Free Republic Poll on Evolution

Free Republic ^ | 22 September 2006 | Vanity

[PatrickHenry]

Free Republic is currently running a poll on this subject:

Do you think creationism or intelligent design should be taught in science classes in secondary public schools as a competing scientific theory to evolution?

You can find the poll at the bottom of your "self search" page, also titled "My Comments," where you go to look for posts you've received.

I don't know what effect -- if any -- the poll will have on the future of this website's science threads. But it's certainly worth while to know the general attitude of the people who frequent this website.

Science isn't a democracy, and the value of scientific theories isn't something that's voted upon. The outcome of this poll won't have any scientific importance. But the poll is important because this is a political website. How we decide to educate our children is a very important issue. It's also important whether the political parties decide to take a position on this. (I don't think they should, but it may be happening anyway.)

If you have an opinion on this subject, go ahead and vote.

[Dimensio]

You don't need to be an evolutionist to grasp the fact that Elaine Morgan is almost certainly right in thinking that humans originally lived in water. That would have to be water without sea monsters in it, and our own oceans have always had sea monsters in them.

I do not believe that I have yet ingested sufficient quantities of ethanol for this statement to appear logical and coherent.

[FreedomProtector]

I will be the first to admit that I am not a very good writer...in fact, I had a strong dislike for English class.

If you are trying to open the escape hatch, "the theory of evolution says nothing about 'life coming from non-life.'", that hatch is not open either for at least two reasons. First, According to Sir Julian Huxley, a primary architect of modern neo-Darwinism stated "It is essential for evolution to become the central core of any educational system, because it is evolution, in the broad sense, that links inorganic nature to life, and the stars with with earth, and matter and mind, and animals to man." Second, it is simply irrelevant to the question. Life had come from somewhere, either life came from non-life or it came from an Intelligent Designer. The question doesn't change even if the definition of evolution does.

Perhaps having to choose to between believing in something that is highly improbable, trying to open escape hatches that won't open, or believing in an Intelligent Designer, i.e. God, is making you a little bit uncomfortable.

If this is the case, I would suggest that reading the gospel of John may be a good place to start. I suspect that someone with your intellectual abilities would also enjoy C.S. Lewis: Mere Christianity as well. God opened the heart of a great scientist named Blaise Pascal. Pascal described it as "tears of joy. tears of joy. tears of joy." I honestly wish you the best even though I have never met you personally, and I pray that God will open up your heart.

[Dimensio]

Please demonstrate that existing diverse life cannot be related through common descent if abiogenesis did not occur.

[Liberal Classic]

There's one other factor involved in the rise of modern humans which nobody has mentioned. You don't need to be an evolutionist to grasp the fact that Elaine Morgan is almost certainly right in thinking that humans originally lived in water. That would have to be water without sea monsters in it, and our own oceans have always had sea monsters in them. I don't really have an answer to that one. As I noted above, if I had to guess, I'd guess that humans were transported here, but a guess is all that would be.

The first time you were banned, was it for posting under the influence?

[Coyoteman]

There's one other factor involved in the rise of modern humans which nobody has mentioned. You don't need to be an evolutionist to grasp the fact that Elaine Morgan is almost certainly right in thinking that humans originally lived in water. That would have to be water without sea monsters in it, and our own oceans have always had sea monsters in them. I don't really have an answer to that one.

Have you ever checked to see the amount of followup that Elaine Morgan's theory has generated? It it a hot area of paleoanthropological research, or is it relegated to the backwaters (if you'll pardon the pun)?

As I noted above, if I had to guess, I'd guess that humans were transported here, but a guess is all that would be.

Any evidence for this at all? It seems pretty lame considering the genetic continuity among primates, as well as the fossil and archaeological records.

[b_sharp]

Rades has a face there?

Why didn't he just get a tattoo like everyone else?

[tomzz]

As I have mentioned, the "genetic continuity" of primates and hominids seems to stop before it gets to humans.

[editor-surveyor]

jerri, you have to understand that andysandmikesmom is a part of that failed system that we are in the process of replacing with one that works. She takes it personal when the failures are pointed out. It's ok though; there are signs that the majority of the medical profession is coming aboard, it just takes time and education.

