Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article

To: Modernman
The American manufacturing sector has mostly advanced beyond Nike t-shirts and kid's toys.

B'zzzt. Wrong, do you even know what "advanced" means?

"BUGGY-WHIP" Boogeyman ALERT, ALERT, ALERT!!!!

You have no idea how high a technology is currently involved in textile millinery...and the supporting manufacturing infrastructure.

Instead, American workers are building high-tech, high value-added items such as BMW's, 747's and medical devices.

Let's consider these examples in order:

BMW. Much of the BMW sub-componentry is imported from Germany . The plant in South Carolina is largely an assembly operation. And do you know why BMW built its plant in the U.S.? Because our labor was cheaper than theirs.

747's. 25 years ago we had Lockheed, McDonnell-DOuglas and Boeing all building commercial airliners, and no legitimate foreign source. Today, we have AirBus, where every single plane benefits from a 30% subsidy, with governmental "startup" "loans" that AirBus has never repaid..."loans" which paid for all the industrial plant, the R&D, and product development. All written off. Today, McDonnell-Douglas's commercial planes are gone. Lockheed's are gone. And Boeing, which gets no startup loans, or operating subsidy, the survivor, has been eclipsed in quantitative sales by AirBus two years running...much to the glee of France.

The 747 was built at the end of the 60's and early 70's...out of Boeing's own pocket. A huge roll of the dice with the Shareholder's money. And it was rewarded. But After 9-11 the company has openly discussed termination of any further 747 production, due to the paucity of orders. A plant which could build dozens at once, is reduced to having a handful liesurely go through the lines...and most of them just are just freighters, not passenger.

AirBus has been given over $10 billion in loans by the government consortium for its next big project, the "747-Killer" the A-385 super-jumbo. The 800-capacity jet which they hope (you can just see Chirac drooling) will destroy Boeing's commercial operations altogether. Fortunately, Boeing is not done yet. Although grossly handicapped by our government's free traders willful ignorance, wishful thinking and refusal to punish the market distortions of the foreign interference behind AirBus, they have a business plan which may keep the company alive. They have sacrificed their intellectual seed corn to several other countries...and enlisted their countries protectionist subsidies...for both bankrolling the tooling development of the new 787 "Dreamliner", and assure enough orders for the plane to be viable. They have given Japan the Wing contract for building the new carbon-fiber wingbox (far more advanced than Airbus's A-385...which is 7 tons overweight)..and will teach them all Boeing knows about wings and carbon fiber. Japan will buy a bunch of these planes. Meanwhile, China will make the Tail stabilizers. And Italy will make the center fuselage sections. Boeing will have a greatly reduced role in manufacture: Landing gear, the nose fuselage section, the tail section and integrate the avionics and assemble the snap-together modules.

Oh, how the mighty have fallen! We had during the 80's approximately 800,000 people employed in aerospace. Today, it is less than 125,000. And it promises to shrink further. E.g., GWB is insisting on going along with Clinton's-orchestrated outsourcing of U.S. defense procurement. He recently directed that an inferior (10 year old technology), British-made helicopter (Westland, built with UK Government money) be chosen over the brand-spanking new U.S. competitor (Sikorsky, developed with its own money) be chosen as the replacement for his Marine-One Helicopter fleet. He also will prematurely terminate in 2007 the US-built F-22 (95% US parts), and is instead going ahead with the vastly less-capable flying pig-farm, the F-35 which has in many cases (depending on version), less than 50% U.S. content...this desite the fact that 90+% of the R&D behind the F-35 is supplied by the U.S...not the foreign partners. He threatened to veto Duncan Hunter's (R-Chairman, House Armed Services Committee) Defense Bill mandating 65% domestic content in our defense procurements...until he got his anti-U.S. way.

As for medical devices: Great, if we were turning into the Borg! Consider this: How many of our people actually need to have ear and heart or prosthetic devices? And where is the money coming from for the devices? Insurance and Medicare mostly, is it not? These are not the kinds of things your populace routinely can afford out of their own pockets, or would seek for their regular needs. They are necessarily a narrow niche. And they aren't a normal market where people say, oh, I think I will get a Medtronic or Guidant pacemaker today. And I doubt the growth potential here. Hence, it may well not a sector that will really lift the whole economy. In fact, with Social Security and Medicare going bust...the latter sooner than the other, don't count on their being anything like the current market, let alone a bigger one in the future.

Meanwhile, everyone practically needs transportation, and clothes, and personal electronics (stereo, video, communications, information storage, and computing) however. And it is precisely these wrongly-disparaged "Buggy Whip" industries which we are allowing to be selectively seized by foreigners.

171 posted on 07/27/2005 9:48:12 AM PDT by Paul Ross (George Patton: "I hate to have to fight for the same ground twice.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 102 | View Replies ]


To: Paul Ross
Excellent post.

