they were here, I will admit, I was completely Freaked out the whole time, as I had never had anything like this happen before. I did not confront them, with the questions they asked my child and why they asked my child the type questions they did, as I wanted to say as little as possible and not open any doors for them to conversations! I do regret now, not confronting them on the camping, solar panels, alternative energy, etc. when they were here. I also feel, they did not want to get into those questions, due to the camera filming everything too!

I did ask them…. were there any claims of “physical abuse” and they said “No”, there was nothing in claims of my abusing my child that way, only the “mental and neglect”.

Now here are my questions about this whole ordeal………….. and the accusations of Mental abuse and Neglect…………………….

How does if I have Solar panels have anything to do with of those two accusations?

How does what we do when we go camping have anything to do with those two accusations?

How does Who has ever gone camping with us, have anything to do with those two accusations?

How does if I have any stored food, have anything to do with those two accusations?

How does if I have an alternative heat source have anything to do with those two accusations?

I would like to know How doing Renovations on my house has anything to do with those two accusations?

I could possibly understand, if a parent talked about the “end of the world” to a child, how that would completely mess up a child’s mind, so in that regards, I do not believe that is such a “crazy” question! Though I did want to ask the child services people – “Are you going to go after those children’s parents, the ones who are telling MY child, the “end of the world is coming”? But I did not.

I would like to know in fact, in my doing lots of outdoor things with my child and going camping, is that not then a conflict to the accusation of neglect of a child? To me, that means a parent is far from neglecting a child, as they are spending time with the child outdoors, spending time together without T.V.s or other distractions! When did camping become being part of child abuse?

To sum this up, I drove myself crazy for awhile, wondering WHO would have made these accusations against me. I have accused a family member to thinking it was possibly a neighbor, to her father’s relatives. BUT, now that time has gone by and I have been able to think more clearly about it, including having a conversation with Dave Hodges from the “Commonsense Radio Show”, I am now of the opinion, another branch of the government, possibly sent Child Services to my home.

Dave Hodges, mentioned he has had previous shows about Child services and they are used by other branches to find out what people have or don’t have, as it is the easiest way to get information.

A person can not refuse child services into their house as they have a complete right under law to come in and they have to see a child’s room, clothes, and food, no matter what the accusation is.

One point I found out, after my child was interviewed, is…. they interviewed her, without anyone else in the room, I found out, a child has a RIGHT to have their own advocate and witness in the room with them when being interviewed by any government agency! I have let my child Know the rights now and have said “if they ever come back, you can Insist on having someone else in the room with you, Including your parents”!

I was fearful of revealing this information, in case child services could come back on me for it. But Dave Hodges explained “People NEED To know what is Happening” and “the more exposure to it, the less they can get you”!

I don’t know if all of that is true, but the hours I have spent dwelling on this whole ordeal, I have come more convinced, None of it makes ANY SENSE! The accusations do NOT match the questions! The questions had Nothing to do with Child Abuse! The questions were All about What I may or may NOT have!

So, is it actually from my having this blog and the comments I have made in regards to my thoughts and opinions on various subjects?

I will also clarify, I understand from seeing and living first hand, what disasters are like and what you need. I have experienced seeing them through the Red Cross, when I have gone out on disasters as a volunteer and I have lived through a major disaster, when I lived in St. Croix Virgin Islands when Hurricane Hugo hit. I lost everything I owned and it basically wiped out the whole island. I lived without electricity for 8 months after, besides having to live in an incomplete Hurricane damaged house and living with doing for yourself and others for a few weeks immediately afterward. We did not have the grocery stores or anything immediately after for a few weeks, in fact, I learned very fast, why having a little extra food is a good thing. There is nothing wrong with understanding “disasters do happen” and having some things in ready. Ask those, who went through Katrina, ask those who have been flooded out in Iowa, Nashville and other places. Ask those who due to ice storms have lived without electricity last winter in Kentucky or in the North East. Ask me and all the others who were isolated on St. Croix for a time after Hugo, before any help could arrive. Ask those in Haiti after the large earthquake.

But, what does being prepared as per the FEMA government website and other organizations recommend, have anything to do with child abuse? So, IF someone does Follow the guidelines of FEMA, then they are possibly on a list for the government to check out or being accused of child abuse?

So…… now the question is, are others who have been public about their opinions on varied subjects, have had the government check on them? Has child services been used in other cases where they asked bizarre questions, compared to abuse questions?

Dave Hodges from the Commonsense Radio show and I may join forces to find out, if there are other cases and people out there who have had this similar type incident happen to them? Is the government going around and trying to find out, what people may have or not have? Is the government going around, trying to find out if there is a “place in the woods” people plan on going to (hence the camping questions)?

***Note*** I have talked to Dave Hodges yet again today, he feels after talking to someone else who is an expert in regards to child services, is that I was being profiled and assessed in what kind of “threat” I may be for homeland security.

