Continuing The Bigotry

Captain's Quarters Blog ^ | 06/10/07 | Ed Morrisey

[MHGinTN]

Ping for help with research regarding the Popes wrtiing themselves into Torah.

[Elsie]

I feel pretty and witty and gay
And I pity
Any girl who isn't me today

Ah! You have the CORRECT lyrics!!

Way back in the '90's, I went to a high school production of WSS and was jarred when I heard this:

...
I feel pretty and witty and BRIGHT
And I pity
Any girl who isn't me TONIGHT...

Since WSS is one of my favorites, it was extremely telling that the words had been changed to 'protect' sensitive ears.

I don't know for sure, but if they tried this today, the Homo community would be up in arms, protesting and being really obnoxious!!

(And that would just be the school's Glee Gay Club!!!)

[Elsie]

- King James
Acts 24:14  But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

 

-- American Standard
Acts 24:14  But this I confess unto thee, that after the Way which they call a sect, so serve I the God of our fathers, believing all things which are according to the law, and which are written in the prophets;

 

-- New International
Acts 24:14  However, I admit that I worship the God of our fathers as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that agrees with the Law and that is written in the Prophets,

---

Interesting tagline verse...

[Elsie]

Quit posting these historical facts!! (1-6)

You’ll get people starting to doubt our great and glorious forefathers who have handed us such wonderful, sacred rites!

—MormonDude

[Elsie]

Mogen David, Manischewitz... good stuff.

And what is another famous Jewish wine?

“When are we goin’ to Miami this year?”

[Salvation]

Read about the Council of Jerusalem in Acts.

Read about Jesus Christ giving the keys of the kingdom to Peter.

Read about Jesus telling Peter, “You are a rock and upon this rock I will build my church.”

All in the Bible, but not in the first books.

[Salvation]

Other Scripture contained in this link:

The Early Church Fathers on The Primacy of Peter/Rome (Catholic/Orthodox Caucus)

[Elsie]

 

Read about Jesus telling Peter, “You are a rock and upon this rock I will build my church.”

 

 

UMmmm... not exactly true---

 

 

Is Peter the 'rock'?

 

---

NIV Matthew 4:18-19
 18.  As Jesus was walking beside the Sea of Galilee, he saw two brothers, Simon called Peter and his brother Andrew. They were casting a net into the lake, for they were fishermen.
 19.  "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men."

 

NIV Matthew 8:14
 14.  When Jesus came into Peter's house, he saw Peter's mother-in-law lying in bed with a fever.

 

NIV Matthew 10:1-2
 1.  He called his twelve disciples to him and gave them authority to drive out evil  spirits and to heal every disease and sickness.
 2.  These are the names of the twelve apostles: first, Simon (who is called Peter) and his brother Andrew; James son of Zebedee, and his brother John;

 

NIV Matthew 14:28-31
 28.  "Lord, if it's you," Peter replied, "tell me to come to you on the water."
 29.  "Come," he said.   Then Peter got down out of the boat, walked on the water and came toward Jesus.
 30.  But when he saw the wind, he was afraid and, beginning to sink, cried out, "Lord, save me!"
 31.  Immediately Jesus reached out his hand and caught him. "You of little faith," he said, "why did you doubt?"

 

NIV Matthew 15:13-16
 13.  He replied, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.
 14.  Leave them; they are blind guides.  If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit."
 15.  Peter said, "Explain the parable to us."
 16.  "Are you still so dull?" Jesus asked them.

 

---

As you can see, Simon was already known as 'Peter'

BEFORE the following verses came along.....

---

NIV Matthew 16:13-18
 13.  When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say the Son of Man is?"
 14.  They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets."
 15.  "But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"
 16.  Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ,  the Son of the living God."
 17.  Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven.
 18.  And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades  will not overcome it.

 19.  I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be  bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."

---

NIV 1 Corinthians 10:4
 4.  and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

 

NIV Luke 6:48
 48.  He is like a man building a house, who dug down deep and laid the foundation on rock. When a flood came, the torrent struck that house but could not shake it, because it was well built.

 

NIV Romans 9:33
 33.  As it is written: "See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

 

 

 

NIV 1 Peter 2:4-8
 4.  As you come to him, the living Stone--rejected by men but chosen by God and precious to him--
 5.  you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
 6.  For in Scripture it says: "See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."
 7.  Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe, "The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone, "
 8.  and, "A stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall." They stumble because they disobey the message--which is also what they were destined for.

---

But, since there WAS no NT at the time Christ spoke to Peter, just what DID Peter and the rest of the Disciples know about ROCKS???

---

 

NIV Genesis 49:24-25
24.  But his bow remained steady, his strong arms stayed limber, because of the hand of the Mighty One of Jacob, because of the Shepherd, the Rock of Israel,
 25.  because of your father's God, who helps you, because of the Almighty,  who blesses you with blessings of the heavens above, blessings of the deep that lies below, blessings of the breast and womb.

 

NIV Numbers 20:8
 8.  "Take the staff, and you and your brother Aaron gather the assembly together. Speak to that rock before their eyes and it will pour out its water. You will bring water out of the rock for the community so they and their livestock can drink."

