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To: DallasMike; ninenot
I have gone through the files and find that many,including myself,have asked for scriptural support from those of you who insist that celibacy is wrong or abnormal or not scripturally based. You all come up with the same three or four passages,all from Paul,that if read as you read them,could support your contention.

I reject your argument that Peter's mother-in-law proves he was married at the time he was selected. Other than that the Four Gospels contain nothing to support that any of the Apostles were married.

The cites from Paul have been explained to you as very likely to have been mistranslated.The word which you see as wife is actually "woman" in one case and "sister" in another. I am not going over it again.

If you wish to believe that one fairly clear direction on the bishops and three hazy and subject to other interpretation citations,supercede at least twenty examples(words or actions)showing otherwise,go ahead. The state this country is in today makes me think it doesn't much matter.

I believe the education system and the media have so animalized Americans that they are incapable of thinking or right reason let alone understanding revelation.Certainly,it is in the best interest of those wishing to perpetuate and extend this "animalizaation" of America to deny that anyone,including Jesus Christ Himself could live without sex. And of course it would be good to even erase the memory of a group who through the centuries tried to live like Christ in order to bring God's creatures back home to Him,Who made us all in His image.

Please eexcuse me for taking my bad humor out on you today. Last night I went to a musical called "Menopause the Musical". It started out with kind of a litany of the complaints and symptoms so many of us menopausal females have. The hot flashes,forgetfulness,loss of appeal,need to get to the bathroom post-haste,facelifts,depressions and on and on.The songs were all Golden oldie-types with new words and until a little after the middle,quite clever and enjoyable.

So I was sitting there,thinking that it wasn't worth the thirty-six dollars but it was light hearted and not bad. Besides that was what my friends wanted to do. All of the sudden I saw the tempo change in anticipation of the discovery that was to change the lives of the four characters. You may have guessed it,they got turned on by their own personal vibrator or toy. Please know there was nothing but suggestive words and dancing and gyratiions,nothing explicit. But the audience response was like a tent revival. People (old bags) screaming and laughing and swaying and I just was overwhelmed with the saddest feeling.Here I was,in the middle of about 500 mothers and grandmothers and 50 men,screeching and chortling over women and vibrators.Oh,lest I forget,they all turned into older but seductive,glamorous women.

Reflecting on that experience last night I came to some conclusions.If we of this age are going to convert the world to Christ, it will take something as powerful as an army of celibate,chaste priests,giving up everything to follow Christ,offering up their everything to convince the world that there is another Way that brings us to Truth and that leads to Life,everlasting.

374 posted on 06/30/2003 4:41:28 PM PDT by saradippity
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To: RobbyS
You might be interested in my response to Dallas Mike above. I was really disheartened at the response of the women.
375 posted on 06/30/2003 4:48:36 PM PDT by saradippity
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To: saradippity
I have gone through the files and find that many,including myself,have asked for scriptural support from those of you who insist that celibacy is wrong or abnormal or not scripturally based. You all come up with the same three or four passages,all from Paul,that if read as you read them,could support your contention.
Well, you know, that's three or four passages more than you provided me supporting your position that celibacy should be required of priests. I also asked you for the citation of such a Tradition and you couldn't provide it.

As for the issue at hand, how much clearer do you get than this:

Therefore, a bishop must be irreproachable, married only once ... 1 Timothy 3:2 (New American Bible)
It's plain on the face of it that the scripture permits clergy to be married. There's not a whole lot of room for mistranslation or misinterpretation.

Further, you do little but complain that those of us who quote scripture are somehow wrong for providing rational, Biblically-based arguments that go against your belief system. The problem is that your belief system doesn't stand up very well to Biblical scrutiny.

The cites from Paul have been explained to you as very likely to have been mistranslated.The word which you see as wife is actually "woman" in one case and "sister" in another. I am not going over it again.
My quotations were all from (and often hyperlinked to) the New American Bible on the site hosted by the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. Do you know better than the group of 50 scholars the bishops assembled to provide an accurate translation? You shouldn't be complaining about me, but the bishops.

Further, the cite that you complain as "very likely to have been mistranslated" happens to agree with the passage in 1 Timothy that I quoted above and happens to agree with the passage referring to Peter's mother-in-law (note: not former mother-in-law).

If I've made you mad enough, then perhaps you'll be like the Bereans, whom Paul praised for searching the scriptures to see if what he wrote them was true. Maybe you'll think for yourself, too. That would be nice. Step out of the darkness of superstition and into the light of a Biblically-based relationship with God.


377 posted on 06/30/2003 5:49:44 PM PDT by DallasMike
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To: saradippity
If we of this age are going to convert the world to Christ, it will take something as powerful as an army of celibate,chaste priests,giving up everything to follow Christ,offering up their everything to convince the world that there is another Way that brings us to Truth and that leads to Life,everlasting.

If they're all your and my age, celibacy will be no problem.

387 posted on 06/30/2003 7:34:40 PM PDT by sinkspur
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To: saradippity
Certainly,it is in the best interest of those wishing to perpetuate and extend this "animalizaation" of America to deny that anyone,including Jesus Christ Himself could live without sex.

It's not just about sex. If somebody has to have sex, he can find that, in the phone book of any major city.

Marriage is much more about companionship, a bond between a man and woman that makes the two, one, and makes them both stronger. Hell, the older we get, the less sex there is (no surprise, huh!)

But, I travel, and I can't stand to be away from home for more than three days. I miss my girl, and, after 26 years and two grown kids, I want to be around her more than ever.

Just being in her presence brings me immense joy.

I'm sorry any priest has to give that up. I really am. He deserves heaven, just for denying himself that.

388 posted on 06/30/2003 7:44:03 PM PDT by sinkspur
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To: saradippity
If you're down on masturbation, that's your decision, but don't knock it. Old hags enjoy orgasms, too. Just don't think impure thoughts while you're doing it and you should be fine. ;^)
464 posted on 07/01/2003 11:55:43 AM PDT by CobaltBlue
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