If that is the case, does that mean having a voice and using our voices to speak up in what we feel are wrongs happening in a peaceful manner and exercising our “rights” as citizens, we are then considered possible “threats”? So does that mean everyone in the United States who may not have a blog, yet they still will voice their thoughts and opinions on what is happening in the United States and around the world to friends and co-workers are possibly “threats”?

Yes, I have a blog, it is a place where I can voice my peaceful but frustrated opinions at times and provide information some may not be aware of at times. Does that make me someone “to watch”? I would like to say “I have more faith in our government, than them feeling people exercising their First Amendment rights to Free Speech are “threats” to the government, when they are done in a peaceful manner”. But can I say that with full confidence? Right now, I am not sure. If this whole ordeal was to find out what I may or may not have and to do an assessment on me by the government, then I would like to know…… have I moved to another country and just not know it? Have I moved to a country that feels everyone is a threat who may not agree with their policies, they are profiled and are threatened with their children being taken away?

What country have I woken up in and when exactly did I move from the country I thought I was living in?

I have always raised my voice, when I use to think it mattered to the politicians. I have called our elected government officials many times and voiced my opinions on bills (TARP, Stimulus, FISA) and have emailed all I could voicing my opinion in Washington, D.C. I have always felt we should stand up and have our voices heard. When I gave up, in realizing Washington D.C., was deaf to the people’s voices, is when I gave up trying to have my voice heard with them. I then began this blog, through the frustration of talking to the elected politicians as much as possible and knowing I was drowned out through the “yelling” of the lobbyist and big money of corporations and banks.

So, I have had my little blog, to give a spot for my voice, I do not break the law in any manner by voicing my opinion, but due to my voicing my thoughts and opinions, on my small blog …… it seems, I may be considered a possible “threat”?

Someone………. please wake me up, when I am back in the country I thought I was living in!

***Also, this is why, some may have noticed I have been slack on my “foreclosure fraud” information over the last month and not on it as much as I was previously, but I am getting back to myself now****

***UPDATE 12/5/10 – 10:50am est – I realized last night, as I continued thinking about this CPS ordeal and still trying to put the pieces together – this CPS interview happened within days of a conference call I had with a couple of Large Class Action Law Firms – regarding “the strategy” and what needed to be done to begin Class Action Foreclosure Fraud Law Suits in all States. I have no idea if this was the catalyst to the CPS allegations. What is also interesting, is we were suppose to have another conference call, the day before this happened – that call did not happen and since the firms have not gotten back to me, yet Class Actions were suppose to begin. This was not information I wanted to release, it may or may not have something to do with this. End of Update**

OH, one other comment – my child went from being a Straight A student with a couple of B’s all her school years, to getting F’s on tests and began failing classes, the week after this happened! My child was very Traumatized by the Child services ordeal, as she was/is aware of child services and what they do from T.V. etc. and she was Freaked out that she may be “taken away”! So…… she has now just begun “not worrying” about it at this time.

EDIT – 12/4/10 A Reader Story sent to me – CPS investigated him for Feeding his children Organic Food, not letting them drink fluoridated tap water and having a Bug Out Bag!

I have decided to put 3 very short portions of the video from the CPS people interviewing me. They are very short, just so people can hear and see the allegations I mentioned in my article about it, did in fact happen.

I am not a video editor, in fact it was the first time – I has literally taken me two days, just to get these done and even then, they cut off – not at the places intended. Lots of learning curves for me, in editing a video in anyway.

"If you try to stop them you can and will go to jail!"

Bull-o-nee.

From Calabretta v. Floyd, 189 F. 3d 808 - Court of Appeals, 9th Circuit 1999...

Not only can police and CPS NOT enter without a warrant, if they do enter without a warrant (a coerced entry), they no longer enjoy qualified immunity. IOW, they are personally liable for civil damages.

I have no idea what happened to you or when. The law today is crystal clear - no warrant, no entry.

"All it takes is a phone call from someone and they show up at your kids school without you knowing about it and on your door step as well."

Sure, they can show up at your doorstep, but you clearly don't have to let them in, or even speak to them. That's the law.

I used to live in Bolingbrook Illinois before moving to Florida. I had a next door neighbor who used to park his Diesel semi truck tractor in his driveway. One day I took a picture of three such trucks parked in that driveway at the same time even though it was illegal to even drive one of those trucks on the city streets let alone park it overnight in a residential neighborhood.

Along with that, he used to leave the truck running overnight during cold weather. His driveway was located about ten feet from our bedrooms wall.

There wasn't a fence between our lots and he often parked his truck partially on OUR property despite us frequently asking him to stop. I finally had to call the police just to stop him from leaving the trucks running all night long.

He or more likely his wife retaliated by filing a complaint against my wife and I with the local department of Family Services who took three of our children for questioning without telling us beforehand. They even came out to our house and asked us a lot of questions before finally admitting that they didn't believe the allegations against us.

