[Frumanchu]

"The LORD is patient, not willing that ANY should perish, but "EVERYONE" to come to repentence." 2 Peter 3:9b. If God "chose" who will be saved and will "not be saved" "Sovereignly, then why did Jesus tell his disciples to "Go into all the world, and preach the gospel to EVERY CREATURE, teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you, baptizing them in the name of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Ghost"?

Let me turn that around on you. If God is, as you put forth, not willing that any individual person should perish, but that every individual person should come to repentence, then how do you explain Christ's words in Matthew 11:

"At that time Jesus answered and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and have revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight. All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him." Matt 11:25-27

Or the fact that Jesus deliberately spoke in parables to prevent men from coming to repentance:

"And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them." -Mark 4:11-12

Going back to Matthew 11, just prior to thanking the Father for hiding such things from men, Christ revealed that repentance and salvation was possible for Tyre, Sidon, and Sodom...and yet the miracles which would have brought about such repentance were withheld from them:

"Then began he to upbraid the cities wherein most of his mighty works were done, because they repented not: Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works, which were done in you, had been done in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. But I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the day of judgment, than for you. And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day. But I say unto you, That it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for thee." -Matthew 11:20-24

Is there disunity among the Godhead? Are the First and Second Persons of the Trinity in disagreement over desire, intent and purpose? How do you explain such contradictions, webber?

[CCWoody]

Is there disunity among the Godhead? Are the First and Second Persons of the Trinity in disagreement over desire, intent and purpose? How do you explain such contradictions, webber? ~ Frumanchu

Yes, that is exactly what the thoughtless Arminian is doing. He is actually setting the Persons of the Godhead to war with each other. Otherwise, how can you explain the Arminian's contention that God the Father has purposed the salvation of all men everywhere without any exception and the Holy Spirit is out there working His tail off to reconcile the whole world to God while the Son was intentionally speaking in parables to prevent people from repenting of their sins.


"And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them." -Mark 4:11-12

The thoughless Arminian is actually denying the ontological NAME of God. Whereas God has declared to us "I am that I am," meaning that "I am what I have been" and "I will be what I am," the Arminian is declaring that God is not even faithful to Himself. This is a fundamental denial of the Most High Himself. It's like saying, "Well, the Father is faithful and true to the Godhead and the Holy Spirit is faithful and true to the Godhead, but that bratty Son is just out there thwarting the will of God."

It is, in effect to count Him neither faithful nor true. One wonders, then, where the Arminian find the assurance that He is faithful to His own delcared nature "I am that I am." Obviously, he can't find it in the promises of the Son.

Woody.

[webber]

I noticed that you pick and choose which portions of Matthew 11:25 you decided to leave out. So let's let everyone see what ALL of Matthew 11:25 says and include not only verses 26, 27, but ALSO VERSE 28.

Matt 11:25 BEGINS WITH: "At that time Jesus answered and said, "I thank Thee, O Father, LORD of Heaven and Earth, because Thou has hid these things from the WISE and PRUDENT, and hast REVEALED them unto BABES."

vs 26 - "Even so, Father: For so it seemed GOOD in Thy sight.

Now let's quote verse 28 which you so conveniently decided to leave out: vs 28 - "Come unto me ALL YE THAT LABOUR AND ARE HEAVE LADEN, (Noticed Jesus said "ALL"), and I will give you rest. In Verses 29-30 Jesus is still addressing the "ALL". He says: vs 29 - Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. (The word for "Rest" in the original Greek is "`anapausis" which the same word that Jesus used when He told the Pharisees and Sadducees of His time that they will never enter into His Rest) Which meant they would never find salvation.

You still haven't answered who the terms "World" and "Whosoever" used in John 3:16 & 17. Why have you "predestinationalists" chosen not to anwer me on these verses? Does it make you feel uncomfortable? And Please, if you're not going to answer me about these verses, don't bother replying at all. By your editing out verses which do not support your "Blasphemous" viewpoint, you have already shown to me that you are nothing but a "Cult"!!