Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Martin attacked Zimmerman
Yahoo ^ | March 25 | Howard

Posted on 03/25/2012 7:26:44 AM PDT by Howard Morrison

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120321195530AALPKWj

(Excerpt) Read more at answers.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: crime; guns; selfdefense; trayvonmartin
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-132 next last
Comment #51 Removed by Moderator

To: Cicero

Was he trespassing? Thought his father’s girlfriend lived in the so-called “gated community.” The community was an apartment complex with gates that were locked. When the media said “gated community” wasn’t your first thought of some very wealthy people with tied up yachts and huge houses? Trayvon may have just wanted to get out of the house to talk to his girlfriend privately.

Only mentioned this because the story is screwed up ANYWAY, not by you necessarily, but we just don’t know. If the race-baiters keep it up, we’ll never know, because they’ll have Zimmerman hung before his story even GETS out.


52 posted on 03/25/2012 9:48:06 AM PDT by madison10
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: BilLies

I agree with most of what you say.

However, that Zimmerman may have been losing the fight does not in and of itself mean he did not also start the fight.

You are, of course, 100% correct about the media.


53 posted on 03/25/2012 9:50:14 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine
"Gated communities, whether super nice estates, condos, or apartments, seem to be the trend to help keep out the riff-raff."

No, not necessarily. Most "gated communities" have gates that open and close with each person coming and going. This place (like most like it) is decorative at best. A kid could climb over that wall and I doubt those gates are ever closed. But it's all a guess as I do not live there.

54 posted on 03/25/2012 9:55:37 AM PDT by SW6906 (6 things you can't have too much of: sex, money, firewood, horsepower, guns and ammunition.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan; Howard Morrison
We know there was a physical fight. Which of the two was “the attacker” is not known.

Oh come on.

Z might not be the brightest bulb and maybe overzealous protecting the neighborhood and call cops, but people carrying concealed weapons, would rarely ever start a physical confrontation. I just don't see it.

I could be wrong, but I think when this all shakes out, you'll find Martin initiated the physical altercation.

55 posted on 03/25/2012 9:58:09 AM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Cicero

“He was trespassing in a gated community.”

I haven’t been following too closely, but this isn’t what I have heard. Where did you hear this?

Freegards


56 posted on 03/25/2012 9:58:40 AM PDT by Ransomed
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: Cicero
-- He was trespassing in a gated community. --

He had a right to be there, staying with his father who lived there.

57 posted on 03/25/2012 9:59:15 AM PDT by Cboldt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

bump


58 posted on 03/25/2012 10:04:02 AM PDT by Ghengis
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan
-- No, but if you pursue someone and a fight develops, it's pretty tough to claim you were acting in self-defense.

One of the few things that is perfectly clear about this case is that Zimmerman initiated the confrontation. --

On the first point, the inquiry is whether the person claiming self defense is in reasonable apprehension of unwelcome contact. Pursuit, in itself, may or may not give a reasonable person the right to hit you - generally it does NOT, without more.

But in addition to that, I think you make an error when you assume that the tables can't turn in this case, with Martin becoming the one in pursuit of Zimmerman. Zimmerman lost sight of Martin, and said (recorded on the call to dispatch) that he was going back to his vehicle. That sounds like pursuit broken off.

Said another way, it's possible, in a fairly short period of time, to have more than one confrontation.

59 posted on 03/25/2012 10:05:16 AM PDT by Cboldt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: kabar
Thank you,

Norton N. Bonaparte, Jr., ICMA-CM

City Manager

More background on Norton Bonaparte, from a city where he used to work:

Ex-Camden official plays role in investigation of Florida shooting

60 posted on 03/25/2012 10:07:11 AM PDT by cynwoody
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Beagle8U

Post #129 has been removed by the moderator.


61 posted on 03/25/2012 10:07:25 AM PDT by kabar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: SW6906

Sure they can climb over the wall but they do keep out the unauthorized vehicle traffic. Some gates are closed all of the time, some during the night only, and some never.


62 posted on 03/25/2012 10:07:35 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: greatvikingone

Thanks. The site is very helpful for giving background and texture to the situation.


