Tougher standards may worsen science-teacher shortage

You guys still have some really screwy gun laws. I can carry in any city in my state.

So can I. I'm in PA. I have a friend in NY State, and he got his CCW with no problem. The further you get from NYC, the less crazy it gets (He's near Buffalo).

I am a semi-retired engineer. I have an undergraduate and masters degree. I am technically very well qualified to teach high school science or mathematics. I took the same freshman and sophomore chemistry, physics, and math that the guys in those majors took. There are a lot of people like me. It should be a Summer’s worth of classes getting people like me ready for the classroom.

I just took a look at my local community college's web page for job openings. They have lots of openings for part-time instructors in various subjects. The jobs do not require an "ed" degree, just a masters or above in the subject, plus some teaching experience. Check out your local CCs.

Yep! Blame the parents and kids. ( yawn) From a government teacher? Typical!

So?....What godless entity taught the parents to think and reason godlessly?.

Answer: The godless government schools, of course!

And you are complaining? What would any rational person expect? Our Founding Father would immediately see the source of the problem. Godless education in socialist-entitlement schools yields a population of godless barbarians and feral children.

There are excellent government teachers out there. They are the teachers who are taking every possible opportunity to warn parent to remove their children from the godless socialist-entitlement indoctrination pits, and to work to shut them all down...permanently!

Uh, the teachers in the city schools I taught at were generally very good and some even excellent.
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Good and excellent teachers would never force children to think and reason godlessly, and all children who attend any government school must. They must just to cooperate in the godless classroom. How could it be otherwise?

Good and excellent teachers would never support such a godless and socialist-entitlement system that forces taxpayers ( under the threat of armed police and court action ) to pay for such an abomination.

No good and excellent teacher would ever seek a job in such a system or work to support and establish its policies. Good and excellent teachers are working to tear down this monstrosity and permanently close the doors.

What ruined the kids was the government stupidity that helped ruin the kids’ parents with their ignorant welfare system.

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Government schooling is WELFARE! It is a single payer, **compulsory**, socialist-entitlement!!!

Any child who attends one of the government's socialist-entitlement K-12 schools risks learning that any voting mob powerful enough to give them tuition-free schooling is powerful enough to give them **LOTS*** of “free” stuff!

Geeze!....And, you wonder why their parents are comfortable taking welfare? Really? Why shouldn't they be? They spent 13 or more years learning to be comfortable accepting socialism in government socialist-entitlement schools!

Is a “duh” needed here?

Excellent comments. Just knowing science doesn’t make you a good science teacher.

And in today’s school systems, quite often the teacher spends a lot of time trying to maintain order in the class. I know three young people who started out in teaching, but quit because of the discouraging, stressful, chaotic environment. At least one of them was a science teacher.

"Years ago I was working full time and wanted to get into teaching. I whined to a friend of mine, who also has a Ph.D. that I couldn't find a way. he looked at me and said something I will never forget "If you want it bad enough, you will find a way." He was right, I found a way."

So, let me ask....at that time were you about to retire??

"...apparently you don't want it bad enough, or you don't care enough, because if you really wanted to teach, like me, you would find a way.

No, I probably don't. But you miss the point....the system needs to be changed to actually ENCOURAGE people with high technical skills into the system, instead of setting up roadblocks. You're right.....people who are retiring won't put up with the bullshit. But they shouldn't have to.

"Instead of complaining that the requirements are ludicrous you would just do it. You found a way to get your Ph.D. Now I challenge you, find a way.

Don't bother. Teaching is something I "might" enjoy, and I a more than well qualified to do so, and the students would likely benefit from my experience, but fighting the "ed biz bureaucrats" isn't worth it at my age. But again....THAT'S THE POINT.

"Government schools are ludicrous because they are godless socialist-entitlements. One of the predictable outcomes of socialism is ludicrous policies and practices."

I can't agree.

Once upon a time, public education worked VERY well in this country, so it is not possible to legitimately broadly castigate "government schools" as the source of the problem.

IMO, it has way more to do with which level of government is in charge. When the local community built the schools, hired the teachers, and paid their salaries, the system worked. But as higher and higher levels of government got involved and usurped control, things got progressively worse.

THE highest level that should control the schools is county, or maybe the local PTA for a specific school. Or perhaps a "school district" between those two levels.

Give'em the power to hire and fire teachers and staff, and I'd bet things would change for the better in a hurry.