 

NIV Deuteronomy 32:4
 4.  He is the Rock, his works are perfect, and all his ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is he.

 

NIV Deuteronomy 32:15
 15.  Jeshurun  grew fat and kicked; filled with food, he became heavy and sleek. He abandoned the God who made him and rejected the Rock his Savior.

 

NIV Deuteronomy 32:18
 18.  You deserted the Rock, who fathered you; you forgot the God who gave you birth.

 

NIV Deuteronomy 32:30-31
 30.  How could one man chase a thousand, or two put ten thousand to flight, unless their Rock had sold them, unless the LORD had given them up?
 31.  For their rock is not like our Rock, as even our enemies concede.

 

NIV 1 Samuel 2:2
 2.  "There is no one holy  like the LORD; there is no one besides you; there is no Rock like our God.

 

NIV 2 Samuel 22:2-3
 2.  He said: "The LORD is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
 3.  my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge, my shield and the horn  of my salvation. He is my stronghold, my refuge and my savior-- from violent men you save me.

 

NIV 2 Samuel 22:32
 32.  For who is God besides the LORD? And who is the Rock except our God?

 

NIV 2 Samuel 22:47
 47.  "The LORD lives! Praise be to my Rock! Exalted be God, the Rock, my Savior!

 

NIV 2 Samuel 23:3-4
 3.  The God of Israel spoke, the Rock of Israel said to me: `When one rules over men in righteousness, when he rules in the fear of God,
 4.  he is like the light of morning at sunrise on a cloudless morning, like the brightness after rain that brings the grass from the earth.'

 

NIV Psalms 18:2
 2.  The LORD is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer; my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge. He is my shield and the horn  of my salvation, my stronghold.

 

NIV Psalms 18:31
 31.  For who is God besides the LORD? And who is the Rock except our God?

 

NIV Psalms 18:46
 46.  The LORD lives! Praise be to my Rock! Exalted be God my Savior!

 

NIV Psalms 19:14
 14.  May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight, O LORD, my Rock and my Redeemer.

 

NIV Psalms 28:1

 

 1.  To you I call, O LORD my Rock; do not turn a deaf ear to me. For if you remain silent, I will be like those who have gone down to the pit.

 

NIV Psalms 31:2-3
 2.  Turn your ear to me, come quickly to my rescue; be my rock of refuge, a strong fortress to save me.
 3.  Since you are my rock and my fortress, for the sake of your name lead and guide me.

 

NIV Psalms 42:9
 9.  I say to God my Rock, "Why have you forgotten me? Why must I go about mourning, oppressed by the enemy?"

 

NIV Psalms 62:2
 2.  He alone is my rock and my salvation; he is my fortress, I will never be shaken.

 

NIV Psalms 62:6
 6.  He alone is my rock and my salvation; he is my fortress, I will not be shaken.

 

NIV Psalms 62:7
 7.  My salvation and my honor depend on God ; he is my mighty rock, my refuge.

 

NIV Psalms 71:3
 3.  Be my rock of refuge, to which I can always go; give the command to save me, for you are my rock and my fortress.

 

NIV Psalms 78:35
 35.  They remembered that God was their Rock, that God Most High was their Redeemer.

 

NIV Psalms 89:26
 26.  He will call out to me, `You are my Father, my God, the Rock my Savior.'

 

NIV Psalms 92:14-15
 14.  They will still bear fruit in old age, they will stay fresh and green,
 15.  proclaiming, "The LORD is upright; he is my Rock, and there is no wickedness in him."

 

NIV Psalms 95:1
 1.  Come, let us sing for joy to the LORD; let us shout aloud to the Rock of our salvation.

 

NIV Psalms 144:1
 1.  Praise be to the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle.

 

NIV Isaiah 17:10
 10.  You have forgotten God your Savior; you have not remembered the Rock, your fortress.

 

NIV Isaiah 26:4
 4.  Trust in the LORD forever, for the LORD, the LORD, is the Rock eternal.

 

NIV Isaiah 30:29
29.  And you will sing as on the night you celebrate a holy festival; your hearts will rejoice as when people go up with flutes to the mountain of the LORD, to the Rock of Israel.

 

NIV Isaiah 44:8
 8.  Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are my witnesses. Is there any God besides me? No, there is no other Rock; I know not one." 

 

NIV Habakkuk 1:12
 12.  O LORD, are you not from everlasting? My God, my Holy One, we will not die. O LORD, you have appointed them to execute judgment; O Rock, you have ordained them to punish.

---

.....No other rock.............

 

And now you know the Biblical position!

[sevenbak]

The temple endowment is heavily plagiarized from Masonic ceremonies that Joseph Smith went through himself just 6 weeks before he introduced the Endowment. And you won’t find a reputable scholar on this subject who thinks that the Masonic ceremonies originated before the medieval era.

Degaston, since you were a former member, you know that often the way Joseph Smith received revelation was AFTER learning about something, and then specifically seeking answers about it from God. This holds true with Baptism, the priesthood, Word of Wisdom, etc, etc, etc.

