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Knife vs Gun - Revisit the 21 Foot Rule
Am Shooting Journal ^ | 2/27/2019 | C Cocoles

Posted on 02/27/2019 12:26:26 AM PST by w1n1

The 21 foot rule drill is well known within the law enforcement and personal defense circle.
The Tueller drill is all about "reactionary gap" through training. Other trainers have come up with the distances associated it to the Tueller drill. This experimentation, determined that the average healthy adult male can cover a distance of seven yards (21 feet) in about 1.5 seconds.

The significance of the time factor is based on the reasonable standard that a person who’s trained in proper pistol craft (gun fighting) should be able to draw a handgun and place two centered hits on a life-size silhouette at seven yards in about 1.5 seconds.

Training Scar
According to Force Science Research Center the old way of training was to stop the scenario when the defender gets off the first shot at the perpetrator. This type of training and mentality of “bang you’re dead” leads to a false sense of safety, this is a "training scar". A training scar is a negative trait that’s come as a result of bad training practices.

Another training scar that is common in shooting is how we are all conditioned to stand on the firing line and shoot at a static target. For this reason, most Law Enforcement Officers and civilian gun owners step in concrete the minute their gun leaves the holster.

Alternative Solutions Force Science Research Center provides an alternative way is to turn the “Tueller concept” into an actual drill as a force on force exercise. Basically, the drill extends to another 10-15 seconds, rather than stopping on the first bang you’re dead. We have to get rid of the "Bang! You're dead" mentality. This gives the participants a chance to utilize any tactics (techniques) to survive. Read the rest of knife vs gun.


TOPICS: Hobbies; Outdoors
KEYWORDS: banglist; blogpimp; getaneditor; guns; knife; momsbasement
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1 posted on 02/27/2019 12:26:26 AM PST by w1n1
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To: w1n1

In a game of rock, paper, scissors, the gun always wins.


2 posted on 02/27/2019 12:43:10 AM PST by Telepathic Intruder
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To: w1n1

Great thoughts and ideas. I find the threat assessment time is critical. If the advasary says he will stab, shoot, beat(as in with an object), you better get activated. Believe the threat, draw your weapon and prepare to shoot and move. I can’t get it done in 1.5 seconds on a spur of moment deal. I’m getting the old. Playing fair and hollering draw is BS. You have to win, you don’t get do overs. USCCA had an article on the aftermath of a self-defense incident. The mental part is daunting, but you have to survive to learn to live with your actions. Can and will you shoot? The issue is very complex. The more I study and practice the more I find I don’t know enough.


3 posted on 02/27/2019 12:48:08 AM PST by Equine1952 (Get yourself a ticket on a common mans train of thought)
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To: w1n1

If the suspicious person is 21 feet away, I’m more worried about him suddenly producing a weapon and firing rather than charging. But in either case every foot further away is a benefit. At 21 yards he is likely to miss if he fires quickly but at 21 feet the sucker punch (pistol shot) is likely to hit home.


4 posted on 02/27/2019 12:55:22 AM PST by Monterrosa-24 (...even more American than a Russian AK-47 and a French bikini.)
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To: Telepathic Intruder
Rock/Paper/Scissor/Lizard/Spock

A Simple Way to Remember Who Wins
Scissors cuts paper.
Paper covers rock.
Rock crushes lizard.
Lizard poisons Spock.
Spock smashes scissors.
Scissors decapitates lizard.
Lizard eats paper.
Paper disproves Spock.
Spock vaporizes rock.
Rock crushes scissors.

More Details and History

5 posted on 02/27/2019 12:57:10 AM PST by mabarker1 (Congress- the opposite of PROGRESS!!! C ?)
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To: w1n1

In the video where he uses the car as a shield. He’s lucky the bad guy didn’t have a gun and shoot him in the back as he turned his back on the bad guy.


6 posted on 02/27/2019 1:01:13 AM PST by 21twelve (!)
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To: mabarker1
Everyone loses
7 posted on 02/27/2019 1:26:19 AM PST by Telepathic Intruder
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To: Equine1952

Yes. I just read an article the other day in which a self defense expert said that the common wisdom of training that says don’t pull your gun unless you intend to shoot is wrong. He said that pulling your gun is an act of deterrence that works. The trick is that the shooter has to assess a imminent threat that is explainable to the cops.

