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To: BibChr
You delight in talking about yourself. The men you cite were bound to speak the Word of God.

I guess I don't read it that way at all.

1) Do you REALLY think I would be MORE of an expert; write MORE authentically; be MORE accurate about The Word OR one's experiences with The Word or with Almighty God IF I was writing about someone else? The logic of that escapes me.

2) I haven't observed you folk speaking much about The Word that I know and Love. I've observed you speaking tons about your BIASES and PRECONCEIVED NOTIONS ABOUT The Word. IF you don't know the difference, I'm afraid I have little capacity to enlighten you without ears to hear.

You dismiss fidelity to the Word as "legalism."

3) NOT AT ALL. I dismiss seemingly mindless, blind, emotional addiction to bias ABOUT the Word as legalism.

The men you cite embraced it as living revelation of the living God.

4) I'm not sure who you are talking about with "men [I] cite. If you are talking about you folk, I have no observations that confirm your statement and many that disconfirm it. I have more of a picture of God trying to get your attention and talk to you and you saying--"Go away God, I don't want to be bothered, I have to read your book."

5) I have much more strongly a picture of folk who are ?afraid? too ?insecure? to face God one on one and prefer to pretend to relate to Him by endless unspiritual intellectual buttressing of their biases ABOUT His Word rather than apply His Word in a Living, Walking, Talking Dialogue and dance with THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE.

You seem simply to like talking.

6) Sometimes. This sort of thing, HOWEVER, is far too tedious for my preferences. I see it more as a duty to the authenticity of God's presentation of Himself to me as well as to the sort of Relationship I'm convinced Christ died for.

Those men were all about talking God's Word.

7) REALLLLLLLLLY????? You could have fooled me. I remain convinced that you folk are obsessed with/addicted to hiding behind printed words on a page rather than applying them in a dynamic one on one relationship with THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE.

8) As I was prayerfully pondering such and trying to sort out why . . . it seemed as though Father broke into my prayerful pondering and noted that you (BibChr) at least--I believe it was you--you are the one who used to be Charismatic, right--right--I scanned above--you were.

9) I heard the still small voice of The Lord note that you left Charismania NOT because of theology but because of relationship problems and emotions about those problems. The theology became a rationalization for a move that you found much "safer" and easier, more comfortable to navigate, to CONTROL.

10) I asked Father if He would show that to you and I believe He will. I don't know when. And I don't know how much you will have ears to hear. But God will do His part to give you added opportunities to have a closer, more intense relationship with Him. I suspect, though that you know exactly what I'm talking about as you read these words--especially if you are honest with yourself and God. If my hearing is correct, I suspect God will give you relatively little rest until you say uncle to Him at a deeper, broader level yet again.

11)It's a phenomenon I've observed before. Printed words on a page are infinitely easier to manipulate and force into our own comfort zones than a moment by moment dialogue with The Father or with THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE.

12) When we walk in dynamic ongoing dialogue with our Maker, He persistently has this tendency to ask us to step out of the boat and walk on the water with Him. That slices right across most of our comfort zones. He also slices to the core of our affronteries to His Lordship. He gently but persistently and often enough forcefully insists that we surrender absolutely everything to Him--even our pet doctrines about Him--even our pet doctrines about His written Word.

13) Most of us don't enjoy feeling intensely in our bone marrow's overly often WOE IS ME, I AM A MAN OF UNCLEAN LIPS . . . and nothing good. None of us enjoy long dark nights of the soul and wilderness experiences God tends to schedule for those who REALLLLLLY want an intimate relationship with Him even "merely" emotionally "face to face."

14) Most of us like to be in charge of our own ship--and being in charge of our own doctrine ship is a great "God sanctioned [we tell ourselves]" way to do it. We can trot merrily off adding layers of intellectualized rationalizations with endless chapters and verses to back them up--just like the pharisees.

15) And when WE [none of US are inherently immune], when WE do so . . . God still has a habit of calling us whited sepulchers.

16) The pharisees were artists with the written text. They had it memorized. They virtually ate it, slept with it, regurgitated it endlessly . . . and remained largely untouched by it. I've been there, done that--got a container full of the T-shirts. It's not a way to go if one is trying to choose LIFE.