ASK ye shall receive, SEEK and ye shall find, KNOCK it shall be opened unto you.

As far as Masons and "reputable" scholars tracing their heritage back to the medieval, era, there's likely some truth to that, most Masons don't know what they had, although there are many that claim a Solomononetic link, but as far as the specifics of rituals and ordinances of the temple, they can be traced back as far as God has spoken to Man on earth.

Here are a couple excellent treatises on the subject of ancient Temple worship and Masonry. They are among several that I have found that explores the ancient rites of the Temple. I have more if you are truly interested. I hope you will take the time to read this, it's pretty thorough, and gets right to the heart of apparently why you decided the Temple was a Masonic fraud. If you are an earnest seeker of truth, please read these:

http://shields-research.org/General/Masonry.html

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences/1999_Early_Christian_and_Jewish_Rituals_Related_to_Temple_Practices.html

[sevenbak]

Yes it’s an interesting tagline, especially as you pointed out the the modernized versions of the Bible change “Heresy” to sect.

I use the King James version, but either way, wither I'm called a heretic or part of a sect, I follow Christ, the God of my fathers as well.

Cheers.

[sevenbak]

Yes, those evil Masons. It’s too bad that 14 of our former POTUS were Masons as well as Christians, who duped the American electorate.

George Washington would never be fit for office today!

[cherry]

"including most Mormons don’t really give a rat’s a** about theology."

LOL...that is so reassuringly true....

[cherry]

its not Catholics who claim to be perfect,nor Lutherans, nor Methodists, nor Baptists, etc.... fact is, our respective religions teach us that we are sinners, period.....

there is only one group that speaks constantly about how good they are, how perfect, how beautiful and rich and married they are.....guess?

[nowandlater]

It ain’t Mormons either. Sorry to dispel your fantansies.

[Elsie]

It’s too bad that 14 of our former POTUS were Masons as well as Christians, who duped the American electorate.

Yep!

I've seen that handshake when they are sworn in!

How come the TV cameras NEVER zoom in to show the WORLD that handshake CLOSEUP???

Must be something to it!

---

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=HPIC,HPIC:2005-18,HPIC:en&q=masonic+oath

[Elsie]

Notice the wording and the technique used on THIS website...

http://www.masonicinfo.com/bloody.htm

[Asclepius]

ts not Catholics who claim to be perfect,nor Lutherans, nor Methodists, nor Baptists, etc.... fact is, our respective religions teach us that we are sinners, period....

Whether anyone claims to be perfect or not does not concern me. It's the killing Jews thing that concerns me. Hence: Catholicism concerns me.

there is only one group that speaks constantly about how good they are, how perfect, how beautiful and rich and married they are.....guess?

Democrats?

[Asclepius]

Thanks for the information. I'll be studying the persons you mention, with an eye to seeing the rewrites in comparison to Joe Smith's rewrite of the Old Testament.

My absolute least favourite revisionist of the Tanakh is the detestable Origen, one of the so-called fathers of the church. His singular contribution to the improvement of our species was to emasculate himself with a dusty potsherd, publicly, on the street, after an afternoon in the baths. May his act be for an example to all revisionists, everywhere! His everlasting shame lies in his allegorizing the entire Torah--reducing every narrative, every account--to a foreshadowing or prefiguring of Christ, or as illustrative of Christ's relationship to his Church , or the believer's relationship to the Christan God etc., etc. The Jews were reduced to but bit players, walk-ons, and cameos in their own drama! Joseph Smith never attempted so obscene a re-write of OUR tradition. Not yours: OURS.

So: if the question is whether I would choose to be ruled by Catholics or Mormons, I would choose Mormons every single time. And besides: Mormons have no history of, you know, killing Jews. Bonus!

[Asclepius]

Yes, those evil Masons. It’s too bad that 14 of our former POTUS were Masons as well as Christians, who duped the American electorate.

Indeed. Funding hospitals. Supporting good works. Eating ribs and drinking beer. Those evil Masons must be of the devil.

[Degaston]

>> Degaston, since you were a former member ....

  Actually I am a current member of the church. In fact I'm a High Priest. I just happen to be a church member who isn't afraid to be honest. I will defend the church when they are honest. And I'll be honest about situations where its obvious that they aren't.

  >> you know that often the way Joseph Smith received
>> revelation was AFTER learning about something, and
>> then specifically seeking answers about it from God.

  When was Joseph Smith ever given a revelation that he should be justified in committing plagiarism? When has the church ever officially and properly attributed the elements of the Endowment that came from Masonic origins? If they haven't done this then they've committed plagiarism and they're still doing it to this day. Go read the definition on plagiarism from a dictionary and you'll have to agree that this is what it is.

  BTW the shields-research.org and fairlds.org are not and have never been official church websites. And considering all the times that some Mormon apologists are so quick to dismiss or ignore a sermon from Brigham Young or some passage in the LDS scriptures or Journal of Discourses or even the Milennial Star or 7-volume History of the Church set that doesn't fit well with their 21st century worldview it's pretty important that when it comes to Mormonism that we get officially sanctioned information on important questions.