Posted on 12/30/2009 4:51:48 PM PST by Publius804
It appears that some state and county Tea Party groups are trying to cleanse their ranks of libertarians. That's a shame since the movement started with Ron Paul and his libertarian followers, and was then co-opted by mainstream GOP Sean Hannity types.
Lawrence Samuels, editor of Facets of Liberty: A Libertarian Primer and participant in the Monterey County Tea Party, is witnessing the purge firsthand:
[A]fter a successful 4th of July Tea Party parade and Freedom Rally in Monterey, the cracks in the alliance split wide open. I was accused of belonging to too many leftist organizations. In fact, I am co-chair of the local Libertarians for Peace, which joined the 27-member Monterey County Peace Coalition to protest the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. But Libertarians for Peace is neither Left nor Right….
Obviously, the Tea Party conservatives were neophytes; never before had they been involved in political activism. Some had never heard of Congressman Ron Paul. Prof. David R. Henderson, one of the libertarian Tea Party Board members, described this curious phenomenon as "activism without ideals." I thought my phrase captured it best: "a cause without a rebel." In fact, as demands to purge the libertarians intensified, we got the distinct feeling that the purgers fit the category of "reactionary" since they seemed to know only what they were against, not what they were for. Amazingly, they never pointed out any philosophical differences that they found objectionable. It was as if they were devoid of ideas, marooned with empty rhetoric and no real solutions….
In retrospect, it did not help our case when we asked these rookies embarrassing questions. We asked them why they had done nothing when President Bush bailed out the banks and auto companies, spent money like a drunken sailor, bashed civil liberties and advanced socialized medicine with Medicare Prescription Drug law, a program that some in Congress estimated will have a price tag of $1.2 trillion by 2016. I suppose our questioning merely rubbed their noises too deeply in their ignorance.
You can read his entire account here.
If the Tea Party movement is to function merely as the activist wing of Republican talk radio, it won't get very far.
Just what I'd expect from a Godless nanny-statist.
Ha haaa!!!
Just kidding. I couldn't resist.
Obviously no one has followed the links to and the read the original cause of the split. The (so called) Libertarian tried to get Code Pink in as a sponsor and participant here in Monterey County. When it comes to anti-war, a whole lot of Libertarians have fallen for the bogus logic of “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” and they will regret it someday because Code Pink is no friend of any Libertarians, Conservatives or Republicans and has no business participating at any Tea Party.
Some good reads on this thread.
Rick Santelli had covered Ron Paul many times before his famous rant. Example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAlACZtfnb8
Here is an article about being alert of those in the Rino GOP & Demorats hijacking the TeaParty.
http://caivn.org/article/2009/11/30/tea-party-co-founder-blasts-mainstream-gop-imitators
Many can take credit for it. Who cares. The Tea Party is everyone.
We need everyone, from all walks of life, who care about America, to stand up and be heard and vote.
Vote out the liars and cheats in both parties and vote Constitutional Conservative Candidates in.
We better unite as One, otherwise we fall again in 2010 and 2012.
After that the United States as we know it will be gone.
Beware the local GOP and who they are trying to purge.
It was the local GOP in NY23 that supported a liberal Dede Scozzava while the Tea Party, Paulbots, Libertarians and every other American supported Doug Hoffman.
Read the article and the one he was promoting, and it will be obvious to you that the original “perp” in this chain of events was the Communist who hijacked the Tea Party name in Monterey County.
A true political animal he clubbed a newborn animal then co-opted it for his own purposes.
Almost all Tea Party people I have met, are actually libertarian-leaning conservatives.
That is the same vein as Reagan and also Palin.
The author and source of the confusion related to in the Original Post was a true-blooded capital L Libertarian, hell he probably has his own flag.
Protect our young fledgling cub of a movement, from political animals like the commie that the story was about.
Tom
if not for the phrase "and some of his supporters", you'd be really pushing slander, there.
Why is it that those who smear (yes, smear) JBS, Ron Paul, Libertarians, and others must do so by not dealing with the specific individual positions the person they discuss takes in a rational manner, but instead resort to lumping the target person with a host of other people the target person may not agree with and using the position of those who follow to declare the advocacies of those who lead.