In SC, there is a law against brandishing a weapon. Obviously there is a difference between waving a gun around and a deterrent draw but as the first words out of my NRA instructor’s mouth was, you ain’t shooting bullets, you’re shooting lawyers.

All that being said, I’ll opt for staying alive if God forbid I find myself backed into a wall.


8 posted on 02/27/2019 2:17:14 AM PST by DeplorablePaul
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To: w1n1

There should be a 21 foot rule for ASJ. The writing is horrendous.

If this is your website, please get some human or software editorial help.


9 posted on 02/27/2019 2:36:13 AM PST by BTerclinger (MAGA)
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To: Telepathic Intruder

LOL !!!


10 posted on 02/27/2019 3:26:52 AM PST by mabarker1 (Congress- the opposite of PROGRESS!!! C ?)
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To: w1n1
Crap. I'm too old to run and too pretty for prison.

Not a lot of good choices.

11 posted on 02/27/2019 3:35:16 AM PST by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Telepathic Intruder

Canada Bill Jones’ law:
A smith and wesson beats four aces.


12 posted on 02/27/2019 4:11:26 AM PST by null and void (If socialism is so grand, why are Guatemalans coming here instead of going to Venezuela?)
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To: Telepathic Intruder

When I play that with someone, I call “Dynamite” and blow-up any hand he shows, I always win. lol.


13 posted on 02/27/2019 5:00:19 AM PST by carriage_hill (A society grows great when old men plant trees, in whose shade they know they will never sit.)
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To: w1n1

“Bang, you’re dead” does not work.
You shoot a VC and approach his body and just like that, he’s shooting at you.
Dead guys sometimes shoot back.


14 posted on 02/27/2019 5:02:47 AM PST by BuffaloJack (Chivalry is not dead. It is a warriors code and only practiced by warriors.)
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To: BTerclinger

“There should be a 21 foot rule for ASJ. The writing is horrendous.”

ASJ is gun talk by and for gun guys. Yes the writing is pretty bad sometimes, but the content is by and for gun guys.

Maybe instead of complaining, you might volunteer to offer to proofread for them.


15 posted on 02/27/2019 5:45:47 AM PST by SolidRedState (I used to think bizarro world was a fiction.)
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To: mabarker1

Its just a step to the left.
And a jump to the right.
Put your hand on your hips.
Put the punk it your sights.

.


16 posted on 02/27/2019 5:46:17 AM PST by Vermont Lt
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To: w1n1

The problem with this video is that the “cop” knows the “criminal” will charge, and that the gun is already drawn. In real life you don’t know what is going to happen. Your reaction time alone will be 0.5-0.75 seconds and drawing the gun will add another second at least before you get an aimed shot off. Even if you get the shot off and hit the assailant in a vital spot, it won’t necessarily stop him before you get cut up.


17 posted on 02/27/2019 6:14:24 AM PST by Brooklyn Attitude (The first step in ending the war on white people is to recognize it exists.)
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To: w1n1

Given this information (thought it was 25 feet), the attackee should retreat until ready to defend. Perhaps picking up 1-2 seconds more.


18 posted on 02/27/2019 6:43:16 AM PST by SgtHooper (If you remember the 60's, YOU WEREN'T THERE!)
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To: SolidRedState

I know they are by and for gun guys (thats why I read them, Firearm News, American Rifleman, Matt Bracken, John Ross, Massad Ayoob, etc)

But that doesn’t mean they have to intentionally not have an editor, proof reader / use SW to fix their grammar.

For years.

If it doesn’t bother you but bothers me (and others here who have complained), thats what makes for horse races....( : >)

As for volutneering, I didn’t know they were not for profit. Looks like they have regional staff, and take a LOT of advertising:

http://americanshootingjournal.com/advertise/


19 posted on 02/27/2019 8:57:08 AM PST by BTerclinger (MAGA)
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To: w1n1

20 posted on 02/27/2019 9:08:13 AM PST by Mat_Helm
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