[b_sharp]

"There's one other factor involved in the rise of modern humans which nobody has mentioned. You don't need to be an evolutionist to grasp the fact that Elaine Morgan is almost certainly right in thinking that humans originally lived in water. That would have to be water without sea monsters in it, and our own oceans have always had sea monsters in them. I don't really have an answer to that one. As I noted above, if I had to guess, I'd guess that humans were transported here, but a guess is all that would be."

Wow. What a post.

You mean Artiodactyls could not have evolved into Cetaceans because of sea monsters? Or were Artiodactyls tough enough to beat up all those sea monsters while humans were not?

Or do you mean that humans couldn't possibly have evolved into 'water humans' in fresh water areas?

Have you considered that perhaps Morgan is wrong?

Jeepers, I guess penguins were tougher than humans too, since they evolved into aquatic animals despite all those sea monsters.

[Liberal Classic]

Again, jerri, please be careful, because there are some folks who have an axe to grind.

The person who posted to you saying that andyandmikesmom is "part of that failed system" is someone who believes Western medicine is unable to cure anything.

There are plenty of Christians on this site who are not anti-medicine and anti-science. Don't get roped in with those few people who believe doctors can't cure disease and surgery is sinful.

[editor-surveyor]

Thank you for your strawman Liberal.

Playing games with other peoples bodies is what is sinful, as well as your favorite sin: bearing false witness. But then that's what you get paid for here, isn't it. It's reassuring to know that FR is an important enough battle ground to lure paid shills.

[Virginia-American]

... As the evolutionist views God's creation through the glasses of materialist presuppositions, the evolutionist runs into intellectual problems to which the evolutionist has no answer. ...

Mighty long on the generalities, mighty short on specific examples. Could you please provide a few? Problems for evolution, not for abiogensis.

[Liberal Classic]

I condemn you with your own words.

If you were any kind of Biblical scholar, you would know that no true Biblical scholar would reccommend that anyone allow themselves to be found on an operating table.

[Virginia-American]

Critique of the Aquatic Ape Theory

[Virginia-American]

But then that's what you get paid for here, isn't it. It's reassuring to know that FR is an important enough battle ground to lure paid shills.

If you can't produce evidence to back this slur up, you should withdraw it.

[editor-surveyor]

Since you reject God's word, it is no surprise that you embrace hopeless vivisection, and reject permanent cures available through proper nutrition, without unnecessary loss of vital organs and limbs.

Really no surprise at all. Is your surname Mengle?

[Liberal Classic]

Since you reject God's word, it is no surprise that you embrace hopeless vivisection, and reject permanent cures available through proper nutrition, without unnecessary loss of vital organs and limbs.

Really no surprise at all. Is your surname Mengle?

Sir, I pray you never need the services of a surgeon, but if you do ever go under the knife I hope you find a qualified doctor.

[Liberal Classic]

I've never understood the "you get paid to post" dig. I was accused of being on the payroll of the Israeli government by anti-semites on Liberty Post. I told them I took pleasure in calling them on their bullshit, and I'd have paid for the privilage.

[Thatcherite]

The thing I was referring to early was not turtle ships or ships at all for that matter, but floating forts which were used in an earlier war, in the first millenium AD. Those were much larger than any known wooden ship with the possible exception of Zheng He's largest ships.

I have never heard of these before you mentioned them and internet research only turns up the Turtle Ships, which I knew about already. As your original recollection was admittedly sparse I assumed wrongly that you'd simply mis-remembered the Turtle Ships.

Having searched again I still cannot find any reference to giant Korean floating forts in the first millenium. I also cannot imagine any conceivable military value for such structures in the pre-gunpowder era. They'd be easy to attack, ultra-vulnerable to fireships, hard to defend, and confer no tactical or strategic advantages on the defender. Perhaps they are apocryphal.

[js1138]

Sir, I pray you never need the services of a surgeon, but if you do ever go under the knife I hope you find a qualified doctor.

Has anyone asked it what it thinks of dentistry?