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To: RnMomof7
thats what free will means..FREE of ALL intervention).If God REALLY wants all men without exception saved he is doing a poor job wouldn't you say? He is really quite hapless it seems.

Actually, "free will," properly, means simply that we desire what we desire. Free agency doesn't mean "free of all intervention," it is free from being necessitated to act by any outside source.

Many words in the post to try to cover up the fact you have the nerve to say God interfering makes men puppets EXCEPT if He is doing YOUR will then it is a gracious intervention..Bologna...you want it both ways..get consistant and stop those prayers NOW .Your prayer is simply your attempt to manipulate God and the will of others..

No, God "interfering" only makes men puppets if God "effects" changes; God influencing men does not make them puppets.

49 posted on 11/21/2002 7:04:36 AM PST by The Grammarian
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To: The Grammarian
thats what free will means..FREE of ALL intervention).If God REALLY wants all men without exception saved he is doing a poor job wouldn't you say? He is really quite hapless it seems.
Actually, "free will," properly, means simply that we desire what we desire. Free agency doesn't mean "free of all intervention," it is free from being necessitated to act by any outside source.

So you use free agency as a different discriptuon than free will?

When I said before that our free will was shaped by our preferences ..you had a fit..Yet here you seem to be saying the same thing.

So free agency CAN be interfered with that is OK?..So If God changed our preferences so that our will would be to Him ...and then He acted as an outside force on our free agency ,that would be OK with you?

Many words in the post to try to cover up the fact you have the nerve to say God interfering makes men puppets EXCEPT if He is doing YOUR will then it is a gracious intervention..Bologna...you want it both ways..get consistant and stop those prayers NOW .Your prayer is simply your attempt to manipulate God and the will of others..
No, God "interfering" only makes men puppets if God "effects" changes; God influencing men does not make them puppets.

So you believe that your prayer is meaningless because even if God hears it and responds He is hapless to make it effective? Why do you pray again?

52 posted on 11/21/2002 10:01:44 AM PST by RnMomof7
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