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To: Matchett-PI
If you believe that, would you like to explain how it is possible for God to maintain sovereignty over election yet not over reprobation?

I believe God is sovereign over both. I believe God determines both who will be saved and who will be lost, and He decideds how He will accomplish this, not Calvin, and He has chosen to make some of his created beings rational/volitions agents (for example, humans and angels) and as such, they are judged according to their choices within the limits of whatever ability the sovereign God has chosen to give them, and He uses that choice to determine who will be saved and who will be lost, and only those who limit God deny Him that power.

Since this is the clear Biblical teaching of how God operates, those who do not like it, and want to limit God to some pagan philosophical ideas of what God can and cannot do derived from Augustine by way of Calvin, Luther, Wesley, and others, need to be reminded God does not need to answer to Calvinists why He didn't use Calvin's scheme in dealing with men. Shall the thing formed say to Him that formed it, why hast Thou made me thus?

Hank

27 posted on 06/16/2002 4:32:54 PM PDT by Hank Kerchief
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To: Hank Kerchief
Shall the thing formed say to Him that formed it, why hast Thou made me thus?

The creation questioning the creator.I've been there.Not a good place to be. I wouldn't recommend anyone attemp it.

28 posted on 06/16/2002 4:46:46 PM PDT by Codie
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To: Hank Kerchief;OrthodoxPresbyterian; Jerry_M; CCWoody; the_doc; theAmbassador;JeanChauvin...
I wrote: "If you believe that, would you like to explain how it is possible for God to maintain sovereignty over election yet not over reprobation?"

You replied: "I believe God is sovereign over both. ... his created beings ... are judged according to their choices ... and He uses *that choice* to determine who will be saved and who will be lost and only those who limit God deny Him that power."

Do you give Him the sovereignty / power to elect some or all of the unborn who die in the womb, infants who die soon after birth, children who die at a young age, those who are born mentally retarded, those who become mentally incompetent (through accident or health problems) as adults?

Do you deny Him the sovereignty / power to elect such as those above who haven't "made a choice"?

For instance, are all unborn babies and other incompetents consigned to hell?

29 posted on 06/16/2002 8:03:34 PM PDT by Matchett-PI
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