Are Your Kids Safe In A Catholic College?

CRISIS Magazine - e-Letter ^ | Deal hudson

[Dajjal]

Canons 1369 and 1373 bump

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Liberal Arts curricula are a waste of time and a waste of resources. You can see the results of the "intellectual rigor" of that form of Socratic Method every time there is a protest, and some snotnosed 20 year old says that it is a duty to mindlessly question every governmental action and societal standard.

I always thought that the goal of higher education was to train people to become productive members of society, and to give them the requisite tools to further their lives and communities.

In other words, the only purposes served by most departments in Liberal Arts is the indoctrination of students in leftist thought, and to provide jobs to professors of that intellectual bent (because they're incapable of doing any job here in the real world).

[Desdemona]

Why is a BA necessary to be successful in business?

Because people think more of a name brand than actual ability. One of the rewards of successful marketing.

One of the biggest mistakes made in this country was scrapping the concept of apprenticeship. Hands on experience trumps classroom education in many fields - many we need. You usually pick up the same info you'd learn in a classroom as you go along. Even my brothers, the engineers, will tell you that the classroom was one thing, actually doing the work was something else.

My own field is no different (although, actual practicality is questionable). There are a lot of people out there running around with university degrees in vocal performance and have atrocious technique.

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

HEy, we have something we can agree on. This s a very good post:)

Becky

[Desdemona]

Thank you. While I'm all for hands-on experience and apprenticeship, I also believe that actual knowledge of basics (that which USED to be taught in HS and a true university education) is essential. A basic classical education. Just the grammar errors alone in PhD candidates is enough to make my stomach turn.

[Aquinasfan]

One of the biggest mistakes made in this country was scrapping the concept of apprenticeship.

Yep. The strange thing is that just about everyone I talk to recognizes the fact that a college degree isn't worth much, yet the same people will say, "but you have to have one." There doesn't seem to be a way to push through this. At least I haven't found a way.

[Desdemona]

The strange thing is that just about everyone I talk to recognizes the fact that a college degree isn't worth much, yet the same people will say, "but you have to have one."

I know. I have a B.S., not in music, and it does NOT really stand for bachelor of science.

Some of the great business successes out there never graduated college. But they also worked for themselves. And usually in new fields.

[ThomasMore]

My youngest will be graduating from Steubie this May. It has been a great Alma Mater (nurturing mother)! We have had over a dozen from my home town in R.I. graduate from there. Great formation and excellent education.

[ThomasMore]

I have personally talked with people at the university who are appalled at some of the charismatic activities such as Saturday evening pseudo Masses involving breaking of bread in the dorm rooms.

There are a few trads there who do not like the "Lord's Day" celebration. But that does not make the "prayer service" a pseudo Mass. Nor is the intent of this celebration to replace the Mass in any sense of the word. Your implications are pejorative and erroneous. Unless, of course, one sees promoting praise and prayer as incompatible with the faith. I mean, God forbid, our kids join a group that not only nurtures the love of God, but also the love of neighbor. Yes, God forbid, these households foster a spiritual life that leads to the spiritual and corporal works of mercy.

Households at Franciscan University are what fraternities and sororities SHOULD be but aren't!

[Maximilian]

But that does not make the "prayer service" a pseudo Mass.

I am reporting what I was told by people who live in Steubenville, but are sending their child to Thomas Aquinas College in California. Do they or do they not have "breaking of the bread" in the dorms on Saturday night?

[azcoyote]

I recently started attending the Franciscan University of Steubenville this fall. I read this thread before I left, and now I happened to find it again on coming back to my home, and I feel that I should clear up the issue of the "pseudo-mass".

The celebration is called a "Lord's Day" and it is done by each Household on campus. Households are official clubs recognized by the university. they started out as natural, unofficial clubs, but then the university realized their potential for spiritual development and made them an official part of campus life.

Joining a household is totally optional, but many do. Households are either all men or all ladies, never coed, and they each have their own character. There are two things that make up a household: Their covenant, and their commitments. A covenant is like a constitution, a statement of the household's purpose and dedication. Many households are dedicated to our Blessed Mother, for example. A commitment is a meeting that members are required to attend; thus, commitments are how household members live our their covenant.

