Posted on 02/25/2004 11:52:26 AM PST by 4CJ
THOMASVILLE -- Nelson Winbush knows his voice isn't likely to be heard above the crowd that writes American history books. That doesn't keep him from speaking his mind, however.
A 75-year-old black man whose grandfather proudly fought in the gray uniform of the South during the Civil War, Winbush addressed a group of about 40 at the Thomas County Museum of History Sunday afternoon. To say the least, his perspective of the war differs greatly from what is taught in America's classrooms today.
"People have manufactured a lot of mistruths about why the war took place," he said. "It wasn't about slavery. It was about state's rights and tariffs."
Many of Winbush's words were reserved for the Confederate battle flag, which still swirls amid controversy more than 150 years after it originally flew.
"This flag has been lied about more than any flag in the world," Winbush said. "People see it and they don't really know what the hell they are looking at."
About midway through his 90-minute presentation, Winbush's comments were issued with extra force.
"This flag is the one that draped my grandfathers' coffin," he said while clutching it strongly in his left hand. "I would shudder to think what would happen if somebody tried to do something to this particular flag."
Winbush, a retired in educator and Korean War veteran who resides in Kissimmee, Fla., said the Confederate battle flag has been hijacked by racist groups, prompting unwarranted criticism from its detractors.
"This flag had nothing to with the (Ku Klux) klan or skinheads," he said while wearing a necktie that featured the Confederate emblem. "They weren't even heard of then. It was just a guide to follow in battle.
"That's all it ever was."
Winbush said Confederate soldiers started using the flag with the St. Andrews cross because its original flag closely resembled the U.S. flag. The first Confederate flag's blue patch in an upper corner and its alternating red and white stripes caused confusion on the battlefield, he said.
"Neither side (of the debate) knows what the flag represents," Winbush said. "It's dumb and dumber. You can turn it around, but it's still two dumb bunches.
"If you learn anything else today, don't be dumb."
Winbush learned about the Civil War at the knee of Louis Napoleon Nelson, who joined his master and one of his master's sons in battle voluntarily when he was 14. Nelson saw combat at Lookout Mountain, Bryson's Crossroads, Shiloh and Vicksburg.
"At Shiloh, my grandfather served as a chaplain even though he couldn't read or write," said Winbush, who bolstered his points with photos, letters and newspapers that used to belong to his grandfather. "I've never heard of a black Yankee holding such an office, so that makes him a little different."
Winbush said his grandfather, who also served as a "scavenger," never had any qualms about fighting for the South. He had plenty of chances to make a break for freedom, but never did. He attended 39 Confederate reunions, the final one in 1934. A Sons of Confederate Veterans Chapter in Tennessee is named after him.
"People ask why a black person would fight for the Confederacy. (It was) for the same damned reason a white Southerner did," Winbush explained.
Winbush said Southern blacks and whites often lived together as extended families., adding slaves and slave owners were outraged when Union forces raided their homes. He said history books rarely make mention of this.
"When the master and his older sons went to war, who did he leave his families with?" asked Winbush, who grandfather remained with his former owners 12 years after the hostilities ended. "It was with the slaves. Were his (family members) mistreated? Hell, no!
"They were protected."
Winbush said more than 90,000 blacks, some of them free, fought for the Confederacy. He has said in the past that he would have fought by his grandfather's side in the 7th Tennessee Cavalry led by Gen. Nathan Bedford Forest.
After his presentation, Winbush opened the floor for questions. Two black women, including Jule Anderson of the Thomas County Historical Society Board of Directors, told him the Confederate battle flag made them uncomfortable.
Winbush, who said he started speaking out about the Civil War in 1992 after growing weary of what he dubbed "political correctness," was also challenged about his opinions.
"I have difficulty in trying to apply today's standards with what happened 150 years ago," he said to Anderson's tearful comments. "...That's what a lot of people are attempting to do. I'm just presenting facts, not as I read from some book where somebody thought that they understood. This came straight from the horse's mouth, and I refute anybody to deny that."
Thomas County Historical Society Board member and SVC member Chip Bragg moved in to close the session after it took a political turn when a white audience member voiced disapproval of the use of Confederate symbols on the state flag. Georgia voters are set to go to the polls a week from today to pick a flag to replace the 1956 version, which featured the St. Andrew's cross prominently.
"Those of us who are serious about our Confederate heritage are very unhappy with the trivialization of Confederate symbols and their misuse," he said. "Part of what we are trying to do is correct this misunderstanding."
#1255 {#3Fan] It's 2004.
For a 2004 subject, I study people who hallucinate about armed viking military ships.
#422 [#3Fan] Military ships that travel close to land need arms. The Vikings had arms,
#423 [#3Fan] All I can do is repeat that military ships that travel close to shore do indeed have arms. Vikings, Vietnam, and the Spaniards all had arms.
One does not arm a military ship with axes and swords for use near shore, idiot. Throwing axes as a naval coastal bombardment technique works only in #3navy.
#422 [#3Fan] Military ships that travel close to land need arms. The Vikings had arms,
#423 [#3Fan] All I can do is repeat that military ships that travel close to shore do indeed have arms. Vikings, Vietnam, and the Spaniards all had arms.
How did your heroic poll watchers determine who was supporting rebellion?
I am not so much surprised that it was said or done, but that such things are openly stated in writing and contained in the official records. No military officer would forward such a thing up the chain of command in writing unless he were absolutely certain such talk was acceptable. The conversation is simply matter of fact. I did not expect to find openly documented considerations of extermination.
New Yorkers were trying to vote in New York. They were Democrats. The Democrats in New York greatly outnumbered the Republicans. The Democrat vote was suppressed.
Only a #3fool would think there was an army of Southerners drawling their way around NYC trying to vote.
Mikey, in this case "Southerner" is euphamism for McClellan voter. Copperhead would have worked as well.
Where?
No one looks worse than you. lol
Lol. The official - ie. LEGAL - documents of secession were the "Ordinances of Secession".
[#3, 1215] Do you deny speaking about Indianans?
Only you could come up with that one.
That's the REPUBLICAN government the Union was fighting for. We condemn countries doing the same.
Watch what you say about "union thugs." They too were our forefathers. Besides, you wouldn't want General Walt to demote you.
Nobody said they were there to shoot anyone voting for McClellan. As a matter of fact, all that was done was to post the words of Spoons on the matter. From them, you apparently drew the same conclusion as McClellan supporters.
ROTF! Where is the General?
It says exactly what I said you said it did. That blacks don't vote Republican because they are lackeys for Indiana racists, you goofy idiot. Watch your words if you don't like your crazy theories rehashed.
You don't consider battle-axes and the like arms?
You don't have a good memory. I said the arms were for the men, in such that other ships that are meant for close-to-shore maneuvering and on-shore fighting will have arms for the ship's men.
You guys are completely clueless. What is it they say about college kids (the ones that study anyway), all knowledge but no sense. You spend so much time trying to find out like what Stevens did in his bedroom that and at what time that you don't employ your brain to consider the "whys" of the big picture.
The same way they would determine a bank robbery, I guess, suspicious-acting people. It looks like they were meant to intimidate the fraudulant voters. As the bible says, law-abiding people have no reason to fear His sanctioned powers that be, but His sanctioned powers that be are a terror to the law-breaking. No one was shot for voting McClellan so your theory is ridiculous, it's clear they were after the arsonists.
That's what Butler said, he was after "southerners". And history shows that terrorists had made threats against the city of New York on election day.
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