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To: Catholicguy; Campion
I have found both of you to be very reasoned when discussing this situation, and I know that I am probably opening a can of worms, but when you have people on both sides of this issue (and I'm talking about conservative and traditional Catholics disagreeing, not Call to Action heretics), we're all in a bunch of deep do.

I believe that we must support the Pope because he is the Vicar of Christ. This doesn't mean that there are times when respectful and courteous disagreements can help focus the church in times of crisis such as now. But where doesn't it stop? I feel that many of the conservatives are now jumping on the anti-JPII bandwagon, and in essense have ended up on the side of our enemies.

I sincerely don't know where to go or what to do. I pray on this nearly daily, and feel drawn towards protecting the institution of the Church, including the Pope, while speaking out against the individuals who have committed crimes. And, I do believe in the basic Michael Rose premise that many of our problems have come from homosexual and liberal attitudes in our seminaries and that they need to be cleaned up. But I listened to an interview with Michael Rose on Steve Wood's program last week and even Rose said that many of the seminaries that had the worst problems in the 70s and 80s and being cleaned up and fixed.

So, this brings me back to my dilemma: how far do we go while remaining loyal to the Church and its teachings?

81 posted on 07/25/2002 1:25:04 PM PDT by Gophack
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To: Gophack
So, this brings me back to my dilemma: how far do we go while remaining loyal to the Church and its teachings?

Folks keep citing Paul withstanding Cephas to his face; Galatians 2:11 "But when Cephas was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was blameable." I didn't know that all those who were citing this "precedent" as liberty to oppose the Pope were, like Paul, A Bishop, an Apostle. I am happy to know we have so many Bishops in Freeperville.

"The fault that is here noted in the conduct of S. Peter, was only a certain imprudence, in withdrawing himself from the table of the Gentiles, for fear of giving ofence to the Jewish converts: but this in circumstances, when his doing so might be of il consquence tp the Gentiles, who might be induced thereby to think themselves obligd to conform to the Jewish way of living, to the prejudice of Christian living," is how my Douay explains the action of Paul

It happened ONCE, over a relatively inconsequential matter and it was done by a Bishop. Contrast that with the "Trads," layman all, who repeatdly, hundreds of times, thousands of times, day after relentless mind-numbing day, attack an Ecumenical council, the normative Mass, Papal Encyclicals, Canon Law, Univeral Catechism and Ecumenical activities.

There simply is NO justification for the actions of these Catholic quislings who routinely attack The Magisterium as though it were but the Campaign Party Platform of some Political Party - oh, I forgot, they do it as "loyal, Catholics."

Right

92 posted on 07/25/2002 2:46:53 PM PDT by Catholicguy
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