Posted on 06/25/2015 7:00:52 PM PDT by Morgana
Concur
Yes, JESUS had authority.
So?
God's word is truth.
Where the Catholic church lines up with that, it's fine.
Where it departs, it's wrong.
And besides, what truth? That you can't be sure where you're going when you die until you get there? THAT'S the kind of "salvation" Jesus died for?
Maybe your Jesus, but not the one of Scripture.
Show us where Christ specifically says He was founding the CATHOLIC church.
I can’t seem to find the word *Catholic* anywhere in the Bible.
“Every church is a construct of man”.
I would expound upon this, every man made religion is a counterfeit, and inspired not by God or the Holy Spirit. Maybe as Freud might have put it, they attempt to satisfy a basic human need, but they always fall short.
True religion is founded by God. Whether it is the covenants He made with Adam, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Moses, David, or their fulfillment in the revelation of the Incarnate Word, only those covenants have validity.
The Catholic Church is the mystical body of Christ, the chosen instrument, chosen by Jesus Christ, through which He shares with all generations the Good News of His salvation and the overflowing fountain of Grace he won for our redemption on the cross.
That there are divisions, scandals, and rifts that do not heal are a sad reminder of how poorly we cooperate with the graces available to us. But even so, we pray as the publican prayed, not as the Pharisee. We rally to the Barque of Peter as the storms rage, and we find consolation in the Sacraments because Christ is there, just like He said He would be.
Which is the bigger miracle; that the Catholic Church is founded by Christ on the Apostles and guided by the Holy Spirit, or it has survived two thousand years allegedly as a total fraud?
What crapola. The True Church is the conglomeration of those who claim and preach Christ as their Savior. Catholicism happens to be one of the institutions that contains such folks. Is your Jesus also better than everyone else’s Jesus?
Survival of the church in spite of man’s inclinations...
Just like america is great as americans are good, not necessarily their leaders
“The Catholic Church gave Christians the Bible”
Really? Nothing here about the Jews writing the Old Testament??
Nothing here about Nicea and the New Testament?
“The Catholic denomination, is one that almost always votes pro-abortion democrat.”
I noticed that, too.
It’s one of their robotic, low information, memorized talking points. The Catholic church likes to keep them dumbed down. If you notice, the same exact, word for word line is posted at least once a day.
With all due respect to Morgana, points 2-5 of the OP have been discussed/debated/argued vehemently ad naueum on here for literally years I see no profit in continuing so (at least not with the same people). However the first point raised in what she posted is something continuously missed by every non Catholic here, including you caww now.
With due respect you are missing the point of point #1. It’s simply: what does Matt 18:15-18 mean in a non Catholic Christian community, practically speaking? It seems to me if Joe Schmo is kicked out of the First Independent Presbyterian Church on Main Street for whatever reason he can just go to the First Baptist Church on Elm Street in Anytown USA. In other words, “let him be anathema” has no meaning practically speaking in the non Catholic communities.
Am I wrong (is the OP wrong)? Someone, anyone, tell me what it means when someone is kicked out of a local congregation? Who’s to prevent that person from going to another congregation, joining that one and just pretending like there’s nothing wrong? Really the question is, how does that person kicked out KNOW they are out of the church as a body, when all they have to do is go down the street and join another congregation?
It seems to me if there is no heirarchy in the church to make such decisions then there’s no way to tell such a person that they are not only not welcome in that congregation but also not welcome in any congregation in other words they are out, and better repent of their sins. Otherwise the passage in Mat 18 has no meaning. It is a useless passage that wouldn’t serve anyone.
” Is your Jesus also better than everyone else’s Jesus?”
Funny you should mention that. There was a post not long ago about the Catholic Jesus not being everyone else’s Jesus.
I look at verse 20 of Matthew 18 and think to myself of all the times I’ve gathered together in His name with family and friends who are not Catholic. I truly believe He is in our midst during those moments.
What do they all have in common? Some facts mixed in with some faulty human reasoning. What did John the Baptist say under influence from the Holy Spirit? "For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones". The RCC is nothing more than a denomination and it always will be no matter how much word twisting is done. No matter how many articles trumpeting the RCC over and over are posted.
**or it has survived two thousand years allegedly as a total fraud?**
The devil has survived as total liar for a LOT longer. Just sayin.
Really Morgana
We’re dying out here in the culture war between the war on white privilege and homosexual “ marriage” and you have to stir this nonsense of Catholic chauvinism dear?
Christians of all stripes better stick together or you know what the founders said will happen to all of us each separately
“The states where the Catholic denomination is the strongest tend to be the most liberal.”
Really? Do you realize that Catholics make up 39% of the Christian population in New York and about 40% of the Christian population in Texas? The percentages are about the same. I’m not so sure you have a point that is valid.
“Well just because you think and say it doesn’t make it so Val”
Who is Val?
Protestants see the same thing and follow the same rule.
2.) History- The Roman Catholic Church is the oldest and original Christian Church, therefore, the beliefs and teachings of the Church were directly passed onto the leaders of the Catholic Church by the apostles.
Baloney. Prove it. You can't.
The Catholic Church remained the only Christian Church until the East-West Schism of 1054, which caused medieval Christianity to split and become two separate branches.
Again, baloney. You cannot prove your words.
3.) The Catholic Church gave Christians the Bible
Baloney sommore, as has been proven hereon innumerable times.
4.) The Sacraments are Biblical
They cannot be, or Yeshua is not Messiah.
5.) Sola Scriptura is not supported in the Bible- It is difficult to make a claim such as Sola Scriptura (The Bible Alone) when, in its very essence, the claim must be written within the Bible in order to be Biblical.
Nonsense. The Bible is a series of contracts and their supporting documents. There are no change orders. As such, in every court of man, the written contract is all there is. Thus, by it's very nature, the Bible requires sola-scriptura.
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