Opinion: Apple -- Here to Stay

MacCentral ^ | March 08, 2005 | Don Tennant

[r5boston]

Nearly a decade ago, just a few months after Microsoft shipped Windows 95, I asked Bill Gates if it was a conscious decision in the development of that product to give Windows more of a Mac look and feel. Of course I knew he'd say it wasn't, but I couldn't resist asking. "There was no goal even to compete with Macintosh," Gates proclaimed. "We don't even think of Macintosh as a competitor."

That was a crock, so I pressed the issue a little. I asked him how he accounted for the widespread perception that Windows 95 looked a lot like Mac 88, and whether the similarity was just a coincidence. I didn't expect a sobbing confession of mimicry, but I thought it would be cool to see how he'd respond. Surprisingly enough, Gates shifted gears and became more forthcoming.

[Swordmaker]

Is there some reason to believe that the Creative players were subjected to more abuse than the Ipods on display?

Why sure...

Customer: This Creative player sounds tinny... maybe if I bash it on the counter it will sound better.

Sound effects: BANG... BANG, BANG... BANG...

Customer: Oh, see, that's better.

[Swordmaker]

While the ipod has a better user interface the ipod is an expensive disposable toy - when the battery goes you get to throw it away (word on the street is that is about 18 months).

False... again, rumors and old news. When the iPod battery dies after whatever period... you replace it... takes about 5 minutes and $30.

[SunkenCiv]

anyone could program a PC- Mac stayed proprietary.

Windows is proprietary. And Microsoft has used its licensing "agreements" (sign here or get cut out of the loop) to gut third party developers (potential competitors).

[Swordmaker]

Make that $200+ to replace the hard-wired battery which can only be surgically removed (unless they redesigned the ipod since last Christmas). There are I HATE IPODS websites out there - look them up. The Creative Nomad battery is really replaceable - the top pops open and you can go to Best Buy and get a new one (or pay twice as much for half the disk space and get yourself an ipod comrade and if you have any WMV files you are SOL)

Are you truly as ignorant as you appear or do you really like spreading false information?

It has been posted on FreeRepublic MANY times that the iPod battery can be replaced... do it yourself for about $30, third party techs for about $50-$60, or send it to Apple and they will send do it for you for $99. (actually, they send you a refurbished iPod loaded with your music from your old one.) ... or you buy a $59 Applecare policy for your iPod and Apple replaces it for free.

[SunkenCiv]

Woz is indeed of Polish ancestry. I've heard Woz (at an AppleFest) tell a Polish joke that made me laugh, hard, while simultaneously worrying about getting struck by lightning. :')

[Swordmaker]

I have no problem with somebody choosing Mac but stop throwing rocks at the 96% of society that has chosen an alternative. Mac made several business mistakes and lost to a competitor that may/may not be better. Its the marketplace and the American way. Life goes on.

Excuse me... but WHO is throwing rocks?

Not the Mac users. Read back over this thread and see who it is using ad hominem attacks?

[Swordmaker]

Actually, IBM tried that, but Compaq reverse-engineered it.

Did you know that IBM FIRED the management of the Boca Raton Typewriter plant that produced the IBM-PC? They did not clear their project with upper management before releasing it, presenting IBM management with a fait accompli.

The typewriter guys went against several corporate policies with the PC.

First violation, they violated the rule that IBM only sold products totally developed by IBM... the "not invented here" was corporate gold. The Boca Raton crowd bought stuff "off the shelf" up to and including the operating system... which brings us to the:

Second violation, they violated the corporate policy that all software was IBM... especially the operating system. These typewriter guys bought an operating system from a (gasp) third party! Horrors.

Third violation: IBM policy was that Operating Systems were LEASED. The Typewriter guys LICENSED THEM! This did not allow a continuing stream of income to IBM... and upgrades would be available from (horrors) that third party... somebody called Microsoft?