Some households have many more commitments than others. Some are more spiritual than others. For example, the Disciples of the Word have for their commitments a rosary on Tuesday, Bible study on Thursday, Lord's Day celebration, a morning prayer, nightly accountability meetings, and each member must attend daily Mass. They have a lot of commitments. I think the Brothers of the Eternal Song have less; they have a group breakfast on Friday, I think daily Mass on a certain day, Lord's Day, divine mercy chaplet I think daily, and a walking rosary like once a week.

People are often identified by their household, because a household is a group that you hang out with too. Each household has its own wing in a certain dorm; the Brothers of the Eternal Song have the east wing of first floor Francis, Servants of the Savior has west wing, Lion of Judah has east wing of 2nd floor Francis, and so on. Not everyone in the household lives on the household wing, but a substantial number do. But households are not exclusive; they are generally open and inviting, and they also do things with other households. Apart from their commitments they also have optional hang outs; the Disciples, for example, have Praise and Worship on Saturday, and movie night on Friday, and once in a while bowling night on Wednesday.

So why join a household? Well, I think this point is best emphasized by my friends, the Disciples of the Word. They are a new household just being created. We all started out as friends, but then my friends started meeting on Thursdays and they felt a calling to be a household. So they prayed a lot, and visited other households, and eventually it became clear that they would become their own household.

But before they wanted to be an official household they were set on being an accountability group. What they did is they helped each other to grow closer to Christ, by being there for each other, listening to each other, and correcting each other away from sin. By the time they became a household, they had a commitment of an evening accountability meeting. This means that every evening they meet in our common room and discuss the day. They discuss how they served God that day, how they failed to serve Him, how they could improve, and so on. It's a circle of trust, and they share intimate thoughts that are for themselves alone. They build each other up in the Lord; I mean, they help to point each other in the right direction.

Their covenant as a household focuses on scripture. Thus they are called The Disciples of the Word. Jesse, the appointed leader, especially has a great love for God's Word, and so their original Thursday night meeting became a Bible study. Each member is responsible for reading a certain amount each week, and then they discuss it at the Bible study. A different person each time leads the study in a seminar fashion. Any guy, member or not, is welcome at the Bible study.

Then also they're friends. I'm their friend too, and we hag out a lot. Next semester most of them are moving into one wing, stub wing, so it will become Disciples wing. We hang out a lot and support each other.

So this is the purpose of households: To grow closer to the Lord. The Disciples accountability meeting, their commitments, their Bible study, all of these are aimed at getting closer to God. St. Jerome said, "Ignorance of scripture is ignorance of Christ." Thus the aim of the Disciples is to remove that ignorance. They are a good community. These days people suffer from peer pressure, leading them to sin; you won't find that in the Disciples--if anything, their example leads people away from sin.

So what about the Lord's Day? Well, the Lord's Day is a common celebration. Each of the households have it, and the Disciples just had their first one on the eve of the Second Sunday of Advent. Yes, it does involve the breaking of bread and passing of a cup of wine. No, it does not mean to replace the Mass; that would be stupid.

I cannot tell you where the Lord's Day first came from, but it's been there for some time. The idea behind it is the fellowship of a table and a common cup. The bread and cup are never said to represent the Lord in any way, but merely thanksgiving and petition. I helped design the Disciples' Lord's Day, and we made certain that we did not use any false words in our prayers. The bread and the cup are not the Body and Blood of Our Lord, nor do we take them for it, but the bread is broken and passed around, and as each person eats of it he offers a prayer of thanksgiving. Then the cup is passed around as as each person receives it, a petition to the Lord is proposed. I do not drink of the cup because of my own commitment never to drink; which is totally accepted, it's optional to eat, and my prayers are still accepted.

Also at the Lord's Day we read and discuss the readings for tomorrow's Mass, so that we'll be prepared for them. Apart from that, there is no other similarity to the Mass. There is no procession or any priestly jobs. There is no claim that it is a Mass. And NOBODY AT ALL EVER goes to Lord's Day in place of Mass. The Sunday Masses at Steubenville are filled with people, more than are at the Lord's Day celebrations the day before.