At first Obamacare won't be that bad. The reason will be due to the values of the workers trained in the old system. It will take full generation or two for the true horror of socialized medicine to manifest itself. They we will hear comments like your, only slightly modified. They will say:

“Once upon a time, socialized medicine worked VERY well in this country, so it is not possible to legitimately broadly castigate “government medicine” as the source of the problem.”

Fundamentally our government owned and run schools are a single-payer, compulsory funded, compulsory use, socialist-entitlement! If they **seemed** to function somewhat well in the past it was due to the values of the teachers and principals in the system. For example, my father was born in 1913. He grew up with his parents in his grandparents home. His grandfather served in the Civil War. Up until the 1960 and early 70s when this generation of teachers still had close contact with the values of those Americans who literally built the American Industrial Revolution and broke the sod of this land.

Just as government owned and run socialist-entitlement K-12 schooling is a mess due to its foundation of socialism, so we will eventually see the same in socialized medicine.

I will address “local (socialist) control” in another post.

Translation: One voting mob of bullies replaces the old group of voting mob bullies and shoves their equally non-neutral political, cultural, and religious worldview down the throats of other people's children and forces the taxpayer to pay for this abomination.

Sorry....I will continue to urge parents to remove their children from the government's godless and socialist-entitlment K-12 indoctrination centers, work to put as many teachers out of job and into the private market as possible, and permanently close down these prison-like, First Amendment ,and freedom of conscience cesspools of ignorance ( misnamed “schools”). I will continue to sit on my over educated butt and whine hoping that someone else will actually do something while I refuse to disavow the violent rhetoric of others and actually incite this rhetoric.

There fixed it for you

One of the predictable outcomes ~~of socialism~~ lazy parents that refuse to get involved in the education of their children until after they have been charged with assault, is ludicrous policies and practices.

There fixed it for you.

Thank you for you kind an rational approach. Wintertime has had a very negative experience with public schools and now wants everyone to hate them, in spite of the fact that he/she used them when it was convenient.

If you would like more information about wintertime send me a private message and I will be glad to fill you in.

So, let me ask....at that time were you about to retire??

I wasn't ready to retire, I was working at a medium sized machine shop doing engineering work. I got tired of clocking in at 7 am having the first argument begin at 7:10 and continuing until 2 hours after I was supposed to clock out.

I had been teaching Martial arts and coaching a local archery team. a number of people told me I had good teaching ability so I looked into it. I needed 5 courses beyond my Dual major Bachelors + student teaching. I took these at the Masters level 3 nights a week and was done in a little over a year with a 3.98 GPA.

But you miss the point....the system needs to be changed to actually ENCOURAGE people with high technical skills into the system, instead of setting up roadblocks. You're right.....people who are retiring won't put up with the bullshit. But they shouldn't have to.

So get involved and change it. I am certain that you are familiar with Edmund Burke: All that is necessary for evil to exist in the world is for good men (and women) to do nothing. This is why I get all over wintertime, he/ she just sits around and whines and whines, and did I mention whines?

Don't bother. Teaching is something I "might" enjoy, and I a more than well qualified to do so, and the students would likely benefit from my experience, but fighting the "ed biz bureaucrats" isn't worth it at my age. But again....THAT'S THE POINT.

Then look into teaching at the Community college level. I do it one semester a year, but I have to warn you, some of the adults are much worse than the kids. I had one student last year that would show up just as I finished giving the lesson/ demonstration for the day and expect a private lesson. After the third time in a row i told him that if he couldn't show up on time I couldn't give him private lessons. He told me he was going to the dean, I told him that was great idea and make sure he spelled my name right.

Again, government socialist-entitlement schooling is godless socialism.

Socialism can't be fixed.

And...Since it is impossible to have a religiously, politically, or culturally neutral school regardless of which faction of political bullies is running the socialist schools these schools will always be a First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination for the students forced to use them and the taxpayer forced to support the government socialist school's NON-neutral religious worldview.

If it is an abomination for leftists to force their godless worldview on the nation's children, it is equally offensive for conservatives to **force** ( using the threat of armed police action) on other people's children.

Solution: Begin the process of privatization.

There is only one solution: Begin the process of privatizing all K-12 education. Anything other than this hurts the children and our nation.

All of the above is a statement of fact. It is impossible for you to read the state of my heart with regard to hate or love. Hopefully, in your classroom, you refrain from armchair speculative psychology.

Again, government socialist-entitlement schooling is godless socialism.

