[ninenot]

Someone mentioned that the ideas that bred modernism (separation of God from life on earth) orginated in the late 19th century. Without supporting documents, but some factual evidence...why not the late 18th when communism was cooked up on a college campus? It just took a while for the ideas to take root.

Actually, the "watchmaker God" idea has been around for quite a while longer than the 18th Century--that's merely when the Masons picked it up.

The refutation was in the OT--wherein the Jews recognized God as "immanent," that is, active in the world's affairs (albeit in His own way, at His own time.) BTW, I know you are using shorthand---but Vatican II was NOT the cause of all this sturm und drang. The IMPLEMENTATION of Vatican II (or, to put it more precisely, the loosing of the Modernists upon the Faithful) was the cause. VII was just a convenient excuse, and had a few poorly-written documents, which gave the opportunity to those who would take it.

And they did, and how...

[Desdemona]

The IMPLEMENTATION of Vatican II (or, to put it more precisely, the loosing of the Modernists upon the Faithful) was the cause. VII was just a convenient excuse, and had a few poorly-written documents, which gave the opportunity to those who would take it.

Yes, I know, as you and I lamented in the past re music, if nothing else. It's amazing the people who refuse to grow beyond what Oregon Catholic Press publishes.

Oh, the crap I suffered through this morning.... Maybe I just out grew it? One whiff of late Baroque and forget guitars.