Posted on 02/10/2007 1:46:41 AM PST by Atlantic Bridge
As Germany decides to send Tornado reconnaissance jets to Afghanistan, is this the beginning of a slippery slope that will see German troops getting involved in combat duty in the volatile south?
German Chancellor Angela Merkel's cabinet agreed on Wednesday to send six Tornado reconnaissance jets to Afghanistan to assist its NATO allies in fighting a resurgent Taliban.
The mission has to be approved by the German parliament, the Bundestag, in March and then the jets could be on their way to Afghanistan by April. The government has been quick to rule out the use of the planes, which are equipped with powerful cameras, in attacking enemy targets themselves. Germany's 2,900 troops serving with the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) are mostly stationed in the relatively stable northern part of the country, and Berlin has come under pressure to do more to support its allies in the volatile south.
(Excerpt) Read more at spiegel.de ...
Espechially the recent problems of the US in Iraq made it nearly impossible for the German chancellor to do something really substanical. Love it or hate it: The German public sees the failures in Iraq as a proof for the correctness of the Schroeder/Chirac/Putin predictions. Since German politicans want to be re-elected they have to respect such fundamental trends among their voters.
The problem are not the German people, the problem is the left wing media (DER SPIEGEL is part of the MSM) in Europe that does not inform the people about the realities properly. But that might not be too different to the US.
Western Europe Ping!
Atlantic Bridge,
As a poster (and reader) you already know that we have not lost in Iraq.
I read your profile page and you look like you can handle the truth.
War is hard.
The war on terror is hard.
Real wars have ups and downs and
rethinking of strategies.
Losing the war would be unthinkable.
In my opinion, our country will not survive if we did lose this war.
I do agree with you about the left wing media.
You might find this web site interesting:
http://medienkritik.typepad.com/
The headline is exactly the problem. Germans don´t realize that Afghanistan is primary a combat mission, and that we have own security interests in stabilizing the region. Thus, they don´t see the need to send more troops.
Six jets and they are forbidden to attack the enemy?
That's a couple of beers shy of an Oktoberfest.
Look, these jets are for reconaissence purposes. They get the targets, and others knock the targets out. The jets are armed only for self-defense. The German people have been less reluctant with regard to fight in 2001/2002, when we had special forces operating in the hills of Afghanistan. That seems to be forgotten by now. :-(
Iran's nuke will have one good affect - it might be the only thing that can convince these fools that we are at war.
Now we just have to convince the Americans not to surrender to the jihadists. The American public is making France look like a brave country.
'What's that Miss Hillary? You want to get on the Kyoto Protocol? Why sho! You the President now girl, we can do whatever you want! Withdraw from Afghanistan- you betcha!'
America is the country in this fight that is setting itself up for failure. A word of advice to Americans- end your love affair with Nancy Pelosi, Hillary Clinton and others and you might have a chance.
I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen though. America would have elected Bill Clinton to a third term if he could've run. Tells you everything one needs to know about our sanity and guts.
Based on the news coverage I've seen, the love affair with Nancy Pelosi will be over before tax season concludes (April 15). In a 24/7 news cycle world, Nancy will be an easy target...just look at the flap over her jet request.
The Kyoto Protocol will never fly in the US. Don't forget, the first time around, the US Senate voted 95-0 against it, and that was with Slick Willie in the White House and algore as his number two.
What should concern the rest of the world is the coming isolationist streak in the US. Democrats are painting themselves into a corner regarding the (non) use of military force. Republicans (such as myself) have not forgotten the lack of support from "allies" during the Iraq conflict, and the greater War on Terror.
A critical juncture is coming soon, as retirements from millions of Baby Boomers will consume much of the federal budget. In essence, the message from Washington to the rest of the world could be: solve your own problems, we're out of cash.
To paraphrase it:
If you want to play in the big boys game, you have to ante up.......
While I generally agree with most of that, I don't think dealing with Kyoto/Global Warming will be as easy as it once was. There has been a decade+ of Big Lie propaganda pushing this, since then.
"The problem are not the German people, the problem is the left wing media"
Yes my friend that is a major problem with the difference in "world view" between the US and Europe. It is as if all their life the Europeans have been told by the media that the sky is green and the grass blue. I can try to present my view, but, I have no chance of changing any minds! Consequently, I long ago decided that when the discussion turned to politics that it was best to keep my opinions to myself.
Thanks for posting.
This is indeed a big problem. Maybe not for the bigger countries like the UK, France or Germany, but the small ones in eastern Europe could loose their most important millitary partner. Japan, Taiwan and South Korea are probably forced to join the nuclear club then. The world will not be a better place without a global active US.
I read something just the other day which mentioned this, and also observed that the German SF troops had acquitted themselves in disciplined, efficient, effective fashion. Typisch Deutsch! I expect the German recon pilots will contribute greatly.
I have fond memories of my tour in Germany, to include a glorious 4th of July weekend at a campground at Lake Constance.
Most of my time was spent along the Mosel River, as I lived in Traben-Trarbach for 3 years. Long weekends were spent in Lutjenburg (30 miles east of Kiel), with good friends made during a temporary assignment at the German anti-aircraft range at Todendorf.
I've forgotten most of my German, but it was put to good use during the 1980 election. Seems many, if not all, of my neighbors, pleaded with me to vote for Jimmy Carter, because Ronald Reagan was going to start WW3! Fortunately, my vote for Ronaldus Magnus did not cost me a seat at the stammtische.
When I left in 1981, I was told that my German was accentless. Probably because I spoke in the Hunsrucker dialect...LOL!
Hehe! Where there? I am not living that far away from Lake Constance. :-)
It's up to Germany, of course. But success in Afghanistan is something that will benefit the world. It cannot be done without taking risks. I often find that those most likely to take that risk, the soldiers, for example, are more willing than the general public who won't leave their own homes or villages to impact the struggle.
Yes, America had not lost - so far. This could change quickly if the DoD lacks the political support through a changed administration. To put it short - under a President Hillary Clinton America will loose in Iraq.
The informed conservative Europeans are very well aware about this bitter fact. It is idle to speculate about the future of Iraq, but I share your view that losing this country to Iran and the terrorists is no alternative. Nevertheless we have to think the unthinkable just to be prepared since our security situation will be completely different then.
This last sentence is something that is still not understood in Germany and the left media has its share on it.
P.S. Of course I know David's Medienkritik. I have to say that he -apart from some just critism- is overdrawing the level of Anti-Americanism in Germany. It is true that most common people do not like President Bush, but it is also true that they see America as the nucleus of freedom. This should not be forgotten on your side of the big pond.
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