Socialism can't be fixed.

And...Since it is impossible to have a religiously, politically, or culturally neutral school regardless of which faction of political bullies is running the socialist schools these schools will always be a First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination for the students forced to use them and the taxpayer forced to support the government socialist school's NON-neutral religious worldview.

If it is an abomination for leftists to force their godless worldview on the nation's children, it is equally offensive for conservatives to **force** ( using the threat of armed police action) on other people's children.

Solution: Begin the process of privatization.

There is only one solution: Begin the process of privatizing all K-12 education. Anything other than this hurts the children and our nation.

All of the above is a statement of fact. It is impossible for you to read the state of my heart with regard to hate or love. Hopefully, in your classroom, you refrain from armchair speculative psychology.

Again, government socialist-entitlement schooling is godless socialism. Socialism can't be fixed. And...Since it is impossible to have a religiously, politically, or culturally neutral school regardless of which faction of political bullies is running the socialist schools these schools will always be a First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination for the students forced to use them and the taxpayer forced to support the government socialist school's NON-neutral religious worldview. If it is an abomination for leftists to force their godless worldview on the nation's children, it is equally offensive for conservatives to **force** ( using the threat of armed police action) on other people's children. Solution: Begin the process of privatization. There is only one solution: Begin the process of privatizing all K-12 education. Anything other than this hurts the children and our nation. All of the above is a statement of fact. It is impossible for you to read the state of my heart with regard to hate or love. Hopefully, in your classroom, you refrain from armchair speculative psychology. I am to lazy to do anything except shine.

Fixed it for you.

I am eternally grateful that our founding fathers did not have your can't do attitude, What if they had sat around saying: "It can't be fixed", What if my grandparents had never left Europe, choosing to suffer under Mussolini, Stalin and Hitler?

One thing you are right about is YOU can't fix it, because you and those like you refuse to. Now you have either shut up or start giving a hand, because your incessant whining is not going to be tolerated by good God fearing Christians.

Again, government socialist-entitlement schooling is godless socialism. Socialism can't be fixed. And...Since it is impossible to have a religiously, politically, or culturally neutral school regardless of which faction of political bullies is running the socialist schools these schools will always be a First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination for the students forced to use them and the taxpayer forced to support the government socialist school's NON-neutral religious worldview. If it is an abomination for leftists to force their godless worldview on the nation's children, it is equally offensive for conservatives to **force** ( using the threat of armed police action) on other people's children. Solution: Begin the process of privatization. There is only one solution: Begin the process of privatizing all K-12 education. Anything other than this hurts the children and our nation. All of the above is a statement of fact. It is impossible for you to read the state of my heart with regard to hate or love. Hopefully, in your classroom, you refrain from armchair speculative psychology. I am to lazy to do anything except whine.

Edited to correct shine to whine Fixed it for you.

I am eternally grateful that our founding fathers did not have your can't do attitude, What if they had sat around saying: "It can't be fixed", What if my grandparents had never left Europe, choosing to suffer under Mussolini, Stalin and Hitler?

One thing you are right about is YOU can't fix it, because you and those like you refuse to. Now you have either shut up or start giving a hand, because your incessant whining is not going to be tolerated by good God fearing Christians.

"At first Obamacare won't be that bad. The reason will be due to the values of the workers trained in the old system. It will take full generation or two for the true horror of socialized medicine to manifest itself. They we will hear comments like your, only slightly modified. They will say:"

“Once upon a time, socialized medicine worked VERY well in this country, so it is not possible to legitimately broadly castigate “government medicine” as the source of the problem.”

Horse manure/strawman argument. But typical of the "no-government-at-all" school of libertariainism.

"So get involved and change it. I am certain that you are familiar with Edmund Burke: All that is necessary for evil to exist in the world is for good men (and women) to do nothing. This is why I get all over wintertime, he/ she just sits around and whines and whines, and did I mention whines?

Actually, my game plan is to physically relocate to one of those more enlightened states that "do" have a correct orientation/accreditation plan in place. I suspect more often than not, those are also "more conservative" states, given that they are successfully "bucking" the "ed machine".

I don't really have any interest in teaching at a CC. Middle school/high school is more of interest.

My mom, for a number of years, taught at a private nursery school. Obviously for that age group, it wasn’t too heavy on academics, but she loved children, she loved doing it, and she was good at it.

That all ended when the state came along and told her she would have to take a bunch of “education” courses or she couldn’t continue.

She quit.