So Many Charismatic Casualties (False Prophecies, Promised Healings That Never Came, etc.)

Christian Post ^ | 04/16/2018 | Michael Brown

[grey_whiskers]

You are of course forgetting or leaving out Paul’s admonition to the Corinthians not to speak out in tongues in a public service, unless there was someone to interpret.

[imardmd1]

When that fully-revealed, intelligible, finished Word of God was present in the world and disseminated, the partial versions of it were abandoned because they were not superior to the written Word, which has been translated into many other languages. So far as I know, it has never been translated into one of these babbliferous utterings. I am sure there is no lexicon or Concordance for one. Though back in the day as a graduate student I had access to people from many other countries, no one ever though that my version of a Spirit-language was intelligible. And since it wasn't intelligible to me either, I knew I was able to express my most inner feelings and perceived needs to My Heavenly Father in words that served the purpose. I don't waste precious time with that approach anymore.

So far as miraculosity is concerned, what I have seen is that patience and Providential timing of an ordinary ability outclasses an only superhumanly possible effort at the wrong time and in the wrong way. God has literally saved me even from death by such truly miraculous occurrences. Before I was saved, I did not recognize them. Now I do. But there is one thing no one escapes. I am 81, and my physical body is going to stop operating. It's past time to get used to that point of no return. There is no "spiritual gift" that will supersede it. Period. Everyone needs to confront that, squarely.

[grey_whiskers]

Why are you convinced that a collapse is inevitable here and now? How do you *know* that God is not very, very grieved and angry with the Western church for failing to restrain evil in our society? (If salt loses its taste, it is thrown out and trampled by men..)

[grey_whiskers]

The only connection to Montana I can see on this thread, is different groups telling each other that they are going to Helena handbasket.

[grey_whiskers]

The Holy Spirit glorifies *Jesus*.
Jesus leads us to the Father.

[imardmd1]

The word "prophecy" or "prophesize" can also mean to teach, refute, reprove, admonish, comfort others.

This is intuitively rendered advice or predictions from urging presumed to be of the Spirit, but apart from any firm incontestible Scriptural grounding. It might have been OK in Paul's time, but not now. True current prophecy is from a person spiritually mature in the clear knowledge of the Will of God, Scripturally defensible, now that we have the completed text that covers every human need. There is no extra knowledge that does not conform to it. If there is, let's have a bit of it to prove this stance is wrong. And not hearsay, either.

[imardmd1]

My preference is the KJV, where the translators selected readiness of mind, or mentally prepared, a bit less gullible than eagerness would permit; and searched, or combed the applicable Scriptures, a bit more forensic in attitude that merely examining the references would imply.

They were more noble in two aspects:

(1) They were already good Bible students, whose minds were prepared to verify Paul's doctrines using their current accepted Scripture basis as the litmus test, and
(2) They were open-minded, willing to see if it be so.

The Thessalonikans, like the Pharisees, were closed-minded, and rather mean-spirited, too, willing to persecute Paul's offences to their prejudices.

[Elsie]

Do all speak in languages they had not known before?

Some Pentecostals/Charismatics have asserted that unless one speaks in tongues, he/she ISN'T baptized by the Holy Spirit. Do you believe that, too?

Well; the Book sure does NOT say that!

---

We know from Scripture that NO ONE receives every gift:

Likewise...

We know from Scripture that EVERYONE does NOT receive ONE gift:

[EliRoom8]

BRAVO!!! and Amen!!!

[imardmd1]

So what does your agape smell like? (Rhetorical question, I think I know already.)

[Elsie]

Whereas most Pentecostals and evangelicals believe that only faith in Jesus Christ is the essential element for salvation,

Oneness Pentecostalism defines salvation as repentance, full-submersion water baptism (in the name of Jesus Christ) and baptism in the Holy Spirit, with the evidence of speaking in other tongues.^[3]

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oneness_Pentecostalism

 

 

They're a bit shifty on the Trinity as well.

[Elsie]

I have had 2 or 3 tell me, one cannot even be saved, unless one speaks in tongues.

Golly!

I didn't know that MUTES were forever doomed to the PIT!

[Elsie]

I have had 2 or 3 tell me, one cannot even be saved, unless one speaks in tongues.

Nothing new under the sun:

Acts 15:1-5

 ¹ Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: "Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved." ² This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. ³ The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. ⁴ When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.

 ⁵ Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses."

[Elsie]

Presenting oneself as a Christian when you are not.

But many are deluded into thinking they ARE actually 'Christians'!!

(And then when you hear how their 'Christ' is described...)

[Elsie]

(But then, that's the whole problem of the Book of Mormon! It sounds so Bible-ish.)

It ought to; considering how much of is actually FROM the KJV bible; errors and all!

[imardmd1]

I guess you’ve missed the point of both Paul’s epistle and my post that referred to it. Interpreting is not prophesyining, which is the issue my reply addressed. What’s your problem? Bad hair day?

[Mark17]

Nothing new under the sun:

Yep. If it wasn’t about speaking in tongues, it would be about something else.

[Elsie]

(But then, that's the whole problem of the Book of Mormon! It sounds so Bible-ish.)

Not to worry; for GOD himself told Joseph Smith to CORRECT the bible; thus; the Inspired Version of Mormonism.

---

No Mormons seem to CARE that Salt Lake City does NOT use the corrected text from JS; but instead still uses the KJV...

---

8. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.

 

Articles of Faith

Mormon creed

[Elsie]

What’s Montanism?

I'll bet it is different from Wyomianism!

---

 

Cowboy Poetry

by Bill Jones

 

 

 

Jake, the rancher, went one day
to fix a distant fence.
The wind was cold and gusty
and the clouds rolled gray and dense.

As he pounded the last staples in
and gathered tools to go,
The temperature had fallen,
the wind and snow began to blow.

When he finally reached his pickup,
he felt a heavy heart.
From the sound of that ignition,
he knew it wouldn't start.

So Jake did what most of us
would do if we had been there.
He humbly bowed his balding head
and sent aloft a prayer.

As he turned the key for the last time,
he softly cursed his luck.
They found him three days later,
frozen stiff in that old truck.

Now Jake had been around in life
and done his share of roaming.
But when he saw Heaven, he was shocked --
it looked just like Wyoming!

Of all the saints in Heaven,
his favorite was St. Peter.
(Now, this here line ain't needed
but it helps with rhyme and meter)

So they set and talked a minute or two,
or maybe it was three.
Nobody was keeping' score --
in Heaven time is free.

"I've always heard," Jake said to Pete,
"that God will answer prayer,
But one time I asked for help,
well, he just plain wasn't there."

"Does God answer prayers of some,
and ignore the prayers of others?
That don't seem exactly square --
I know all men are brothers."

"Or does he randomly reply,
without good rhyme or reason?
Maybe, it's the time of day,
the weather or the season."

"Now I ain't trying to act smart,
it's just the way I feel.
And I was wondering', could you tell me --
what the heck's the deal?!"

Peter listened very patiently
and when Jake was done,
There were smiles of recognition,
and he said, "So, you're the one!!"

"That day, your truck, it wouldn't start,
and you sent your prayer a flying,
You gave us all a real bad time,
with hundreds of us trying."

"A thousand angels rushed,
to check the status of your file,
But you know, Jake, we hadn't heard
from you in quite a long, long while."

"And though all prayers are answered,
and God ain't got no quota,
He didn't recognize your voice,
and started a truck in Minnesota."

[Elsie]

Stick with me and I’ll explain...