17) Most any of us with half our brains functioning can trot out endless lists of Scriptures. We can masticate them; fondle them; recite them forwards and backwards; sleep with them; throw them at one another; send them as arrows to the hearts of our brothers; shove them in one another's faces and beat one another over our heads with them; paste them on our bumpers; write them on our foreheads; wear them around our necks; put them on our doorposts and lintels; yell them on the corners of busy intersections; tie one another up in them; boil, freeze, fry and smoke them . . . to little avail except heaping more judgement on ourselves.

18) I'm no longer so interested in playing intellectual masturbation games with the written text. I want to see the impact of the LIVING WORD on hearts and lives. My understanding of the historical record of Christ's walk along dusty paths is that He refused to play the pharisee's mental masturbation games with the written text, too.

19) Most all of us who are remotely serious about being Christians have had the experience of Holy Spirit highlighting a verse or phrase in a verse or maybe even a whole chapter--during our travail over this or that problem or need. Suddenly the text jumped out as though highlighted in neon and written specifically for us at that specific moment in our lives. Charismatics/Pentecostals are about little more than responding to such, tuning into such; walking in Dialogue with The Almighty, our Lord via such. Other modalities of communicating in that dialogue are just different in type or degree--but not ESSENTIALLY different.

20) In EACH CASE, THE ALMIGHTY LIVING GOD IS BREAKING THROUGH TO THE INDIVIDUAL IN THIS TIME SPACE DIMENSION WITH A VERY PERSONAL COMMUNICATION. That He is so eager to do it so often is a humbling mystery beyond calculation. That He so often does it about the tiniest priorities of our inner hearts told to no one is unfathomable. . . but indescribably glorious.

21) If you want to demonstrate fidelity to The Living Word, I suggest that you follow after a different pattern than that of the pharisees. I suggest you seek out a long walk and talk with The Father and ask Him anew to help you digest, integrate, be enlivened by THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE increasingly moment by moment through an ongoing dialogue with HIM. Yes, it can be scary becaue He rarely details our path more than a step or two ahead. And He requires our all--and ever deeper broader lengths of our ALL. But HE IS INFINITELY WORTH IT.

22) No, we can't manipulate him as even far too many Pentecostals/charismatics pretend to do. But we can have a vibrant, dynamic, tailor-made walk and dialogue with Him that is beyond compare. That's what He created us for. . . . for us to become as little children on Daddy's lap . . . to skip and run and play and turn summersaults with Him . . . to climb mountains and do great exploits with HIM.

23) Certainly The written Word is foundational--all shall be fulfilled to the nth degree. But we scarcely have any comprehension of it, much less fitting application of it apart from an ongoing, dynamic, alive Dialogue with THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE. I suspect you have known that at one point in time. I seems overdue for you to submit to the truth of it again and for the rest of your life. The Hound of Heaven can be relentless. Though He tends to allow us to define our limit of our relationship with Him. It's not His preference. It wounds His heart.

24) I'm not so interested in merely intellectually "talking about God's Word." I want to be a fitting living epistle demonstrating the vitality, spontaneity, LIFE--of walking hand in hand, listening keenly for His Still Small Voice. I fail Him miserably far too often. But amazingly He still uses my feeble efforts. I just can't imagine going back to the old way. I don't like eating sawdust. I prefer the meat of THE LIVING WORD INCARNATE conforming me to His Image by the Power of His Blood and Spirit in ongoing dialogue with Him and The Father by His Spirit.

25) Anyway--that's what I'll pray for, for you, too. Blessings,

130 posted on 09/17/2002 10:07:50 AM PDT by Quix
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To: Quix; Dataman
Blah blah blah, another long loooooooong post, not really interesting enough for me to read. I will just note two things:
  1. Not one Scripture dealt with, at all.
  2. This intense irony: "I haven't observed you folk speaking much about The Word that I know and Love," from one who STARTED the dialogue claiming (lying?) to have looked at pages with dozens and dozens of in-context Scripture citations and sniffing that there was nothing there.
"Tongues." I begin to see the appeal — for you. Your favorite organ.

Dan

133 posted on 09/17/2002 10:18:22 AM PDT by BibChr
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