The real problem is that anyone can file false accusations against someone else alledging child abuse and even though the agency knows the charges are fraudulent, they simply don't punish the liars who make the false charges.

In regards to that neighbors wife, she and possibly her son and maybe even the father used to call our house all during the night often making over 100 calls per month.

The police claimed that they couldn't do anything about them unless we first had a wiretap placed on out phone line and also got a statement from the phone company documenting the date and time of all the phone calls along with the calling number.

Since all the calls were local rather than long distance, the phone company didn't keep any individual record of the local calls since they aren't billed by length or time of day. Therefore it was impossible to produce such record as requested by the police. We had to pay to have our number ‘audited’ just too get that report.

One day after one such late night phone call, I told the neighbors son that we reported the calls to the police and the police were auditing the phone calls coming in and that we were fully prepared to press a criminal complaint with documented proof against whoever was making the calls.

I also informed him of the laws regarding those illegal calls and the amount the perpetrator could be fined along with a prison sentence and the fact that I was also going to sue the perp as well.

Those phone calls immediately stopped.

One really interesting thing was shortly after moving in next door they told me that they were run out of the last neighborhood they were living in because of the truck.

One other thing is that shortly before we moved to Florida, the husband committed suicide by shooting himself after he was arrested for carrying a gun in his truck.

I downloaded the radio interview from the link on Sherrie’s website. Common Sense Radio show on RepublicBroadcasting.org. Sherrie went looking for the FEMA camps and the coffins and wrote about it on her website.

She went to the media and got translations about the plague in the Ukraine. (It was much worse than the media reported and she has blogs on this information.) The radio host says she has the best information about the mortgage fraud.

Sherrie explained: The bankers separated the mortgage note from the deed. They sold the MBS - mortgage back securities - they would take one 100k loan and put it in 20 different MBS and sold them.

She has a letter on her website (link below) that each person who has a MERS mortgage needs to mail to the servicer.

http://sherriequestioningall.blogspot.com/2010/07/mers-mortgage-electronic-registration.html

The servicer by law has to answer the questions on the letter and they can’t foreclose on the mortgagee.

Then in the interview they discuss the visit by CPS. Earlier in the interview Sherrie mentions that she lives in TN. A caller calls in and she says - go look for yourself - question it!

They found a FEMA camp next to a high school. There was a drill with students - but not a normal drill. They took the students away from the building on buses.

Sherrie reflects on the CPS incident.
They have no right to question your children without an advocate or parents to be there. They do not tell you who has accused the parent.

Interference - host mentions the ‘powers that be’....

This person, Sherrie, is an inspiration!

Sherrie Questioning All - website

http://sherriequestioningall.blogspot.com/2010/12/is-govt-trying-to-find-out-who-has-what.html

Sherrie’sChannel
http://www.youtube.com/user/tnknoxrealtor

Download the radio interview - 2 are listed there - one is Sherry(Wilcox) and the other is about Executive orders and FEMA

http://republicbroadcasting.org/archives/index.php?cmd=archives.month&ProgramID=61&year=10&month=12&backURL=index.php%253Fcmd%253Darchives.getyear%2526ProgramID%253D61%26year%3D10%26backURL%3Dindex.php%253Fcmd%253Darchives

As a foster mother for Children’s services for over 30 years before I retired, BELIEVE IT! DCFS often act like gestapo!!! It happened to my nephew and family. LITERALLY ruined their family because of being falsely accused.

I trust Children's Protective Services, DCFS, Department of Children's Services, and similar names about as much as I would an ill tempered rattlesnake shedding it's skin. I've had my own not so pleasant experiences with them as a former foster parent. Lies? They are the masters of them. Most of these agencies are ran by Ultra Left Wing Liberals with many agendas most of them of which have nothing to do with the actual safety or well being of abused or neglected children. Many can't wait to get a child returned to truly abusive situations so their reunification percentages will look good. If they get abused again the cycle gets repeated.

The person did right by gathering witnesses and video taping. All it takes to get one of these agencies after you is one anonymous call to a hot line. One vengeance call can ruin your entire life as well as your children This person wrote a blog? That is where the caller likely originated from. Someones toes got stepped on.

Not all caseworkers are like this but all but two I dealt with purposely and intentionally lied to me and mislead me. As well they enabled unfit parents and in my case I was qualified to make the assessment of the parents involved being unfit.

Children's Services in most states is the most abusive and least accountable to anyone state agency. If I had read this story a few years ago I would have said Bull. After my experiences with them and in court where I was made their scapegoat for botching a case? I'd believe about any horror story related to such an agency.

If most Conservatives ever had to attend required Parenting Classes to become a Foster Parent even to their blood kin they would be 100% disgusted by the agenda and propaganda taught in those classes. IOW They hate your guts Conservatives.

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