[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you so much for your post, Physicist!

Jeepers, this conversation reminds me a lot of the ones we've already had on observer, value and evolution.

This, from the same link Dictionary of Philosphy of Mind - ought to help clear things up:

As used in the philosophy of science, physicalism is the view that all factual knowledge can be formulated as a statement about physical objects and activities. Thus, the language of science can be reduced to third person descriptions.

The positivists defined the physical as that which can be described in the concepts of a language with an intersubjective observation basis. This could be called unity of science physicalism. It is the primary meaning of physicalism in the philosophy of science. Another type of physicalism might be called causal physicalism, the view that all causes are physical causes.

There is a lot of confusion in the philosophy of mind literature stemming from a tendency to take physicalism and materialism to be interchangeable.

In my layspeak, materialism is rooted in the belief that the physical world is all that there is. OTOH, physicalism says that all that there is, is in some way (but not necessarily every way) physical.

The physicalist, in my view, does not leap to the conclusion before he has made the observation, i.e. is not philosophically prejudiced. That's why I call Penrose a true scientist.

I see Francis Crick as a materialist. He believes the physical realm is all that there is, e.g. his book The Astonishing Hypothesis says that the soul is physically in the brain.

I see Roger Penrose as a physicalist. He says that some (but not all) of the inquiry into consciousness is beyond science and he does not address unconsciousness.

I also believe Penrose is Platonist, at least concerning such things as the Mandelbrot set. As I recall, this is the ongoing dispute between him and Hawking - as it was between Einstein and Gödel, who I also believe was Platonist.

[Physicist]

The physicalist, in my view, does not leap to the conclusion before he has made the observation, i.e. is not philosophically prejudiced. That's why I call Penrose a true scientist.

"Appropriate physical action of the brain evokes awareness" -- Roger Penrose

He says that some (but not all) of the inquiry into consciousness is beyond science

"My own position is that the questions of the mind, though they lie uncomfortably with present-day scientific understanding, should not be regarded as being forever outside the realm of science." --Roger Penrose

Penrose believes it is beyond our current understanding of science. Few materialists would disagree with that. Penrose does not believe that it will always be so.