I have yet to read anything Ron Paul said advocating men marrying their daughters, women marrying horses and dogs, no Govt agencies, no allies, drugs of all sorts on the street corner, sex in the street etc.
While I have read comments he has made regarding restraining the Federal Government to its Constitutionally authorized duties, "sex in the street" is something I have never seen, heard, nor read Ron Paul advocate.
While I disagree with some of his positions on issues, wholesale character asassination does nothing to improve either your credibility nor the quality of discussion here, such as that has become.
you might not have heard it but he did say that we do nto need the FBI,CIA,NSA etc.
His supporters or some of them even on here have said that Govt has no right to tell anyone why or who they must marry including daughter and sons and yes one poster even said an animals
as for smearing well both sides use that word but mostly those on the left who like to play victim.
while i might agree with him on a couple of issues I od not on many and he comes across as a kook many times
Now if you feel like your hurt, slandered or insulted then so be it.
I’m fed up of hearing those who cry about words being used.
nearly forgot as for sex in the street then Yes some of his supporters I’ve met, in NH and down here have said Govt should not interfere with those who want to do that sort of act and yes they have used the usual line we hear so many times.
Govt has no right to tell anyone what they can and cannot do.
“If the Tea Party movement is to function merely as the activist wing of Republican talk radio, it won’t get very far”
Makes it sound like the pot party has huge numbers we can’t do without. Go vote third party and keep sending liberal dems to Washington.The GOP should distance themselves from the Libertarians just as much as the Aryans.Neither group is truly conservative nor viable
sorry for got to add that I said some of his supporters which is truth.
Not all I know but some and those some are the ones I was refering to.
There’s loons on all sides but I’ll be honest during the election I met quite a few paul supporters and while some were great and down t earth others infact no most were not.
I got , don’t forget my impression and my thoughts, that they wanted to go back to how it was during 1757.
again no smears but my views and maybe I had the misfortune of meets the only loons who followed him and maybe I didn’t
anyway happy new year Joe to you and your family
“Perhaps they are “purging” you because you come across as an arrogant prick”
Bingo, we have a winner
Sounds like democrats to me. Go support some conservative dem candidates. All they bring the Republican party is rinos
I don't give a diddley-squat what his "supporters" say.
Get that?
If you are going to badmouth the man, keep your rhetoric confined to HIS comments.
You can seed any crowd with idiots and then say so-and-so's supporters say "blah-blah-blah", but that does not indicate the position that so-snd-so takes on the issues.
Second-hand crap, projecting one person's beliefs on another. Liberal dung.
Now if you feel like your hurt, slandered or insulted then so be it.
It isn't ME I am worried about, but the truth. If I want bullsh*t, I can turn on CNN or MSNBC, or one of the other networks. If I come to this website, as I have been doing for considerably longer than you, and see someone spewing dreck out of their keyboard, I'm going to call them on it.
I’m fed up of hearing those who cry about words being used.
What words? "When in the course of human events...?"
"We, the people..."
Words have meanings. meanings have consequences.
If you're fed up after your short time on this site, maybe you should be somewhere else.
Our entire Constitutional Republic has long depended on the accurate interpretation of thoughts written in words, and slamming words recklessly about the page is not conducive to keeping nor restoring our Republic.
...nearly forgot as for sex in the street then Yes some of his supporters I’ve met, in NH and down here have said Govt should not interfere with those who want to do that sort of act...
Supporters said...yadda yadda yadda. What did Ron Paul say? Unless HE said he supports that, he didn't say it, did he?
Quit putting the words of others in his mouth and let him speak for himself. You just might find things he really agrees with to disagree with.
As for the TEA Party movement, Government derives its just powers from the consent of the governed.
The movement afoot, no matter who wants to slap a label of some political party on it so they can generalize it or marginalize it, is simply about people saying that government has exceeded the scope of the powers the people consent to give it.
Pay attention, here.
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness--That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the Governed, that whenever any form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."
The quote, which I hope you recognize, is from our own Declaration of Independence. It is the justification for the Revolution which followed, the reason for the existence of this Republic.
We, the People are the source of the Government's powers, not subjects to be fed crumbs from the table of the "ruling class" and pilfered at their whim. It only surprises me that it has taken this long for the people to get motivated to raise their voices in protest.
right I’ll use his words then
I think he’s a nut , his comments like I said not needing the FBI, CIA, NSA etc during the campaign made me think that
His comments I read yesterday in an article on here confirmed that he is a nut for me
you asked about his supporters and I gave you examples, don’t lie it tough.
As for truth then the guy like I just said is a nut to me.
Blaming it on us for all these troubles etc is not what is accurate IMHO.
Getting rid of the FBI, CIA during these times shows he has not got a grasp of what is going on.
His supporters or shall I say as I have been is that they think we should go back to 1746.
Marry anything, do what ever in public etc, yes I have heard that and met those who say that.
No matter how much you support Paul I as many think he’s a nut, he makes comments which are way off base and like I said I actually agree with a couple of his principles but sadly the guy goes way over the top and even more over than the kooks on the left.
Now you support him ,fine but it won’t change my mind or others about him regardless of how you try and defend him.
“If drugs are legalized, the price will go down and abuse will go up!”
Abuse may go up but the price will not go down. Taxation will be heavy and the black market will continue to flourish
“How will abuse go up when employers and state governments reserve the right to prohibit their usage?”
The same as states and employers prohibiting their abuse has no effect now
When have they ever helped the GOP? When have they ever moblized to support a constitutionalist Republican?
Never
Not that I can recall at least. They are always on the attack against the GOP no matter how conservative and free market orientated a Republican is.
They play the Saul Alinsky game. They hold the best Republican up to a standard which cannot be reached and then attack for not reaching it.
I don't trust them. I don't believe them. Unlike the Democratic party which, for over 7 decades has had allies (the CPUSA, the Socialist Party, Greens) on the left dragging it to further the left, allies which only rarely attacked the Democratic Party, every libertarian I've run across spends more time attacking the GOP than Democrats.
I was in Vegas when Reid squeaked in by 800 or so votes. Libertarians were trashing Ensign even though he was with them on most everything at that time. Then in 2002 we saw the LP take money from the DNC to run ads against a Republican in the south. In 2004 the LP and Greens contested the Ohio vote.
Used to believe libertarians could fill the role on the right the CPUSA has filled on the left. But no more. I'ld rather they just go away. They've never accomplished one thing but elect Democrats. If there were sincere, they would have had some impact in advancing what they claim to want. As they have not, I regret to say I see them as no different than Emma Goldman's anarchists. They are the wrecking ball clearing the way for the Bolsheviks to march in.
I'm not bashing or trying to bash by saying this. What I relate is my experience with them over nearly two decades. I wish they would help elect constitutionalists but I don't see it ever happenings. I speak of the sincere ones when I say that. You know and I know there are fakes in the libertarian movement. Socialists pretending to be libertarians for the sole purpose of bleeding off republican votes.
The Republicans don’t owe the Libertarians jack. The Libertarians have cost Republicans numerous seats at all levels of politics, as they draw off some Republican support.
If the Libertarians wanted to actually help their cause, they would instead fight at the Primary level, and help the conservatives get rid of the fruitcakes, like Ron Paul’s son, who is an IDIOT in Kentucky.
No.
Let’s not forget the Republican Party Refused to put up a candidate their base could stomach.
Because the social issues are way to important to compromise on.
A point is reached where comnservative in some areas isn’t good enough. Things that are worth fightiung for remain worth fighting for.
The life of children is one of those things.
The security of the nation is another.
I was libertarian back in the 70’s. The movement had infighting back then, and the old faction with values I held were abandoned in total. Today’s libertine party bears superficial resemblance at best to the libertarian ideals of that bygon era of my youth.
Ron Paul’s anti military kookiness alone is reason enough to reject both him, and anyone who lacks the moral rectitude to disavow themselves of him.
>> Let’s not forget the Republican Party Refused to put up a candidate their base could stomach.
Yes.
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