Ah, Steubenville is awesome! After being there I can say my faith in Christ has been greatly improved, and I've learned so much. All of the teachers take an oath to the magisterium of the Church to teach the true doctrine. My Theology 101 class, for example, has taught me tons, especially because I happened to get the best and most difficult teacher. We learned about the Trinity and the Christological Controversy. We read original documents written by the Fathers of the Church, including St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Leo the Great, and more. We even read the exchanges between Cyril and Nestorius, and the "definition" given by the Council of Chalcedon, which concluded the bulk of the Christological debate.

In my Franciscan Studies class, I learned so much about St. Francis, St. Bonaventure, St. Clare, and I was so inspired by it all.

But there are many majors at Franciscan besides just Theology. Many people go there for Education, Nursing, Mental Health, etc. They have great teachers, and they never have to fear taking a class because of a professor attacking the faith (I went to a community college and just taking a sociology class I found myself arguing with the teacher and defending the faith often). There's hardly anyone at Steubenville who isn't Catholic.

Just the atmosphere is wonderful. People say hi to you everywhere whether they know you or not. It's safe, friendly, and welcoming. There is no place quite like Steubenville. It's kind of funny actually how just walking around campus you hear people having conversations about the Magisterium of the Church, Christology, the teachings of St. Thomas Aquinas, why abortion is so wrong, who is being executed that day and needs prayers, and so on.

There are tons of optional ministries that many people volunteer for. There's homeless ministry, abortion clinic Ministry, retreat ministry, etc. There is a spirit of charity there, of hearts on fire for Christ, of people wanting truth and sacramental life.

If you don't like Vatican II, you won't like Steubenville. They have Latin Mass like once a month or so, not too often. But to say Vatican II is wrong is to say the Church itself is wrong, because the bishops met at a conference to decide Vatican II led by the Holy Spirit, just as the bishops decided which books would be in the New Testament, and what the Creed of Nicea would be, and so on. I trust in the Church, and I know that Steubenville shows just the kind of spirit that the Pope wants. And more importantly, I know that God loves the place as a holy land, because I know that God loves me, and He brought me there for a reason.

Since I've been there I've gotten so much more into my faith. I was into it before, but I was at a standstill it seemed. But I am so supported in my faith there. I try to go to daily Mass and say a rosary every day. Especially on Mondays I say a rosary with a bunch of my friends (mostly girls), and Tuesday I say one with the Disciples of the Word and whoever else comes (mostly guys).

I can't speak for other universities, because I've never been there. But I can say that Steubenville is not only a safe place to send your kids, but a place where, if they are open, they can grow in faith and charity and knowledge of God. Of course, it is up to your children to grow; no place will make them a better or worse person unless they allow it. Not every single person in Steubenville is geared toward Christ, but an overwhelming majority is, and there is so much opportunity to seek the Lord that each of the years you are there is precious.

If you want more information on the university, you can email me from my web site: www.azcoyote.com
I intend to add a page to my site all about Steubenville, eventually, when I have the time.
I hope this post helps you all. God bless you and be with you and your children!

~Michael Anthony Abril

[fortunecookie]

Some friends of ours sent their oldest to Fairfield in CT. They now tell everyone they know NOT to send their kids to Catholic colleges unless they want them to lose their faith. Their son refuses to even go to Mass with them anymore. I have another friend who attended St. Bonaventure (ironically at the same time as the couple mentioned above) She took a major in Theology, but in the process totally lost her Catholic Faith, and that was 30 years ago!!

I was about to post when your post caught my eye!! I graduated from St. Bonas a generation ago. I would not recommend it. Most of my Catholic friends (from college) aren't Catholic anymore, or if they are, it's only in a women-goddess-priest kind of way. Ugh. I found my faith seriously tested as well.

Because of the relatively short distance from where I now live (PA), many of our local Catholic school teachers go there for 'further' education. And come back devoid of their previous fervent faith. My son's (former) high school math teacher is a perfect example. He left the school abruptly in the first semester, leaving stunned math students. He was exceptionally good at teaching math. A double loss. Also, the former priest-teacher at his school left teaching and the priesthood in one fell swoop.