Today, we have AirBus, where every single plane benefits from a 30% subsidy, with governmental "startup" "loans" that AirBus has never repaid..."loans" which paid for all the industrial plant, the R&D, and product development. All written off. Today, McDonnell-Douglas's commercial planes are gone. Lockheed's are gone. And Boeing, which gets no startup loans, or operating subsidy, the survivor, has been eclipsed in quantitative sales by AirBus two years running...much to the glee of France.

The Airbus/Boeing story has been in the news quite a bit lately, and I'm still not sure what the far-reaching implications of these Airbus subsidies will be. The irony is that when you think about it, the ultimate result of the French subsidy is that airlines all over the world -- and airline travelers by extension -- are enjoying the benefits of reduced capital costs at the expense of the taxpayers of France.

And do you know why BMW built its plant in the U.S.? Because our labor was cheaper than theirs.

Labor costs were certainly a factor, but there is also an underlying reality at work in the auto industry that -- unlike most other manufacturing sectors -- makes it very practical to manufacture automobiles as close to their point of sale as possible.

188 posted on 07/27/2005 10:06:47 AM PDT by Alberta's Child (I ain't got a dime, but what I got is mine. I ain't rich, but Lord I'm free.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

To: Paul Ross
YOU SAID..."He also will prematurely terminate in 2007 the US-built F-22 (95% US parts), and is instead going ahead with the vastly less-capable flying pig-farm, the F-35 which has in many cases (depending on version), less than 50% U.S. content...this desite the fact that 90+% of the R&D behind the F-35 is supplied by the U.S...not the foreign partners. He threatened to veto Duncan Hunter's (R-Chairman, House Armed Services Committee) Defense Bill mandating 65% domestic content in our defense procurements...until he got his anti-U.S. way."

This is a disturbing, developing trend...we see it now with some large British Aerospace firms...and the up and coming player is India.

I believe (with some exceptions of course) government (NASA and DOD) research and development programs are for the most part, the last bastions of high tech science and engineering in this country.

The commercial 'gee wiz' gizmos are being increasingly designed and developed overseas.

I just read in one of my technical mags how the latest generation of Chinese G3 cellular phones BEAT the other competition. They are arriving at our doorstep.

China and India are coming up fast...and Europe remains a good source of basic engineering talent...especially in Russia.

To top it off...most other countries are going out of their way to induce high tech talent to immigrate as CITIZENS...not guest workers.

Over here...we desire as immigrants illiterate people who can work in predominantly 18th century production modes for cheap wages...so as to fuel our new economy of the 21st century.
213 posted on 07/27/2005 11:31:30 AM PDT by Dat Mon
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

To: Paul Ross
GWB is insisting on going along with Clinton's-orchestrated outsourcing of U.S. defense procurement. He recently directed that an inferior (10 year old technology), British-made helicopter (Westland, built with UK Government money) be chosen over the brand-spanking new U.S. competitor (Sikorsky, developed with its own money) be chosen as the replacement for his Marine-One Helicopter fleet. He also will prematurely terminate in 2007 the US-built F-22 (95% US parts), and is instead going ahead with the vastly less-capable flying pig-farm, the F-35 which has in many cases (depending on version), less than 50% U.S. content...this desite the fact that 90+% of the R&D behind the F-35 is supplied by the U.S...not the foreign partners.

You are angering the Bushbots!

355 posted on 07/27/2005 3:51:12 PM PDT by A. Pole (The Law of Comparative Advantage: "Americans should not have children and should not go to college")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

To: Paul Ross; A. Pole; neutronsgalore
Outstanding post, I love how you shoot down the "buggy whip" argument. We did not outsource buggy whips, we started building cars. It seems like a lot of the people here let Rush (talent on loan from Oxycotin) Limbaugh do their thinking for them and just regurgitate what they hear him. Especially the ones who spout off about "I ran a trade deficit with my grocer last year." I certainly hope they exported enough labor to their employer to cover the trade deficit with all the stores they shop at.

I think we should reactivate the Strategic Air Command, and equip it with a bomber force comparable to the Reagan era. That would be 18 Bomb Wings. Clinton slashed our bomber fleet, and Dubya cut it even smaller! Boeing is mulling over a 747 Advanced, that would make an excellent tanker and could even be fitted with hard points for cruise missiles. We could increase our striking power and hit Airbus both.

We could pay for SAC with funds saved by allowing the EU to defend itself, so the American taxpayer no longer has to pick up the tab for France and Germany, and be forced to subsidize Airbus by the back door.
383 posted on 07/27/2005 6:54:45 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

To: Paul Ross

I see that the good news about Boeing's order-book has eluded you.

Have you considered taking a course in "Anger Management"?


392 posted on 07/27/2005 7:47:01 PM PDT by pfony1
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

To: Paul Ross

Top notch post, Paul.


425 posted on 07/28/2005 5:39:15 AM PDT by iconoclast ( "Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson