They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy

The Daily Signal ^ | September 29, 2014 | Kelsey Harkness

[Timber Rattler]

A bakery owner in Oregon broke down in tears while discussing the fallout of her and her husband’s decision not to bake a wedding cake for a same-sex couple on the basis of their Christian beliefs.

Earlier this year, the Oregon Bureau of Labor and Industries found “substantial evidence” that Aaron and Melissa Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, discriminated against the lesbian couple.

Oregon bakery owners face a $150,000 discrimination fine for not baking a wedding cake for lesbians.

They now face a fine in excess of $150,000.

(snip)

The ordeal started in February 2013, when Rachel Cryer and Laurel Bowman asked the bakery owners to design a wedding cake for their same-sex commitment ceremony.

At the time, Oregon defined marriage as the union between one man and one woman; voters overwhelmingly approved the constitutional amendment in 2004.

Aaron told The Daily Signal he thought he was “well within” his legal rights to decline the service, citing his traditional beliefs that a marriage is between a man and a woman.

In January 2014, the Kleins were charged with violating Oregon’s Equality Act of 2007, a law that protects the rights of the LGBT community.

[mac_truck]

Oregon does not have the ability to place liens on real property in another state and a negative credit rating is a small matter, especially when compared to filing bankruptcy.

This couple could move out of Oregon tomorrow and there is very little the state could do about collecting their ‘fine’.

[Claud]

Brilliant post.

[trubolotta]

Don’t you see where your position imparts a responsibility to ask? Of course we would not give someone aid to commit a crime if that was there announced purpose, but this situation is about civil law, a distinction we must make.

They broke an unjust law and they knew it. On the other hand, they could have found some other way. I can think of dozens of ways I could have sent those two dykes packing without any satisfaction and know I had not contributed to their willful sinfulness AND without breaking the law.

We can stand on principle, we just don’t have to be so vocal about it when we know we are being baited.

[trubolotta]

Just one other point: we need to understand the difference between sinners and evil people. Sinners still have some shame and guilt about their actions. Evil people have no shame, are proud of their sin and want to force others to accept what they do as sinless.

How we deal with each is important. The bitches ordering that cake were evil.

[fwdude]

The fine sounds outrageously excessive, like a life sentence for shoplifting. I wonder who assessed this penalty, and if it is similar to penalties for discrimination based on religion.

Somehow, I doubt it.

[Agamemnon]

In any big city there are dozens, if not scores, of liberal synagogues and protestant churches who will happily marry a gay couple, calling it Holy Matrimony....

"Holy Matrimony" is an institution defined by God and the Holy Scriptures, not civil government. Civil authorities are beyond their authority to define a term reserved for practices of the church, and are not in a place to exact a civil penalty in realm over which they have no authority.

To be enforced in law "Holy Matrimony" will have to be defined in law. Problem for civil government is -- it can't be. No secular government has a place at present to define what a church must put in its bylaws.

If apostate clergyman try to call homofaggot "marriage" "Holy Matrimony," they'll have to justify it by Scripture. But they can't. They therefore would have no religious basis to defend their apostate position and by extension they would have no possible protection for their definition in civil law.

No civil authority has any standing to define what is "Holy."

FReegards!

[miss marmelstein]

As someone who reads the gay press & gay blogs, I can tell you that gays are VERY worried about what goes into their “wedding” cakes. Not a single comment goes by after an article about bakeries that some paranoid gay guy doesn’t chime in that gays better seek out other gays to make their cakes. It’s pretty obvious that they are trolling when they bother bakers with religious backgrounds - not actually seeking the cake. But I have nothing but sympathy for this religious couple who lost their business.

[Timber Rattler]

Oregon does not have the ability to place liens on real property in another state and a negative credit rating is a small matter, especially when compared to filing bankruptcy.

Good luck buying a house or getting a business loan then.

[C. Edmund Wright]

it’s not kissing evil’s butt....it’s taking their money, or actually, calling their bluff.

You’re not smart enough to even figure out that calling the bluff part.

[Delta Dawn]

If you need to find a salmon run, nothing beats Alaska...

[Claud]

Don’t you see where your position imparts a responsibility to ask?

Actually I don't. At least in a saner day and age where such things weren't even feasible.

And sure, if someone can find a way to bow out gracefully, that's fine. Agreed about that. I just don't like this "just bake the cake" non-answer.

[Claud]

I agree with that 100%. There’s a special place in Hell for those two if they don’t knock it off.

[caww]

..” clearly the bakery should have just baked the cake. Its a cake, not vows. This was not a wise hill to die on”....

Well they could have well handled this entire thing much better then they did.

I think when it’s been written...”Count the costs”.....that includes the battles we fight and how we fight them. It is not enough to just object. ..and they could have dodged that entire issue another way....sometimes it’s better to duck and run.

There were other options.

[caww]

Corey Boon ‘lied’ to the gestapo that there were no Jews in her home....in doing so she was protecting life though we are told not to lie.

Our walk is one of faith....I believe this couple could have handled this differently then they did. There were other options than denying them....after all the two dykes weren’t requiring the bakery owners to sit down and “eat” their cake at their banquet table.

I have customers in my work who come in and obviously everything from homosexuals to people high....yet you take care of them as any other customer, though admittedly I tend to get done with business as fast as possible.

If I ‘owned a business’ it would be likewise...

[caww]

I think you’re right...there are people itching to make issues and go looking for them...Christians need to be wise about identifying this and also how they will handle.

Why would homosexuals go to a Christian business if they weren’t looking for trouble? It was no secret this was a Christian Business.

[trubolotta]

One thing we as conservatives and Christians need to do is confront evil directly, but humorously. When the opportunity comes, we need to embrace it even though it is possible we may lose. I'm not baker or even a shopkeeper but I think my conversation would have gone something like this:

I see, you want a gay wedding cake. I have never made one of those so you are going to have to help me out.

I don't care what they say at this point, they are mine for however long it takes. I would go about taking their order just as I would for anyone else but with some "special" attention.

Oh, it's just like a normal cake. Why didn't you say so in the first place.

I expect trouble over the word "normal" and plan to just play dumb and let them beat their brains out.

What? Two brides on top? I can't split those sets up. I always order them as a pair. You'll have to buy two sets but you can do anything you want with the grooms after we deliver the cake. Hmm, now what should I charge for that extra set?

If another customer comes in, take care of them. If the dykes complain, tell them that customers with orders get priority over customers still shopping. Take good care of your other customer no matter how long it takes.

We need to talk about a deposit since a gay wedding cake doesn't have the same market as a "normal" cake. If you cancel or fail to pay on delivery, I'm stuck with a gay cake.

Discuss delivery. Drag it out. Check your schedule. Improvise. Have some fun with it. Do it right and they won't order a cake from you. Just don't do anything that would put you in a spot where they can prove you treated them differently. You may have to bake them a cake, but I understand gay cake deliveries don't always go smoothly. I have no idea why.

[IrishBrigade]

THEY WANTED A CHRISTIAN BAKER TO TELL THEM NO SO THEY COULD HARASS AND EMBARRASS THEM

...did the bakers have a reasonable expectation that the lesbians wanted that...? Or did they expect that they would be dealt with as reasonable people normally deal with others...?

...you’re arguing that the bakers should have foreseen that a customer intended deceit and treachery...

[C. Edmund Wright]

I think you’re right...there are people itching to make issues and go looking for them...Christians need to be wise about identifying this and also how they will handle.

BINGO, and in this case, there was absolutely NOTHING redemptive about how they reacted - and it was incredibly costly. Their stand did no good whatsoever.

Why would homosexuals go to a Christian business if they weren’t looking for trouble? It was no secret this was a Christian Business.

EXACTLY. I can't believe so many Freepers fell for this. The lesbians didn't want a Christian to bake them a cake, they wanted a Christian to refuse to bake them a cake....so the bakers gave these lesbians exactly what they wanted. Maybe you can tell me why so many on this forum can't understand this obvious fact.

[C. Edmund Wright]

..you’re arguing that the bakers should have foreseen that a customer intended deceit and treachery...

Yes, I am - and shame on you for not seeing through it. I mean, this scam has been done what, 15 times in the past couple years? At some point, it is incumbent on us to know the times we are in. Like, NOW.

[liberalism is suicide]

How would that help them? The sodomite revolution is taking over the country. They would be safer moving to the moon.