And finally, fourth, the TYPEWRITER DIVISION was competing with the COMPUTER DIVISION, selling a system that didn't cost upwards of $50,000, that didn't require weekly visits from your friendly (white shirt, thin black tie) software engineer, that didn't bring in mega-bucks of lease payments for software, and (horrors) that average joes could program themselves without hiring IBM's hordes of software engineers to do for them!

And the result of this, in the eyes of IBM management, was that these typewriter guys were not "Team players". So they fired them.

And you know, the upper management was right in their criticisms... because the ONLY IBM-PC component that was 100% developed by IBM, and that they could protect was the BIOS... and that got reverse-engineered (a few companies cloned it out-right and were slapped down very rapidly!) by Compaq and all hell was out for noon... and IBM lost control of the market.

[Rubber_Duckie_27]

You can get a Mac for $499 now. Compare to the piece of crud Dell PC for $400 that you KNOW will not hold up long-term. The price differences just aren't that big anymore.

I am not an IT professional. I did work for several years as a campus networking technician to have some beer money. We very rarely had trouble with Macs (and virtually all the art and music majors had them due to specialized software needs) and when we did, it could usually be fixed very quickly and over the phone. The PCs on the other hand - especially the cheapie Dells and Gateways - were atrocious and generally required a room visit. Software problems, fried hardware components, you name it. A kid's built-in network adapter would suddenly just die and then you needed to call Dell for the drivers. Jugdish in Hyderabad would stumble through his little tech support script in heavily accented English and good luck to you if you could actually understand what he was saying!

I had a Windows PC all through college that I regularly did battle with. My fiance's family has had Macs all along; he's the only one who's ever had a PC.

Once I was out of school and had the disposable income for a new computer, I checked out both PC and Apple...and my little Apple iBook won out. It was a comparable price for similar features, actually.

In 10 months, it has NEVER locked up or crashed. I regularly stay online for weeks or months at a time without rebooting. When I do shut it down, it's for travel or software updates. My fiance does have a higher-end Dell which has not had many problems - I'm not a Windows hater. But for me, I prefer my Mac. And in the future, if a Mac is a little more expensive than a comparable Windows machine, I'll buy the Mac.

You're right - for a long time in the past the money difference was HUGE. But they're definitely knocking the price down. And the iPod is helping - a decent percentage of Windows users who buy an iPod will switch to a Mac.

[sittnick]

You nailed it. For graphics/video Mac is unfortunately still the better/prefered but for BUISNESS/ACCOUNTING, TAX, WORD PROCESSING Microsoft wins hands down. So for the Hollywood elite Mac wins. For the productive end of society its Windows. BTW Rush Limbaugh is a bigtime Mac Advocate and they won't advertise with him because he is conservative. Had they taken Rush's advertising pitchess starting in 1988 I'm sure their market share would be at least a little ahead of 5%.

It is not unfortunate that the Mac is "still better/preferred." The (Traditional Catholic) book publishing company I work for is plenty productive with its Macs. The Windows PCs are faster, but those Macs in prepress need no maintenance, they just keep on going. I know that the Hollywood left loves them, and only a few years ago the Hollywood studios loved another lefty company, SGI. (Gee, whatever happened to THEM?!) The Packard half of Hewlett-Packard (still a huge shareholder) is exceptionally liberal, of the NPR stripe. Gates hangs around with Warren Buffet, who plans to leave ALL his billions to population control outfits upon death. Except for Michael Dell (who does not make software) and maybe Novell, the whole apparatus is liberal liberal liberal. It's hard enough passing by the Arby's and Dairy Queen during my lunch hour (no Wendy's nearby, alas), but a bloke like me who would rather avoid Red Chinese goods and liberal companies is put in a bind. We mostly buy used for other reasons, so at least I am not directly contributing to the bottom line.