And not to pick on just Bonas, what is it with Catholic colleges? Totally hijacked, it would seem, by the same leftist agenda that characterizes so many institutions of higher education. I knew Bonas was in trouble when they 'let go' many tenured male profs, some very good ones in their prime, about a decade ago to adhere to 'fair hiring' practices. No longer judged by ability, just ability to fill a quota.

My post was originally going to be about my own experience in my freshman year. My very first 'theology' class started thusly: The professor announced to a packed room (mandatory class, about 40 of us) that he was going to challenge us to expand our horizons and teach us 'new' findings in Catholicism, things that would 'fly in the face' of what we learned as mere children. Hence the smear, now that we were 'grown up' we would see his point, right? - otherwise we would appear to all the class and him to be childish or unreasonable. In this first class, he told us how Jesus sinned and had a 'close relationship' (read: affair) with Mary Magdalene and had brothers and sisters. And, most importantly, how Jesus came not for some nicey salvation thing but to establish social justice here on earth. Gag.

Then he asked who found that hard to accept or disagreed. Four of us raised our hands. Granted, some just didn't care, but only 4. We were told disagreeing with him was not allowed and would prevent us from getting an A or even a B in the class. We were warned not to complain, all the profs taught this way and he would find out. He asked us if we still disagreed and we raised our hands. One guy argued with him. He told us we were a hindrance to the learning of the class. The guy who argued left, the other 3 of us stayed, of which I am not proud. I should have left. But you can see how he took advantage of new college freshmen, many away from home for the first time (at least to this extent) and we wanted to respect his authority. Oh well.

Sorry so long. I could go on. It only went down hill from there.

[fortunecookie]

This is outrageous. What’s it’s the point of having Catholic colleges if these are the results? They’re shooting us in the foot (and heart and head for that matter).

It appears that on so many levels, our Church has been infiltrated by those who which to destroy it.

It is outrageous. That's the point exactly! Anyone who's met these types, the destroyers, knows what I mean. They know they can't change the 'old' people (that's what a scandalous priest told our parish from the pulpit) or the people of faith, so they target the children. For a decade our parish had a 'children's' mass rule. No bells at consecration, hands held at the Our Father, no rosary or adoration, standing around the altar at consecration, etc.. Now that generation thinks this is the norm, and the 'old-fashioned' ways are wierd. They no longer have this mass, but the confusion remains, because the other masses at our parish are not held this way, and it's not lost on the kids.

They don't think they are shooting the Church in the foot, but changing it for the future in a good way, like they have their own messianic mission, since they have a new and unique interpretation of 'church' (oh, you couldn't possibly understand, they croon, if you disagree...) and they gleefully lead many astray. But don't dare disagree with them, they have a nasty side that shows no restraint. And personal attacks in public send a message.

[Barnacle]

...and they gleefully lead many astray.

[fortunecookie]

Excellent!! I shall save this!

Brings to mind a song. Imagine music..

Hey, come on, babe, Follow me

I'm the Pied Piper, Follow me

I'm the Pied Piper

And I'll show you where it's at

Come on, babe, Can't you see

I'm the Pied Piper, Trust in me

I'm the Pied Piper, And I'll show you where it's at

(Crispian St. Peters, 1960's?)

[fortunecookie]

* After four years at a Catholic college, student support for abortion increased from 46.3 percent to 60.1 percent, a sharper increase than among students at private colleges (51 percent to 62.2 percent).

This is so sad. And is true at our local CINO High School. Many students are 'pro-choice' coming out, even those involved in jr high pro-life clubs or at least pro-life going in.

I remember a sad conversation with my neighbor at the time of the last presidential election. He turned 18 just in time to vote. He proudly told me how he was happy to be able to cast a vote for Gore because Gore was pro-choice and didn't force his views on anyone, he, at least, allowed women to make their own choices about their bodies. I'd known his family and him since he was quite young, and knew he had done a 180 degree turn on this matter. He then tried to persuade me of the correctness of his choice and wrongness (his words) of mine because of and using arguments he learned and they discussed and had support for in their theology class (on morals!!) and his world cultures class with full support of the teachers who urged them to vote Democrat and support womens rights during classtime at the local Catholic high school. I did voice a complaint, big deal though.