Posted on 08/31/2019 5:31:15 AM PDT by marktwain
U.S.A. –-(Ammoland.com)- On 28 August, 2019, relatives of a former gun dealer called the police because they said, they were concerned the 72-Year-old man might be depressed and/or suicidal. I do not know if the man was suicidal or not, but old white men commit the largest percentages of suicides. They tend to use guns to do the deed. The police raided the house, on the authorization of the relatives. It appears to be a nice home in a nice neighborhood. Bustleton is home to many of Philadelphia's police officers and firefighters.
The wellness check turned into a full-blown media circus. Swat was called “to assist in clearing weapons.” The bomb squad was called. Hazmat was called. Why? Because the man involved, who had been a gun dealer, according to relatives, had a modest gun collection, some inert grenade bodies (easily and legally purchased), a smoke grenade (totally legal), some mercury (totally legal), and about a thousand rounds of ammunition. From abc.com:
According to investigators, officers encountered a 72-year-old man whom relatives expressed concern that he may be depressed or suicidal. The man was taken to the hospital for evaluation. Relatives said the man used to be a gun dealer.
Police say family members authorized them to enter the home, and upon entering, they found more than 50 guns, hundreds of rounds of ammo, 10 hand grenades, a pipe bomb and liquid mercury. The grenades are believed to be inert.
Here is the headline from cbslocal.com:
Philadelphia Police Find More Than 50 Guns, Grenades And Liquid Mercury In Bustleton Home, Officials Say
Watching some video of the raid by Philadelphia's finest,
(Excerpt) Read more at ammoland.com ...
Beware your relatives. How much is this man worth? Would the relatives inherit if an “accident” were to happen during a wellness check? Never assume good intentions about any of these red flag incidents.
If the man was not depressed, he sure is now.
Had ENOUGH Yet ? ........................ Enforce the Bill of Rights .........It is the LAW
These days, if you sell a shotgun you’ve had for 10 years to your brother-in-law, you’re now a ‘gun dealer’.
The man should notify his relatives that he has changed his will to give ALL his estate to the NRA.
How many provisions of the Constitution did they violate? 1. Second Amendment - They took his guns without due process. 2. Fourth Amendment - They took his possessions without a warrant or probable cause of a crime being committed. 3. Fifth Amendment - They took his possessions without any compensation. Almost certainly, he will have to expend considerable resources to get them back. 4. Sixth Amendment - (likely, not certain yet) The witness against him has not been named, nor has he been able to confront the witness(es). 14th amendment - Due process for taking the property was not followed.
The man should notify his relatives that he has changed his will to give ALL his estate to the NRA.
_________
Always leave a nominal $1.00 to each relative—It acknowledges the relationship, gives them something from the estate and also makes the will less contestable.
Pennsylvania doesn’t even have a “red flag” law. What possible legal basis is there for the police to search this man’s home, much less seize his property? Unless the “relatives” own the home, they certainly have no ability to “authorize” the police to enter?
I have a blood relative whom I love dearly, but wouldn’t trust with any information ‘bout my guns or medical records. He has an authoritarian streak a mile wide, and hates the idea of private gun ownership (not that he knows anything about guns — he just hates ‘em). He’d be the first to “red flag” someone if he thought he could contrive a believable story to tell the police. And whether that story was factual or complete fantasy wouldn’t make a bit of difference to him.
The legal basis is that police are allowed to enter homes to check that the person inside is not incapacitated or in difficulties.
It becomes rather problematic when considering suicide. Ordinarily, the police would just knock on the door and ask if the person were feeling ok. If no answer, they would enter to find out what is going on.
But there was a case in Wisconsin, where a Psychologist misinterpreted a patients statements, and asked the police to check on her as suicidal.
The patient called the Psycologist, who then called the police and said she had made a mistake, the patient was *not* suicidal.
The police showed up at the house. The patient told them she was fine and refused to allow them in.
They forced entry and confiscated her self defense gun.
She was/is a Second Amendment activist (I suspect she was targeted for this reason).
She sued the police.
The courts held against her, saying the police acted in good faith.
She eventually got her gun back.
What, pray tell, can the police do for someone who is depressed? go in and sing a tune of happiness, or dance a jig? That’s not what the police are for.
So, the media were called to film the invasion. I’m sure they didn’t call the old man to tell him they were coming.
So, everything was totally legal. The police and the media demonized the old man because some a$$hole said he was “depressed.” For XXXXX’s sake, visit the old man you a$$hole! He doesn’t need the cops at his door to cheer him up!
(Assorted other choice scatalogical and reproductive imprecations hurled at the media, police, and fool relative).
A hill to die on ! ?
Semper Fi..........predating the yellow foot prints.
> The police raided the house, on the authorization of the relatives. <
Well, that’s nice. I suppose police can now raid houses without authorization from a judge or a warrant. That Fourth Amendment was a nuisance anyway.
Since the police said they found a pipe bomb there, he is probably not coming back home. And if the police said they found a pipe bomb , they found a pipe bomb. They probably [with the same odds of probability that the sun will rise in the east Sunday morning] put it there, so why shouldn't they find it? So with that happening, the lawyers and family members will be fighting over who gets the old man's money. The smart money bets on the lawyers.
You are right about that.
Bizarre as it might seem, the police can take a person into custody, take them to a health care facility, and force them to undergo evaluation about their mental state.
If they are found to be a threat to *themselves* or others, they can be involuntarily committed.
Some of the stories have walked back the "pipe bomb" claim, just as they have walked back the grenades to *inert* grenades.
I think that the relatives outsmarted themselves when the police “found” the pipe bomb. Because now there will probably be a trial, involving lawyers. Now they will have to fight the lawyers for the old man’s money. And in such a fight, the smart money always is always on the lawyers.
I believe that even if you give it to him, that applies, doesn’t it? I not sure.
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