Posted on 06/13/2012 6:05:21 PM PDT by Grig
This may be the post that gets me zotted, and if so, so be it, but it would be a nice sign of respect for free speech, and just plain old maturity if that doesn’t happen. I won’t lose sleep either way though.
All through the Clinton years FR played a key role in helping me really come to appreciate the wisdom of the founding fathers as Clinton violated their principles in so many ways. I found here a large community of wise, informed posters from a diverse background that added depth and clarity to the news of the day. It was here on FR that I found out about the WTC attack. Being Canadian, the second amendment always seemed kind of silly to me, but through FR I learned how wrong that view was and now wish my country had such a right for it’s citizens.
That was then, now more and more it has felt like FR has dwindled into an insular, nearly feral, group of political and religious thought police whose mission is to ferret out anybody who doesn’t fit their orthodoxy and get rid of them, while propagandizing against anything the disagree with. At times it feels more energy is spent attacking those who should be seen as allies rather than the true enemies. I used to spend a fair bit of time here each day, now perhaps a quick look once every few weeks because of this change in climate. I know many have left because of it, many have already posted their concerns about it, and their wise observations and suggestions have fallen on deaf ears.
I do feel I have a small measure of responsibility for the change (but no guilt). When FR started to fail to live up to it’s own rules about not bashing religions (when it came to my religion) we Mormon posters decided that instead of being party to the creation of long threads filled with contention that made it hard for the moderators see the difference in our behavior and theirs, we decided instead to simply post articles putting forward our position and leave the critics to show their true colors. (see http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2013341/posts). Not only did the anti-Mormon posters oblige us and demonstrate the level of hate and bigotry in their hearts, but so did the anti-Momons within the leadership of FR. And thus began the decent of FR from a vibrant ad-hoc conservative think tank into an echo chamber of yes men with a loud group of religious bigots leading the way. It is sad to see it come to this, and I hope that the day comes when sanity returns. Something that needs to happen for that day to come is for the majority of people around here to face this reality: If you are not supporting Mitt Romney, you are playing into Obama’s hands. Any hopes of a brokered convention or third party conservative super-candidate are nothing but delusions fueled by a denial of reality. It comes down to either Mitt or Obama, and if you are not supporting Mitt you are helping Obama. Deal with it.
And don’t try to hide behind the idea that Mitt losing will be good in the long term for conservatism. That is putting your partisanship above your patriotism. Obama has done massive damage to the USA, and if you give him another 4 years you may not have a USA left at the end of his term. What good will this theoretical transformation of the GOP then? Truth is that if Mitt loses, no matter how conservative or liberal his campaign and policies are, the media will blame it on him being too right-wing and drive the GOP to the left as much as they can. Also, the good of the country should come first if you want to call yourself a patriot, and having Mitt in the White House will be much better for the USA than having Obama there.
While Mitt is not perfect (nobody is) I find many of the attacks on him so over the top, so full of exaggeration and fear mongering that ignores contrary evidence or any sense of proportion that I can’t help but suspect they hyperbole is just a mask for darker motives. The fact that in many cases these attacks come from those who also display great hostility towards Mormonism says it all. Deny it all you want, it is easy to see. For a satirical look at it, check this video I made: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG68yz-mMgE
I am going to make some predictions I would like to make, and I hope this thread stays around so that in years to come you can all look back and see how it turned out:
- every conservative you respect will vote for Mitt, all of them (perhaps a couple excepts, but not many) will even endorse him and perhaps campaign with him
- Mitt will become the next POTUS in a landslide victory,
- President Romney will do very well on the economy and on foreign affairs/national security
- President Romney will conduct himself with honor and integrity both in office and in his personal life
- He will be a better president than either Bush was
- You will hear conservative pundits call him this generation’s Ronald Reagan, or Ronald Reagan’s 3rd term or something along those lines
- President Romney will be re-elected in another big victory
- His Vice President will become POTUS after his second term
- If there is an assassination attempt on him, it will either be by the Chineese, or by some religiously motivated nutjob (Islamic or Evangelical)
And for those of you anti-Mormons out there, I have some prediction for you too. And these apply even if Romney is not elected as POTUS:
- Your grandchildren will call Mormons Christians, and look at Mormonism as the third branch of Christianity alongside Catholicism and Protestantism
- All the attacks against Romney that stem from the anti-Mormon garbage you have bought into will result in the attacker either apologizing, or in their loss of credibility. The more anti-Mormon attacks are made in the mainstream media, the worse the attackers will look.
- Your grandchildren will likewise look at such attacks as being as bigoted and wrong, even when they come from you.
- Some of your grandchildren or great-grandchildren will become Mormons, and after you are dead they will have temple ordinances performed for you, and you will be glad at the time that they do.
I dare you to post your own predictions of what a Romney presidency will result in.
I dare FR to leave this thread open and available for comments and to not delete a single comment from it.
I dare FR to start respecting freedom of religion by not playing favorites towards one religious group as is currently done by disallowing Mormon caucus threads, and if that is too big a challenge for you, the do away with the Religion Forum altogether.
I dare you all to give Mormons and Mormonism the respect it deserves to have as the 4th largest denomination in the USA, stalwart defender of traditional values, glowing example of Christian charity at home and around the world, the most conservative people of all religious groups, and staunch defenders of the principles of the constitution and values that built the country. No matter how much you disagree with us on religious matters, we are and should be treated as valuable conservative allies. Until FR does that, all they do is shoot themselves in the foot.
I'm not intolerant of Elsie's beliefs...I'm sick of his constant attacks on others beliefs.
So do you have some "license" that allows you to object to other posters religious objections to Mormonism -- but then they can't object to Mormonism on multiple grounds?
Like I said, take it to the RF. For News and Activism threads, it has gotten really old. Mormonism is being used as a political weapon against Romney and I believe its wrong.
Are we to go by what you preach ("Thou shalt be tolerant and thou shalt not be bigoted") ... or by what you practice -- your own stubborn bigotedness & intolerance of what Elsie has said about Mormonism as applied to multiple arenas (political/religious/socio-political/religio-political, etc.)???
Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense. I'm not the one haranguing against one religion day after day.
You’re projecting wayyyyyy too much. I should have used Mormonism instead of Mormons.
I don’t know Elsie, so I have no idea whether his hatred of the religion spills over to individual Mormons or not.
ARE MORMONS
To be of the same religion, you MUST have the SAME GOD. We believe in GOD THE FATHER, GOD THE SON AND GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT. You do not believe Jesus is part of the Godhead. You believe Jesus is your savior (which is really confusing to me because your religion is about works and making levels, depending on the works you do. If you have to work to get to heaven, why do you need a savior & why did Jesus have to die?)
Why are you ashamed to be Mormon, thus wanting people to call you Christian? You are NOT Christian. If you want to acknowledge Jesus as not just the Son of God, but God Himself, thats is a start.
Says he likes reading this thread now...Hi Grig! Enjoy while you can...come tomorrow you won't even be an afterthought on FR.
Most of the Mormons that I'm aware of (that posted on FR), were quite conservative....socially and politically.
Their are thousands of other sites they can post on for other reasons. I'm sure they were attracted to FR conservative stances.
Unfortunately, many have been driven off this site...as if we can afford to run off conservatives simply because of their religious beliefs. Grig is just another in a long line.
Solution? Members who agree with another member being attacked may consider posting a positive post to offset the piling on of 2 or 3 obnoxious posters.
OK. Most mormons I know have very white teeth.
Well, hold onto your hat, Honey...the democrats haven't even started yet.
The Flying Inmans have been giving out the message for five years that running a mormon against a black man is utter stupidity. Just wait for the racist past of mormonism to catch up.
Funny.
Hey, Grig.
I was able to read some of the stuff over there, my goodness what whining.
Still only have less than 500 members, yes I can see how they are going strong.
Hey, we still on for the BBQ grey.
I should just set a date and place, if people show up they do if they don’t they don’t. ;-)
Bye Grig have a nice evening.
So far, most Mormons have kept their polygamy practices in the closet.
MMmm...can’t wait to taste some of your great food. Just let me know when!
What’s with this? And all the extra space and different colors. Quite a lot of band width used here, for what purpose? And sent to me, in a private message in addition to your “ping” list. One or the other, but both? I understand your irritation and agree, but at first I was quite surprised to find a direct message to me, when I made no comment on the thread.
They have not been driven off the site. They pushed and pushed and pushed against the founding principles of the site, until Jim Robinson said enough was enough.
A badge of honor, I suppose, in some Mormon circles.... kind of like Islamic suicide bombers.
Ummm...what's that got to do with a political discussion?
Why the focus on Mormonism instead of Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc....? Don't they all proselytize?
Sure.
Unfortunately, many have been driven off this site.
- - - - - -
They were NOT driven off FR, many were zotted for supporting polygamy, Romney, anti-freeper statements or support, trolling, cyber stalking and posting our personal information (IRL name and such) or doing stupid things like calling other Freepers Nazis.
They GOT THEMSELVES kicked off FR.
Mormon women make great funeral potatoes.
Peace be with US.
See my reply at 373.
No one was driven off, it was self promotion and irrationality that did.
When you post anti-FreeRepublic and anti-FreeRepublic member posts, having a sissy fit, you will most likely get zotted. Everyone has a bad day, but come one, if that’s all you do, move along.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.