You are right about Rush. The Snapple people were every bit as liberal, but they valued the success of their business over their disdain that a conservative might get some refreshment from their beverage and was happy to let the world know it. BTW, when Rush first started glowing about Apple on the radio, the company was run by John Scully, the old head of Pepsi. Maybe they fear lefty programmers quitting? Maybe they are just stupid?!

I am not a complete dittohead, but when Rush Limbaugh talks about a product glowingly that he can actually distinguish in its use (You cannot tell how well vitamin pills works, really, but you can tell how well a cold remedy or bed works), I follow his advice (well, not about the bed) and have not regretted it. My wife avoided a serious chest cold, she states, thanks to Zicam, and last year our Kidde Nighthawk Carbon Monoxide alarm detected an oven leak (we had a 3 year old and an infant in the house!). The fireman told us that we had gotten a good model.

Apple makes very good hardware, does a lot right, but over the years they have made a LOT of pig-headed moves.

Windows 2000 Pro is a good day-to-day OS. My only regret is that I cannot "ghost" it for mass deployment because the SID # is embedded everywhere.

[sittnick]

As someone who liked the taskbar, 95 and descendants was light years ahead of Mac.

I still don't like the taskbar much, and Apple copying it (although vastly improving it) for OS X as the Dock is one of the major usability problems with OS X.

And of course, Steve Jobs own NeXT computer running on MACH had a dock before either.

[syriacus]

This can't be. A school district administrator told my teacher-husband, a few years back, that Apple was going to go "belly up."

[Tribune7]

now pcs are 450 and macs are still AT LEAST twice that.

Not any more :-)

[Tribune7]

I think just about everybody kinda guesses that Woz is of Polish descent :-)

Anyway, most would argue that it was Jobs that helped Woz. (Woz was the brains.)

[Tribune7]

Microsoft stealing windows from MAC. Apple stoled it first.

One more reason why I find it hard to get indignant over software piracy.

[Tribune7]

Use what you like and what helps you do your job. Be excellent to each other.

You Mac-lovin' hippy :-)

[Tribune7]

Macs don't even ship with a two-button scroll-wheel mouse.

BUT they do work with them and you can get them for less than $30.

That, of course, doesn't necessairly take away from your point.

[CheneyChick]

You Mac fanboys are living in some kind of reality distortion field, circa 1995,

Forgetting to include us "fangirls" as well??

Cheers, CC :)

[daviddennis]

You're out of date.

It's aluminum (in the high-end models like my G5) and white plastic (in the low-end models). Only the iPod Mini is available in colours.

And you are right that Windows computers use the same components as the Mac, except for the processor and some custom-made parts. That helps keep Mac prices down, which you should surely applaud.

But there's one thing I don't understand: Why does being a Mac user decrease my sense of adventure? Surely using something 95% of the population uses is not exactly an adventure. I would say the adventure comes by using something unique and special, like the Mac.

Owning a PC isn't an adventure. It's just a job.

D

[sittnick]

Surely using something 95% of the population uses is not exactly an adventure.

Actually, "95% of the population" might well be using Windows, but that group is very fragmented. Not counting the Server and Enterprise and boutique versions (Tablet, CE, Multimedia, etc.) we still have lots of people using 98se, Me and 2000 Pro. XP users are divided between Home and Pro. In my company (and some other ones, some of them large like Walgreens) Windows XP is not used. We stick with 2000 Pro. We still have a couple of 98se boxes and DOS machines running specialty peripherals/apps. I would maintain that anyone trying to run Windows Me must have a little sense of Adventure. Windows 98 users have the adventure of seeing whether their laptop or networked unit will actually shut down like it is supposed to!

As Jean-Louis Gasseé once said, "I love the Windows Operating System, I love it so much I install it over and over again." (Note: he was referring to Windows 95. Things have improved since then.)

[cowboyway]

"We don't even think of Macintosh as a competitor."

That was probably a true statement by Gates. He probably saw Macintosh as more of a mentor.