63 posted on 03/25/2012 10:07:50 AM PDT by BilLies (Ass.Press ABCBSNBCNN, NYTimes, WaPOSt , etc., hate your Traditional American guts!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Tex-Con-Man
But so far, it seems Zimmerman could have simply phoned it in and left it alone.

And Martin would probably still be alive if any one of those people that called 911 would have gone out to help the guy they heard screaming for help for probably a full minute. (Based on how long you could hear him yelling on the 911 calls and knowing that he was yelling before the 911 call was made.) Zimmerman told the police that he yelled for help, but nobody would help him.

They all phoned it in and left it alone.

No crime had been committed, nor was one in progress.

Easier to say looking back at it from a couple weeks forward.

I think I saw that there HAD been some crimes in that community. As I envision the circumstances leading up to the shooting I think that Zimmerman was apparently somebody that seriously wanted to make the community he lived in a safer place to live. Spending his time doing the neighborhood watch thing, he paid a lot of attention to who he saw around in that community. When he saw a black guy that he had never seen before roaming around at night, he called it in. And then, since he really wanted to stop the crimes in the neighborhood and to give the police the best odds of being able to question that stranger, he did his best to try to keep him in sight. Martin started running away.

So we've got a stranger in the gated community that runs away when he's spotted. I can see how that would make Zimmerman even more suspicious that he had located the person that was committing crimes in his neighborhood. Yeah, looking back, you can say that no crime had been committed and that Martin had no criminal intent, but sometimes you just don't have the luxury of having a couple of weeks of hindsight to analyze the situation and play out how things might turn out bad, with you on your back getting your face punched in for a minute with nobody coming to your assistance, and ultimately wind up shooting the guy that was pummeling you.

64 posted on 03/25/2012 10:09:41 AM PDT by Wissa (Gone Galt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

bump


65 posted on 03/25/2012 10:09:41 AM PDT by Ghengis
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: Tex-Con-Man

Apparently this 6’4” thug had Zimmerman on his back vulnerable beating him. I would say that is attempted murder. You assume tavnporn is innocent gone wild .
apparently you are the one judging by appearance.


66 posted on 03/25/2012 10:15:57 AM PDT by ChiMark (chewed up his body for a decade)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan
All of the evidence from the scene, and reported by the one eye witness, backs up Zimmerman's self defense claims. That is according to the police at the scene and the investigation.

Zimmerman had a gash in the back of his head. That supports his claim of being attacked from behind as he walked back to his car.

The eye witness said Zimmerman was on the ground screaming for help as the Yoot was on top of him beating him into the ground.

Zimmerman had a broken nose.

Self defense.

67 posted on 03/25/2012 10:18:03 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan

Was he just walking home or was he trespassing? I’ve heard both versions. Do we know which is correct?


68 posted on 03/25/2012 10:19:00 AM PDT by butterdezillion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: FR_addict
I believe it is a condo development, which could be gated, without implying great wealth.
69 posted on 03/25/2012 10:20:55 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Howard Morrison

Thanks for the post. Unfortunately MSM will not do their job. People are too quick to make final judgements based on the lame stream of the MSM. The guy was a neighborhood watchman, what’s wrong with that, and he’s keeping an eye on this kid who appeared suspicious. He notifies 9-11 of the suspicious character. Basically he was doing something that Homeland Security has been preaching to us all along. It’s understandable that he’s keeping an eye on the kid until the arrival of the PD.


70 posted on 03/25/2012 10:21:51 AM PDT by kenmcg (How)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: goseminoles
heh. You are right. I believe the police report had him at six feet even, Zimmerman somewhat shorter.
71 posted on 03/25/2012 10:23:17 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: butterdezillion

He was staying with his father and his father’s GF who lived in the complex.


72 posted on 03/25/2012 10:24:03 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 68 | View Replies]

To: hinckley buzzard

Is the police report available to the public?


73 posted on 03/25/2012 10:24:41 AM PDT by butterdezillion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan
What does seem pretty clear is that the ancient common law rule of “duty to retreat” had a good common sense basis behind it.

Could you educate us on that "ancient common law"? My understanding of historical conventions doesn't indicate much of a "duty to retreat".

74 posted on 03/25/2012 10:26:51 AM PDT by freeandfreezing
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: duckman
He was actually 6ft 4 and a football player, very awesome in appearance

________________________________

Really? How come the police report says he was 6'0" and his friends/family say he weighed 140? His nickname was Slimm.

And, at 17 I was 6'1 and weighed 145....and I played football.

75 posted on 03/25/2012 10:27:03 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Cicero
Sorry, Post #129 has been removed by the moderator. Presumably from one of those outfits that won’t allow photos to be linked here.

Removed because jerks keep posting pictures of gangstas who are not the Trayvon Martin who was killed.

The Moderator has laid down: Don't post pictures of a claimed Trayvon Martin without a live link to the original source.

76 posted on 03/25/2012 10:27:03 AM PDT by Oztrich Boy (This world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel - Horace Walpole)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: Alice in Wonderland

Please keep posting that picture.


77 posted on 03/25/2012 10:28:20 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: kenmcg
Unfortunately MSM will not do their job.

I guess that depends on how you define "doing their job".

If it is considered to be doing the typical drive-by thing, throw a rock at a hornet's nest and then move on to find other hornet's nests to stir up, they're doing an exceptionally GOOD job.

78 posted on 03/25/2012 10:28:28 AM PDT by Wissa (Gone Galt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies]

To: kabar

Post 51, bottom left, on this thread has the same photo.


79 posted on 03/25/2012 10:29:40 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: blueyon

If Zimmerman had a Muslim name and was an Islamist terrorist and if Trayvon was a young black Private First Class, President Obama would have told us to step back and NOT jump to conclusions. Alas, Zimmerman is a German-Jewish name and therefore, deserves to be lynched.


80 posted on 03/25/2012 10:30:28 AM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Tex-Con-Man

“There is zero evidence that Zimmerman prevented a potential crime, or that Martin had criminal intent.”

You could not be more wrong. There is strong evidence to believe that Martin attacked Zimmerman (criminal intent) and that Zimmerman prevented, not only a potential crime (Zimmerman’s murder), but an actual crime (Zimmerman’s beating).


81 posted on 03/25/2012 10:30:28 AM PDT by Lucas McCain (Santorum sucks)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: baddog 219
I tried to finsd an up to date photo of Martian but the net seems to be scrubbed already.

_____________________________

How hard did you try? Did you look at thugs-r-us? It took me all of one minute to find his FB page which, as of last night was still up.

And, why are you saying that the net was scrubbed of pictures...what proof do you have of that? How many pictures of any 17 year old would you expect to see?

82 posted on 03/25/2012 10:31:53 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: baddog 219
Oh, look --- his FB page is still up --- took me thirty seconds to find it again.

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=3456187782&topic=7335#!/profile.php?id=1353307542

83 posted on 03/25/2012 10:33:46 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 82 | View Replies]

To: ChiMark
Apparently this 6’4” thug had Zimmerman on his back vulnerable beating him. I would say that is attempted murder.

If you took your version of events before a court they wouldn't allow you to simply leave out the parts of the story you don't like. This has a beginning, a middle and an end...you skipped the beginning.

You assume tavnporn is innocent gone wild . apparently you are the one judging by appearance.

I assume no such thing. But nor do I assume Zimmerman couldn't have handled things better resulting in a less tragic outcome for all involved.

84 posted on 03/25/2012 10:34:39 AM PDT by Tex-Con-Man (T. Coddington Van Voorhees VII 2012 - "Together, I Shall Ride You To Victory")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: Lucas McCain; Tex-Con-Man
There is strong evidence to believe that Martin attacked Zimmerman (criminal intent) and that Zimmerman prevented, not only a potential crime (Zimmerman’s murder), but an actual crime (Zimmerman’s beating).

____________________________________

Well, if there is strong evidence then it should be really easy for you ti provide a link to it.....why don't you?

85 posted on 03/25/2012 10:35:50 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: Beagle8U

WOW. What a difference.


86 posted on 03/25/2012 10:36:19 AM PDT by kabar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: Tex-Con-Man
But so far, it seems Zimmerman could have simply phoned it in and left it alone.

You are right. But "leaving it alone" has its costs to society too. After all why not just really "leave it alone" and ignore the woman screaming from the shrubs, or turn up the game on the TV when you hear gunshots outside. And no need to waste time, just tell the police officers you really didn't see or hear anything when they show up to investigate the body in the street.

There are neighborhoods where the residents "leave it alone" all the time. I doubt you would want to live in one.

Oh, and there is zero evidence that every mistake made by law enforcement officers prevents a potential crime either. I presume you wouldn't use that as a basis to recommend that law enforcement officers just "leave it alone" when they see something that is to them suspicious.

87 posted on 03/25/2012 10:40:48 AM PDT by freeandfreezing
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: kabar

Yes, hardly the child the media is showing.


88 posted on 03/25/2012 10:47:26 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: Lucas McCain
You're selectively editing the entire series of events to leave out what led up to the fight...a significant part of the big picture. And if one is interested in the truth, you can't ignore the parts you don't like.
89 posted on 03/25/2012 10:50:37 AM PDT by Tex-Con-Man (T. Coddington Van Voorhees VII 2012 - "Together, I Shall Ride You To Victory")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: Beagle8U
Well. "Duty to retreat" is not very "ancient" and it has never been consistent. Some states have it and some don't and it varies a lot according to circumstances. The idea that you must flee if you can is more typical of post-modern Britain than the US.
90 posted on 03/25/2012 10:50:50 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: hinckley buzzard
Well, Zimmerman didn't have the option to retreat when he shot the Yoot, he was on his back getting his face smashed in, according to the eye witness that saw it.
91 posted on 03/25/2012 10:55:12 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: kabar; Beagle8U
The picture that impressed you was pulled by mods because it is not of the Trayvon Martin who was killed.

A few freepers have been knowingly re-posting it (and others). Your guess as to their motive is as good as mine.

92 posted on 03/25/2012 10:56:36 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: freeandfreezing
Your missing the distinction I'm making.

Had Martin done any of those things you described, there would be no issue whatsoever. I would go even further and say that if it turns out Zimmerman saw Martin looking into parked cars or checking into people's backyards, then he would be completely justified in following Martin. But again, so far, there doesn't seem to be evidence of actual "suspicious activity" to warrant Zimmerman's decision to pursue Martin.

You are right. But "leaving it alone" has its costs to society too.

...as do poor decisions...and look what this one has turned into. Sharpton couldn't be happier.

93 posted on 03/25/2012 11:00:16 AM PDT by Tex-Con-Man (T. Coddington Van Voorhees VII 2012 - "Together, I Shall Ride You To Victory")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 87 | View Replies]

To: wtc911

Does the same hold true of the pictures of Zimmerman or is that another George Zimmerman?


94 posted on 03/25/2012 11:03:24 AM PDT by kabar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: wtc911
Here is the side by side pictures posted by ABC News:

Is this a picture of 17 year old Martin? Do you have a picture of the 17 year old Martin? Do you have any guess as to what ABC's movtive is to post this photo?

The initial impression for me is of a young child being killed by some guy who is pictured in what could be an orange jump suit that you usually associate with being in prison.

95 posted on 03/25/2012 11:14:06 AM PDT by kabar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: kabar

What does that have to do with knowingly posting false pictures?


96 posted on 03/25/2012 11:18:28 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 95 | View Replies]

To: kabar
Does the same hold true of the pictures of Zimmerman or is that another George Zimmerman?

_____________________________________

You posted the pictures -- you tell me.

97 posted on 03/25/2012 11:19:43 AM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 94 | View Replies]

To: Sherman Logan

“However, that Zimmerman may have been losing the fight does not in and of itself mean he did not also start the fight.”

True. However, even if, big IF, he did start the fight there is no requirement that after starting a fight and in mortal danger that one is required to lay down and let someone kill you.
:)


98 posted on 03/25/2012 11:28:48 AM PDT by BilLies (Ass.Press ABCBSNBCNN, NYTimes, WaPOSt , etc., hate your Traditional American guts!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: wtc911

There are links all over FR and elsewhere. Video of witness, police report, etc. If you’re too stupid to see them, I can’t help you.


99 posted on 03/25/2012 11:35:37 AM PDT by Lucas McCain (Santorum sucks)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies]

To: Howard Morrison

There’s a picture of him in his hoodie at Riehl World View which came from the Miami Herald, I think. Not the 13-yr old boy one; this hadn’t been photo-shopped yet.


100 posted on 03/25/2012 11:36:46 AM PDT by winkadink (During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. George Orwell)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-132 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson